Bellevue Light Rail/East Link thread

[BellevueBoy]

Another blog against the horrible vision line proposal:
http://seattletransitblog.com/2010/0...ss-accessible/

[alexjonlin]

RMacherat, Bellevue certainly needs it. Have you been to Bellevue Transit Center at rush hour? It's a mobscene. ST's two highest ridership routes (550 and 545) go along East Link's route. They both already come very frequently at rush hour but they're still packed. By the time East Link finally opens in 2020 and transit ridership is even higher, it'll be very well used.

[CrazyAboutCities]

Originally Posted by BellevueGuy

I think majority of the people in Bellevue (myself included) appreciated what Freeman has done to Bellevue. Without his vision (saved Lincoln Square while it's foreclosed) and money and his mall, Bellevue is likely just another suburb.

Pro-transit guys like me think he is rather "stuck in the past" in his diligent opposition of public transit, but as Backstrom pointed out, transit is not the only mandate of a good city government (and of a good wealthy powerful Bellevue citizen).

For example, Freeman donated a piece of land worthy tens of millions and donated some millions more dollars for the Performing Arts Center Eastside and I think that's quite generous.

I appreciate what he have been done to Bellevue too. I just disappointed with his attitude toward to Link. Obviously, he is not an easy person to be persuaded that public transit is good for the City of Bellevue and his properties. Someone needs to shake him up and make him realize that public transit is one of best things will happen to Bellevue and his properties.

[bgwah]

Too bad there isn't an elevated rendering just to compare...

[Subterranean Alien]

I've always disliked the Freemans, this give me extra reason to dislike 'em...

Originally Posted by 8ball

It's clear Bellevue (aka Kemper) doesn't want light rail. I think West Seattle should get it first. Maybe when Eastside residents get sick of sitting on I90/520 in traffic they'll vote in a decent city council.

The story of the Freeman's and how they got all that land in Bellevue is an eye opener if you haven't heard it.

http://eatthestate.org/02-22/SelfMadeBigot.htm

[BellevueBoy]

Kevin Wallace hiring lobbyists to promote his vision line:
http://seattletransitblog.com/2010/0...ote-alignment/

[HAWC1506]

Bellevue take note.

Video coverage with CCTV footage (and lawsuits...): http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/...iref=allsearch

Officials: 9 injured after Metro bus collides with light rail train

HOUSTON -- Several passengers were injured Monday after a Metro light rail train collided with a Metro bus and derailed in downtown Houston.

The driver of the bus was headed west on St. Joseph Parkway when he ran a red light and collided with a train headed north on Main Street at about 3:30 p.m., investigators said.

"It was just horrible," said light rail passenger Maria Garza. "At the moment I didn’t know what to think. It was just something that happened really fast. It just took me by surprise."

The Metro bus driver and eight passengers were transported to area hospitals, officials said.

"I just fell back and didn’t say anything," said Bill Davis, a seventh-grade student who was taking the train home from school.

"I was just having flashbacks," he said. "It’s just like having your life flash in front of you."

Rush-hour traffic was disrupted as Metro crews worked to get the train back on track.

Investigators said there was a camera on board the train, and the accident was likely caught on tape. Metro will use that video as it investigates the accident.

The light rail service was expected to be running normally by Tuesday morning.

Source: http://www.khou.com/home/-Passengers...-83834257.html

[alexjonlin]

That's Houston, they have a ridiculous number of accidents. They put their light rail at-grade on a very crowded street, it's kind of stupid. I'm not a fan of at-grade in downtown Bellevue but it's going to be better than Houston.

[kub86]

Originally Posted by BellevueBoy

Kevin Wallace hiring lobbyists to promote his vision line:
http://seattletransitblog.com/2010/0...ote-alignment/

Bellevue take note.

Video coverage with CCTV footage (and lawsuits...): http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/...iref=allsearch

Officials: 9 injured after Metro bus collides with light rail train

Sad and even more sad.

I'm not a fan of the vision line nor the surface route. But considering the tunnel's chances of being built, I'm kind of indifferent between the vision or surface routes now.

Vision line: Fully grade separated (I think?), faster, and more reliable. But hella far from downtown by hiking up a hill and 3 mega blocks.

Surface route: Central location that's within easy walking distance of everything downtown...but slower since cars will have stoplight priority, and the chances of accidents between trains, cars, and pedestrians make reliability more uncertain.

[HAWC1506]

Originally Posted by alexjonlin

That's Houston, they have a ridiculous number of accidents. They put their light rail at-grade on a very crowded street, it's kind of stupid. I'm not a fan of at-grade in downtown Bellevue but it's going to be better than Houston.

But do realize that this wasn't caused by a systematic error. It wasn't the design that caused the accident but rather a human error that was magnified by the design.

Theoretically, this accident shouldn't have happened (much like how we are expecting the surface route to operate in Bellevue). But humans do make errors. It's inevitable. The best thing we can do is to create an environment where human error will not be magnified like in this collision, and the only way to do that is to grade-separate rail.

