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Old April 13th, 2010, 05:28 AM   #61
HollyBlack
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Labour Manifesto released today:
"Built in stages, the initial line will link London to Birmingham, Manchester, the East Midlands, Sheffield and Leeds, and then to the North and Scotland"
"By running through-trains from day one, cities including Glasgow, Edinburgh, Newcastle and Liverpool will also be part of the initial network." ... .
But Lime Street does not have platforms long enough to accept the trains.
The train will have to stop short at Edge Hill.

One possibility would be to split the train at Edge Hill and allow only half of it (200m.) to continue to Lime Street.
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Old April 13th, 2010, 12:41 PM   #62
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But Lime Street does not have platforms long enough to accept the trains.
The train will have to stop short at Edge Hill.

One possibility would be to split the train at Edge Hill and allow only half of it (200m.) to continue to Lime Street.
The rock behind can be cut back. Not a show stopper.
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Old April 13th, 2010, 12:50 PM   #63
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There isn't any money allocated to this project in the next parliament so I guess there's all to play for.

I shall start believing that it has a chance of seeing the light of day when/if it gets through the assorted planning inquiries it will face.
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Old April 13th, 2010, 12:56 PM   #64
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There isn't any money allocated to this project in the next parliament so I guess there's all to play for.

I shall start believing that it has a chance of seeing the light of day when/if it gets through the assorted planning inquiries it will face.
They have to finalize a route first. Even if there was money for it, it would not get started in the next parliament.

Maglev is the way. If a new line then make it Maglev and go for the best. Maglev is successful in other countries. It makes lots of sense on brand new lines, which HSR is.

Last edited by TommyMogan; April 13th, 2010 at 06:38 PM.
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Old April 13th, 2010, 05:18 PM   #65
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They have to finalize a route first. Even if there was money for it, it would not get started in the next parliament.

Maglev is the way. If a new line them make it Maglev and go for the best.
I couldnīt agree more about the Maglev thing. No idea if it is possible. High speed rail for all its benefits would appear to be a late 20th century technology. Anyone get me up to speed on why Maglev couldnīt be considered? Is it just pie in the sky?
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Old April 13th, 2010, 05:53 PM   #66
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I couldnīt agree more about the Maglev thing. No idea if it is possible. High speed rail for all its benefits would appear to be a late 20th century technology. Anyone get me up to speed on why Maglev couldnīt be considered? Is it just pie in the sky?
Because it is a piece of hugely expensive shit which is 100% isolated from other types of rail vehicle - hence why no country's have adopted it on any kind of scale.
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Old April 14th, 2010, 11:37 AM   #67
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Yes. but the same could have been said about the railways when they were built 180 years ago. Is the technology not up to long distances for example? Is it just a cost thing? Will Maglev ever be cheap enough for long distance travel? Just asking, like.
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Old April 14th, 2010, 11:48 AM   #68
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But 180 years ago the country was not as densely built up and populated. 'Normal' high speed rail can use classic lines to penetrate city centres whereas Maglev is 100% isolated and can't get into city centres without huge cost.

The technology is there, but cost is the problem. The Shanghai system cost just under Ģ1 billion to build for 20 miles of track, associated infrastructure and trains. It is expected to never cover its build costs over its lifetime, let alone ongoing costs such as maintenance and staffing.
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Old April 14th, 2010, 12:21 PM   #69
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But 180 years ago the country was not as densely built up and populated. 'Normal' high speed rail can use classic lines to penetrate city centres whereas Maglev is 100% isolated and can't get into city centres without huge cost.

The technology is there, but cost is the problem. The Shanghai system cost just under Ģ1 billion to build for 20 miles of track, associated infrastructure and trains. It is expected to never cover its build costs over its lifetime, let alone ongoing costs such as maintenance and staffing.
HSR is having new lines, which is no different to laying Maglev line but Maglev is cheaper.
  • Maglev lines scan be long concrete pre-cast forms than can be on elevated pillars across fields.
  • Cheap and quick to do, as less land to buy.
  • Cows can still go under the lines, so few interruptions or bridges needed.
  • Maglevs can be over existing urban lines in built up areas to penetrate city centres. Again cheap to do.
  • The trains last far longer as no moving parts.
  • They are quieter and smoother.
  • Track maintenance is cheaper.
  • Train maintenance is cheaper.
  • Track laying is cheaper.
  • Maglevs are far quicker than rails.
Those who are against Maglev tend have a vested interest in existing outdated technology. The same with trams.
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Old April 14th, 2010, 12:44 PM   #70
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As usual, he has no idea what he is talking about and just trolling, so back onto ignore for him
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Old April 14th, 2010, 01:29 PM   #71
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[*]Cows can still go under the lines, so few interruptions or bridges needed.
Fantastic. I'm on board, so to speak.

