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Old June 20th, 2009, 11:57 AM   #1
DELCROID
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Trinidad Rapid Rail Transit System | Port of Spain - Sangre Grande - San Fernando | 17 stations | 98 km | Pro

Hi,



I have a question:




I understand there is a railway project for Trinidad known as "Trinitrain" or "Trinidad Rapid Rail System" due to begin construction in 2010. This is a summary of the project:



"....Project

On April 11 2008 the TriniTrain consortium of Alstom Transport SA, Alstom T&T Ltd, Bouygues Construction and RATP Développement announced it had been selected by the government to plan and build two new passenger railway lines in Trinidad.[1] WSP is advising the government on the routes.[2]

In a meeting with Prime Minister Patrick Manning on 28 April 2009, Minister of Works & Transport, Colm Imbert said construction of the Trinidad Rapid Railway would commence in mid-2010, with the first train rolling out of the capital city approximately 36 to 39 months later[3] as detailed by the National Infrastructure Development Company Limited (NIDCO).[4]...."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinidad_Rapid_Railway




This is some of the proposed rolling material for Trinitrain - Coradia Duplex (passanger doubledecker wagons) by Alstom Germany:




http://wsp-pmctt.com


Such trains are designed for regional and long distance travel and can actually travel at speeds up to 220 kmh.






My question is then about the gauge it will use. What measurement will it have?. For example all railway and subway systems in Venezuela use the same: Standard Gauge (1.435 mm or 4´8 1/2")
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_gauge







Will Trinitrain use the same standard?????...if so, could there be any interest for Trinidad to eventually link its future railway system to continental South America: Venezuela, Mercosur, Andean countries, the Pacific Basin, etc.. ????? ...perhaps via trainferry ????...could it be cost-effective ? ...

A train-ferry:




Proximity to continental main land:


Some notes:


"......On 2008-08-23, a deal was signed between Argentina, Brazil and Venezuela to develop an electrified long distance railway link between these countries. A minor hurdle is the use of both 50 Hz and 60 Hz....." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Brazil


"....
A July 5 meeting between Venezuela, Colombia and Ecuador regarding a railway for freight and passengers to link the three countries, and the Pacific ocean with the Atlantic ocean was held.[4]...." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Colombia



Here is a short intro to venezuelan railway projects u/c:







More info: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=833902
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HELP SAVE CATATUMBO MARSHLANDS - VENEZUELA: NATURE´S OWN OZONE FACTORY, MORE THAN A MILLION LIGHTNINGS PER YEAR PRODUCING 10% OF THE WORLD´S OZONE
AYUDA A SALVAR A LAS CIÉNAGAS DEL CATATUMBO EN VENEZUELA: LA FABRICA DE OZONO DE LA MADRE NATURALEZA, MAS DE UN MILLÓN DE RELÁMPAGOS AL AÑO PRODUCIENDO 10% DEL OZONO DEL PLANETA

Last edited by DELCROID; July 9th, 2009 at 01:56 PM.
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Old October 5th, 2009, 10:16 PM   #2
Trini1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DELCROID View Post
Hi,



I have a question:




I understand there is a railway project for Trinidad known as "Trinitrain" or "Trinidad Rapid Rail System" due to begin construction in 2010. This is a summary of the project:



"....Project

On April 11 2008 the TriniTrain consortium of Alstom Transport SA, Alstom T&T Ltd, Bouygues Construction and RATP Développement announced it had been selected by the government to plan and build two new passenger railway lines in Trinidad.[1] WSP is advising the government on the routes.[2]

In a meeting with Prime Minister Patrick Manning on 28 April 2009, Minister of Works & Transport, Colm Imbert said construction of the Trinidad Rapid Railway would commence in mid-2010, with the first train rolling out of the capital city approximately 36 to 39 months later[3] as detailed by the National Infrastructure Development Company Limited (NIDCO).[4]...."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinidad_Rapid_Railway




This is some of the proposed rolling material for Trinitrain - Coradia Duplex (passanger doubledecker wagons) by Alstom Germany:




http://wsp-pmctt.com


Such trains are designed for regional and long distance travel and can actually travel at speeds up to 220 kmh.






My question is then about the gauge it will use. What measurement will it have?. For example all railway and subway systems in Venezuela use the same: Standard Gauge (1.435 mm or 4´8 1/2")
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_gauge







Will Trinitrain use the same standard?????...if so, could there be any interest for Trinidad to eventually link its future railway system to continental South America: Venezuela, Mercosur, Andean countries, the Pacific Basin, etc.. ????? ...perhaps via trainferry ????...could it be cost-effective ? ...

