Sunrail Commuter Rail System

[SkyDiveJunkee]

Were there renderings of the Disney and OCCC stations?

[jzquince69]

some more observations:

1. the position of CRT and HSR in the center should be reversed, otherwise they have to construct a rail bridge where the two lines otherwise would cross between the terminal and Taft.

2. the LRT could easily extend southward parallel to Boggy Creek Rd. and then use the easement of the coal train rail line that parallels 417 and go right into Medical City in Lake Nona. For that matter, the CRT could do it just the same and with less restrictions, since it will be locomotive and will already be going into the intermodal center.

3. the LRT proposed route: a golden opportunity exists here to get it down the center of SLR all the way to the Turnpike easement, follow it north to Prime & Universal, then due south along Universal Blvd and/or I-Drive to the OCCC. They have the easement already there... the Fla. Turnpike. That makes more sense than cuting through land north of the Shingle Creek resort and Southpark with no stops anyway just to end up at the OCCC HSR station. Am I smoking crack here?

4. HSR: Well, I've already said that the Tampa leg needs to extend to TPA to make sense. However, what makes more sense is that the terminus of the line at OIA should actually terminate at Port Canaveral. That's the 2nd busiest cruise port in the world behind Port of Miami. Most of the patrons fly in to OIA and take 528 to the port; Disney Cruise line is there; Royal Carribean; Carnival; etc... HSR would have so many riders packing those trains it would make heads spin. I'm assuming the future extension to Miami will go ala the Port, but I would focus on getting that line up and running sooner, b/c of all the $$$ they could make from ridership- OIA to the Port is huge ridership.

Also, the Port Canaveral leg would be true HSR, b/c there's nothing in between so the trains would reach top speed. the 528 easement is there already. there's nothing else there. all they need to do is build it- except for a couple of bridges the last few miles into Brevard. That would cost money.

[HeartofFlorida]

Originally Posted by SkyDiveJunkee

Were there renderings of the Disney and OCCC stations?

No. I'm sure they will be released soon.

[SkyDiveJunkee]

Very excited to see what Disney has in store for their station -- I wonder if they will focus any development around the station, if it is will be in an isolated location (as it currently is).

[alex7677]

Are all the colored lines in the Bay Area from the last map proposed rail lines?

[HeartofFlorida]

Originally Posted by alex7677

Are all the colored lines in the Bay Area from the last map proposed rail lines?

Yes they are.

[kevinkagy]

Originally Posted by jzquince69

4. HSR: Well, I've already said that the Tampa leg needs to extend to TPA to make sense. However, what makes more sense is that the terminus of the line at OIA should actually terminate at Port Canaveral. That's the 2nd busiest cruise port in the world behind Port of Miami. Most of the patrons fly in to OIA and take 528 to the port; Disney Cruise line is there; Royal Carribean; Carnival; etc... HSR would have so many riders packing those trains it would make heads spin. I'm assuming the future extension to Miami will go ala the Port, but I would focus on getting that line up and running sooner, b/c of all the $$$ they could make from ridership- OIA to the Port is huge ridership.

Just another reason to get the Miami HSR line built ASAP.

[SkyDiveJunkee]

I agree, the Port Canaveral extension should be an extension of Phase I.

[TampaMike]

Originally Posted by alex7677

Are all the colored lines in the Bay Area from the last map proposed rail lines?

Blue-Future Rapid Bus Transit
Purple-Proposed RBT/Approved if Referendum is passed
Yellow-Future Light Rail
Green-Proposed Light Rail/Approved if Referendum is passed*
Orange-Commuter Rail
Red-High Speed Rail

*Green would only include Tampa if passed, not St. Petersburg and Sarasota.

[jzquince69]

its pretty incredible when you think about it, that "when" these systems get built in Tampa and Orlando, it will create a pretty incredible super-region of transit.

In SoFla, if Broward built an LRT that went E-W or to the beaches, and PBCo did likewise (not that Lake Worth residents would approve), it would have a similar effect. I already see Miami metro as such ala how the expressways connect to the three primary airports there in the three counties. Imagine if rail transir in Broward and PBCo complimented that which is in Dade.

Back to CFLA, HSR would have to connect to TPA and St. Pete- but that bridge would cost $$$ over Tampa Bay. Right now, cost is dictating the route of much of these systems. In Orlando's case, its lucky the CRT/CSX lines already go thru the downtowns of many of the towns that make up the metro N-S.

[alex7677]

Originally Posted by jzquince69

Back to CFLA, HSR would have to connect to TPA and St. Pete- but that bridge would cost $$$ over Tampa Bay. Right now, cost is dictating the route of much of these systems. In Orlando's case, its lucky the CRT/CSX lines already go thru the downtowns of many of the towns that make up the metro N-S.

I've kept thinking that myself, The Orlando Area is very lucky that the Rail Line that already exists goes through main points, right through or very near every downtown along the line, and it goes right through Florida Hospital and right next to Orlando Health, and the Lynx Central Station. I don't think many people even know how big that is. They are usually the ones that think this will fail. It won't, when people realize what the Sunrail goes through. And we can't forget that many parts are already double tracked.

[jzquince69]

that's right about the double-tracking.

Even more so, the line that extends NW from around Robinson & Garland and goes behind the Downtown Marriott out to Apopka and then the Mount Dora area... that's the next line they look into routing the CRT I bet.

In NE Orlando, the Rails to Trails easement is still there. if they ever decided to rail it again (not without many protests I'm sure), they could get a line up to Oviedo too. But, I imagine from this point forward, I think the OOCEA will be directly involved in most all future routes as future CRT lines will probably utilize expressway authority easements. It only makes sense.