Originally Posted by kub86

Surface route: Central location that's within easy walking distance of everything downtown...but slower since cars will have stoplight priority, and the chances of accidents between trains, cars, and pedestrians make reliability more uncertain.

Exactly. The surface route will essentially be putting all your eggs in one basket. Bellevue would be putting all forms of available transportation in that one intersection (Light rail, buses, cars, and pedestrians). If something goes wrong in that intersection, then the whole intersection shuts down, and along with it all the transportation modes will be affected.

If light rail is in the tunnel, the chances of a bus-pedestrian collision affecting light rail traffic is likely zero. On the other hand, if there is a bus-pedestrian collision at the transit center, you'll likely be left with a significant delay in the entire area.

What I think Sound Transit needs to do is to evaluate the probability of accidents happening in the intersection and the effects it will have on all modes of transportation. They should present with more detail, rather than just stating that "Light Rail service will be dependent on traffic conditions."

[rathersmart]

Originally Posted by HAWC1506

But do realize that this wasn't caused by a systematic error. It wasn't the design that caused the accident but rather a human error that was magnified by the design.

Theoretically, this accident shouldn't have happened (much like how we are expecting the surface route to operate in Bellevue). But humans do make errors. It's inevitable. The best thing we can do is to create an environment where human error will not be magnified like in this collision, and the only way to do that is to grade-separate rail.



Exactly. The surface route will essentially be putting all your eggs in one basket. Bellevue would be putting all forms of available transportation in that one intersection (Light rail, buses, cars, and pedestrians). If something goes wrong in that intersection, then the whole intersection shuts down, and along with it all the transportation modes will be affected.

If light rail is in the tunnel, the chances of a bus-pedestrian collision affecting light rail traffic is likely zero. On the other hand, if there is a bus-pedestrian collision at the transit center, you'll likely be left with a significant delay in the entire area.

What I think Sound Transit needs to do is to evaluate the probability of accidents happening in the intersection and the effects it will have on all modes of transportation. They should present with more detail, rather than just stating that "Light Rail service will be dependent on traffic conditions."

i disagree.

should we stick you in a bubble so you don't get sick and take away your driver's license because at any given moment your mistake can be magnified by a semi running you over with its trailer when you didn't see it next to you?

nope

[alexjonlin]

Originally Posted by rathersmart

i disagree.

should we stick you in a bubble so you don't get sick and take away your driver's license because at any given moment your mistake can be magnified by a semi running you over with its trailer when you didn't see it next to you?

nope

Wow. That has nothing to do with anything. He was suggesting studying more to see how many accidents there would be that would cause major delays for the 50,000 expected riders of East Link.

[RMacherat]

Driver was probably texting. No app to prevent that yet.

[urbanlife78]

I would assume that the lights would be timed so that it would make it easier for light rail to move from station to station...accidents are always a risk, but I dont think they are as big of an issue as one would think, but then again, I do not have the numbers to back up such a claim so I could be totally wrong with that...Just an observation of how our new at grade line works through downtown Portland with buses, light rail, pedestrians, bikes, and cars.

[BellevueGuy]

Originally Posted by kub86

Surface route: Central location that's within easy walking distance of everything downtown...but slower since cars will have stoplight priority, and the chances of accidents between trains, cars, and pedestrians make reliability more uncertain.

Where did you get this impression?

I am 90% cetain that trains will have higher priority.

[BellevueGuy]

Originally Posted by HAWC1506

The driver of the bus was headed west on St. Joseph Parkway when he ran a red light and collided with a train headed north on Main Street at about 3:30 p.m., investigators said.

A bus running red light?

God.... I am just glad he didn't take out two other cars and kill some more in the same time... what an idiot...

Imagine a huge bus coming in your way...

[CityView Jim]

Originally Posted by BellevueGuy

A bus running red light?

God.... I am just glad he didn't take out two other cars and kill some more in the same time... what an idiot...

Imagine a huge bus coming in your way...

Agreed. I don't know if the added expense for grade separation is warranted to prevent freak accidents. We had to go all the way to Houston to find one?! For the most part, accidents are just that and unintentional. Maybe we should keep busses off our freeways too. You just never know! LOL

[rathersmart]

Originally Posted by alexjonlin

Wow. That has nothing to do with anything. He was suggesting studying more to see how many accidents there would be that would cause major delays for the 50,000 expected riders of East Link.

it has everything to do with it.

Originally Posted by HAWC1506

But humans do make errors. It's inevitable. The best thing we can do is to create an environment where human error will not be magnified like in this collision, and the only way to do that is to grade-separate rail.

he is suggesting we take away from something in order to make EVERYONE safe.

[rathersmart]

Originally Posted by CityView Jim

Agreed. I don't know if the added expense for grade separation is warranted to prevent freak accidents. We had to go all the way to Houston to find one?! For the most part, accidents are just that and unintentional. Maybe we should keep busses off our freeways too. You just never know! LOL

exactly!

[CityView Jim]

Originally Posted by rathersmart

it has everything to do with it.



he is suggesting we take away from something in order to make EVERYONE safe.

Yes, lets put traffic lights at every single intersection. That'll stop accidents from happening!!