A train-ferry:




Proximity to continental main land:


Some notes:


"......On 2008-08-23, a deal was signed between Argentina, Brazil and Venezuela to develop an electrified long distance railway link between these countries. A minor hurdle is the use of both 50 Hz and 60 Hz....." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Brazil


"....
A July 5 meeting between Venezuela, Colombia and Ecuador regarding a railway for freight and passengers to link the three countries, and the Pacific ocean with the Atlantic ocean was held.[4]...." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Colombia



Here is a short intro to venezuelan railway projects u/c:







More info: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=833902
Wouldn't it make more sense if the two governments of Trinidad and Tobago and Venezuela collaborated a mega project in the construction of a rail & freeway bridge/high speed rail bridge instead of the train ferry.
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Old October 8th, 2009, 06:55 PM   #3
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I agree with such an idea but perhaps it could be easier to begin with a ferry service. A mega-bridge could be much more costly and difficult to build. But at a very long-term it is probably the best bet.
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HELP SAVE CATATUMBO MARSHLANDS - VENEZUELA: NATURE´S OWN OZONE FACTORY, MORE THAN A MILLION LIGHTNINGS PER YEAR PRODUCING 10% OF THE WORLD´S OZONE
AYUDA A SALVAR A LAS CIÉNAGAS DEL CATATUMBO EN VENEZUELA: LA FABRICA DE OZONO DE LA MADRE NATURALEZA, MAS DE UN MILLÓN DE RELÁMPAGOS AL AÑO PRODUCIENDO 10% DEL OZONO DEL PLANETA
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Old February 7th, 2010, 09:39 PM   #4
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Trinidad Rapid Rail Transit System | Port of Spain - Sangre Grande - San Fernando | 17 stations | 98 km | Pro

This thread is for updates on the rapid rail system in trinidad & tobago.
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Old February 15th, 2010, 04:53 PM   #5
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TriniTrain | Offical Thread

I've been doing some research and wanted to share it with everyone here.

TriniTrain


Where will the trains run?

East to West: Sangre Grande, O’Meara Road (Arima), Maloney, Golden Grove Road (Piarco), Trincity Mall, Tunapuna, Grand Bazaar, El Socorro, City Gate (Port-of-Spain), City Port (Port-of-Spain), Stone Street (Woodbrook), Hasely Crawford Stadium, West Mall.

South to North: San Fernando, Bonne Aventure, Hill Road, Chaguanas, Endeavour, Ramarattan Trace (north of Caroni River), Grand Bazaar.


Arguments for and against the Government’s proposed rapid rail have been gathering steam during the past six months, but Works and Transport Minister Colm Imbert is steadfast in his position that the $7 billion project has the potential to alleviate the country’s tremendous traffic woes.

Critics have questioned both feasibility of the project and the procurement process.

Questions of governance have arisen with regard to procurement transparency.

During a Chamber breakfast meeting in January, Minister Imbert described the contract for the rail as a “design-build-operate-and maintain agreement” and said Government will be using a qualifications-based procurement process.

“The successful contractor who gets the construction contract must also operate and maintain the system in accordance with agreed criteria,” says the Minister, “we are going to select a contractor based on their qualifications. You have to qualify the person first to determine their capability.” Mr. Imbert says the first contractor will complete the project’s design and planning.

Government will agree on the basic cost of railway cars, stations, and rail tracks with this contractor.

“If we cannot agree on a maximum fixed price with that preferred contractor, if we can’t get value for money, it is possible that the preferred bidder may get the design contract and may not get the construction contract,” Minister Imbert says. Two consortia remain in the bidding war for the rapid rail: the Trinitrain consortium, led by Bouygues Travaux Publics, and the T-3 Group, led by Vinci Construction and Bombardier.

Minister Imbert says a contract will be awarded for the design and planning phase of the project by February 2007.

However, despite the Minister’s assurances, the Joint Consultative Council for the local construction industry (JCC) believes the procurement process for the project is flawed.

JCC President Winston Riley believes a feasibility study must be undertaken, to address questions of transparency.

Mr. Riley has also objected to the qualifications-based procurement process used for the design-build project contract, saying that the process does not allow for competition on price and does not meet the value for money principle.

Minister Imbert has repeatedly denied this claim. He says the Government will simply determine the best qualified tenderers and then check the price they offer to the international market.