[SkyDiveJunkee]

Generally there is enough room along the Rails for Trails route to keep the trails while building lines on adjacent land. So you are right in that it's another great line along historic development patterns that should be utilized. No reason to take away the trails though. In fact, that would make the Rails for Trails route even more attractive if it also linked up to the SunRail stations.

[tampasteve]

Originally Posted by TampaMike

Blue-Future Rapid Bus Transit
Purple-Proposed RBT/Approved if Referendum is passed

Actually those are backwards. The N/S purple and E/W Purple are the approved BRT lines, and the N/S line will be open sometime in 2011 or early 2012. Blue is the proposed BRT lines if the referendum passes. Close though, and right on the rest!

Steve

[jzquince69]

Originally Posted by SkyDiveJunkee

Generally there is enough room along the Rails for Trails route to keep the trails while building lines on adjacent land. So you are right in that it's another great line along historic development patterns that should be utilized. No reason to take away the trails though. In fact, that would make the Rails for Trails route even more attractive if it also linked up to the SunRail stations.

I hope they are looking into that. b/c that was the first thing I thought which was what a wasted opportunity b/c they removed the rails along that easement. That would be a perfect line to build.

[TampaMike]

Originally Posted by tampasteve

Actually those are backwards. The N/S purple and E/W Purple are the approved BRT lines, and the N/S line will be open sometime in 2011 or early 2012. Blue is the proposed BRT lines if the referendum passes. Close though, and right on the rest!

Steve

True for Hillsborough, but the rest of the counties will have to wait when it comes to the blue lines. Pinellas should try to get a same type referendum on the 2012 ballot and I'm hoping Pasco can get a transit referendum on the ballot in 2016 to fund Bus Rapid Transit first and save up for light rail. Right now, Pasco plans to put the referendum on the ballot in 2022 which is too long to wait.

[tampasteve]

Originally Posted by TampaMike

True for Hillsborough, but the rest of the counties will have to wait when it comes to the blue lines. Pinellas should try to get a same type referendum on the 2012 ballot and I'm hoping Pasco can get a transit referendum on the ballot in 2016 to fund Bus Rapid Transit first and save up for light rail. Right now, Pasco plans to put the referendum on the ballot in 2022 which is too long to wait.

Exactly, great points.

Steve

[Jahi98]

From what I've read, Pinellas is already considering a 2012 referendum. I wish it were happening this year, but I think leaders in Pinellas are looking to Hillsborough to lead the way on this one. We really need Hillsborough to pass their 2010 referendum.

Back to Sunrail, what's the latest news? Do we know when construction will officially begin?

I might've missed it this from an earlier post...

[jzquince69]

I think construction begins this Fall/Winter for the CRT Sunrail.


we might as well discuss all these systems here since they will all interconnect down the road.

Well, for certain, we know the timetable for the following systems overall:

1. HSR- 2015
2. Sunrail Phase I- 2013
3. Sunrail Phase II- 2015
4. other... there's so much other... even future Lymmo lines in Orlando (RBT) downtown and that Maglev/LRT talk for the Sand Lake corridor, and future CRT extensions in CFLA.

What is the next plan in the Bay area for rail or RBT? Sunrail got funding approval in 2010 and Phase I will/should open in 2013, which is the next rail project for the state to begin service. I'm confused on the ballot and referrendum talk etc.; can someone give a synopsis again?

[tampasteve]

Originally Posted by jzquince69

I think construction begins this Fall/Winter for the CRT Sunrail.


we might as well discuss all these systems here since they will all interconnect down the road.

Well, for certain, we know the timetable for the following systems overall:

1. HSR- 2015
2. Sunrail Phase I- 2013
3. Sunrail Phase II- 2015
4. other... there's so much other... even future Lymmo lines in Orlando (RBT) downtown and that Maglev/LRT talk for the Sand Lake corridor, and future CRT extensions in CFLA.

Thanks for those updates, it is nice to see them together.

What is the next plan in the Bay area for rail or RBT?

The TECO Streetcar extension is under construction right now and should be completed and open in December of this year (2010). This adds 1/3 mile to the system but brings the line directly into the DT business core. It also connects the line to a very large parking garage and the station will be the largest in the system, able to accommodate up to three cars at one time. The extension will be single track with a siding at the station to accommodate more cars. One new street car is also being purchased this year, the model is unknown, but it is likely going to be another Gomaco replica.

The N/S BRT (RBT) line is branded MetroRapid and will commence service sometime next year (2011), likely late summer.

The E/W BRT line is still waiting for full funding but if it goes on schedule it should be running late 2012.

The N/S and/or E/W LRT should commence construction in mid 2012 and be running about 2 years later, if everything goes on schedule and the referendum passes.

I'm confused on the ballot and referrendum talk etc.; can someone give a synopsis again?

Hillsborough County voted a few weeks ago to place a referendum on the ballot for 2010 in order to raise a 1% sales tax for transit improvements including bus, rail, bicycle, and road. 75% would go exclusivly to mass transit projects and the remainder would go to road/bike projects. The exact LR lines that would be funded have not been decided on yet, but they should be firmed up by late May or June. Whatever the case they will be decided before the vote. Below is the exact ballot wording that will be at vote:

Shall transportation improvements throughout Hillsborough County, Tampa, Temple Terrace and Plant City be funded by levying a one percent transportation sales surtax from January 1, 2011 until repealed, deposited into a dedicated trust fund, all spending reviewed by an independent oversight committee of citizens and experts, with 75 percent spent on transit, including local rail and an expanded bus system for express, local and neighborhood service, and 25 percent spent on improving roads and other transportation projects?

N/S Alignments being looked at:
http://www.gohartaa.org/pdfs/northeast_corridor.pdf

E/W Alignments being looked at:
http://www.gohartaa.org/pdfs/west_corridor.pdf


Steve