I'm with ML - back to ignore John you loathesome troll.
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Old April 14th, 2010, 01:34 PM   #72
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As usual, he has no idea what he is talking about and just trolling, so back onto ignore for him
An answer of no substance. In other words I am right as you cannot counter the points. Keep lurking .... and learn.
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Old April 14th, 2010, 01:38 PM   #73
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Can't hear you John.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 01:44 PM   #74
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Another from Ellman.

Here she advocates Liverpools rail connection via a stop to the High Speed line at Manc, 'LOUISE ELLMAN MP, defending her Liverpool Riverside seat and former chairman of the Parliamentary chairman of the Select Committee on Transport, believes the High Speed Rail Link is important to Liverpool – even though it goes to Manchester'.

http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/...34-26293098/2/
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Isnt it time they closed this white Elephant and stop wasting money
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Old May 4th, 2010, 02:31 PM   #75
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What a great MP she is for Manchester, can she please be voted out at this election.

Could you imagine a Manchester MP saying the same, its gone beyond the ridiculous in this city, I hold most of our so called representatives with complete contempt.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 02:56 PM   #76
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I'm not in riverside, but I hope that those of you who are aren't hanging on to silly party loyalties and voting for her.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 06:36 PM   #77
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I'm not in riverside, but I hope that those of you who are aren't hanging on to silly party loyalties and voting for her.
I'm pretty sure those on here who live in Riverside have already posted that they will be voting for Ellman.

She must be good on all the big issues like making sure there's no white dog shit outside apartments.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 07:21 PM   #78
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Another from Ellman.
Here she advocates Liverpools rail connection via a stop to the High Speed line at Manc, 'LOUISE ELLMAN MP, defending her Liverpool Riverside seat and former chairman of the Parliamentary chairman of the Select Committee on Transport, believes the High Speed Rail Link is important to Liverpool – even though it goes to Manchester'. ...
If HSR2 stops at Manchester Airport, rather than Manchester city centre, then it makes sense to run through trains on substantially legacy rail technology from there.
And even though there is talk of taking HSR right into Manchester city centre I am inclined to think that will change when the times comes.

To me it makes economic and engineering sense to have at most two intermediate stops on HSR2.
Thus, stops would be at London (Old Oak Common) - Birmingham (International and airport) - Manchester (Airport) - Glasgow or Edinburgh. With all other places (e.g. Euston, Heathrow and city centres of Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds and even Newcastle) served by Eurostar-like trains that complete most of the journey on HSR but are equipped to run on legacy lines near the journey endpoints. Not so very different from the former service into London Waterloo station.

That would be fine for Liverpool, it is not realistic to hope for HSR right into the city. The biggest issue is platform lengths if international through trains from Europe are to be allowed.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 08:14 PM   #79
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Quote:
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I'm not in riverside, but I hope that those of you who are aren't hanging on to silly party loyalties and voting for her.
Quote:
I'm pretty sure those on here who live in Riverside have already posted that they will be voting for Ellman.

She must be good on all the big issues like making sure there's no white dog shit outside apartments.
Thanks for your input and advice but I will vote for who I consider to be best for, in no particular order, me, Riverside, Liverpool and UK. I will make my decision based on the calibre of candidate, their and their parties' agendas. I will furthermore base my decision at a local level using a similar process. And at this stage, I will be supporting different parties at local and national level.

Before you go casting aspersions at those who live in City centre flats who have nothing to worry about beyond turds on their front step, which would be dealt with at a local level anyway, it also may have escaped your notice that LR also encompasses Toxteth, Edge Hill, Aigburth, Vauxhall and Kirkdale.

I am not affiliated to any party and, as such, have no loyalties to any of them and have voted for 5 different political parties at Local, National and European elections in the past.

And bizarrely I was able to do so without the advice or interference of SSC forumers.
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Old May 5th, 2010, 12:09 AM   #80
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If HSR2 stops at Manchester Airport, rather than Manchester city centre, then it makes sense to run through trains on substantially legacy rail technology from there.
And even though there is talk of taking HSR right into Manchester city centre I am inclined to think that will change when the times comes.
Surely it doesn't matter to Liverpool either way where the trains actually terminate at the Manchester end? To get into central Manchester via new or legacy tracks the new line will have to come near to MAN. Whether that is the limit to new track or not it's still a sensible place to branch off to Liverpool.
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