He also notes that the design-build process is standard in T&T, particularly in the energy sector. “In the oil and gas sector the Government has been using the design-build process for the past 100 years,” Minister Imbert says, “The qualifications based system is also used when we have Inter-American Bank financed programmes.” The Chamber’s President Ian Welch lent his support to the rapid rail service, observing that traffic congestion is negatively affecting the country’s productivity.

Mr. Welch says T&T has the highest level of traffic in the region: ”Traffic congestion is a clear symbol of the systemic decline of a country’s infrastructural readiness to meet new and even existing demand. The Government therefore has no choice but to provide mass transportation choices for citizens.” According to Chamber research, adds Mr. Welch, the rapid rail system would be able to compete with automobiles in terms of travel time, and the service will improve access to schools, jobs and hospitals for the elderly, young and disabled.

Minister Imbert cites public transportation studies supporting the rail’s implementation, going as far back as the 1967 National Transportation Plan for Trinidad and Tobago.

A study by consultants Cansult in 1996 also justified a rapid rail system, he says.

Cansult found the peak hour peak direction person trips (phpdt) along the East-West corridor was 21,000 and predicted an increase to 28,000 by 2015. However, a 2006 update by Cansult found that phpdt had increased to 30,000 by 2007, notes Minister Imbert.

In other words, phpdt has increased at almost five times the rate predicted in 1996.

”We are now at three times the international traffic benchmark, beyond which a railway should be introduced,” says Mr. Imbert.

The rapid rail will be the largest capital investment ever undertaken by a T&T Government.

http://www.contact-tt.com/index.cfm?Content=305

============================================================

The design-build-maintain process is the best approach to building these systems. I'm so proud T&T is taking all the right steps, and we'll hit some walls along the way, but ultimately I know T&T is going to do a great job at meeting the transportation needs of all its residents. The benefits will include better interconnectivity between cities, reduced pollution from automobiles, shortening of route distances between cities, more efficient and cost-effective transportation and a more healthier society for all. I can't wait!
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Old February 15th, 2010, 04:58 PM   #6
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Farmers resist relocation as...


Farmers from Aranguez, Curepe and Cunupia whose fields are earmarked for the proposed new rail lines, have begun mobilising to resist any plan to take away their holdings. “We are not going to give up one inch of land,” Norris Deonarine of the National Foodcrop Farmers Association (NFFA) vowed last week. From as early as September last year, affected farmers and residents began receiving letters from the National Infrastructure Development Company (Nidco) informing of Government’s plan to gather information about land ownership. One letter, dated September 30, 2009, from Sean McDonnell, project manager of the Trinidad Rapid Rail Project (TRRP) to a Cunupia farmer stated: “The Government has retained the TriniTrain Consortium to undertake planning and preliminary works for the TRRP. “The TRRP is being implemented by Nidco on behalf of the Works Ministry. “As part of the planning works, it is necessary to identify the current owners of land parcels along and adjacent to the proposed route and to obtain some land parcel identification information from them. “ROW Services, a TriniTrain sub-contractor, is charged with gathering this information.”


The Government has, thus far, kept the cost of the rail project to itself but the Association of Professional Engineers APETT has estimated it at “tens of billions of dollars.” More conservative estimates are between $9 billion and $15 billion. Deonarine said there had been a call from Agriculture Minister Arnold Piggott to farmers to increase production. “And we have done so. A number of young people have gone into agriculture because of the apparent encouragement from the Government. “Now, you have another ministry coming to take agricultural land for projects. “If they intend to pass through farmers’ lands, we are calling on the Government to decide which is more important to T&T right now, food or rail. “We want to see development but not at the expense of destroying farmers’ livelihoods.” Deonarine said the question of compensation to hundreds of residents and farmers remains unanswered. “Is the Government prepared to fork out millions of dollars in compensation to all who will be displaced by the rail?”


==========================================

Hurdles like this are encountered all the time and we have to face the facts. Trinitrain is for the better good of all, so we're not going to let a few farmers decide whether or not the country will benefit from a mass transit system. Plus, the train tracks may occupy a significant portion of their land, but not all of it. Why are they fighting if they may one day enjoy the benefits of the train... But don't worry, this happens everywhere and everytime a train system is getting built.
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Old February 16th, 2010, 02:40 PM   #7
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It has horrible traffic, because the highway network is horrible
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Old February 17th, 2010, 06:45 PM   #8
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Thank you for filling us in Davsot. I am in full support of this project we really need it! However i must agree with Bori. The highway systems are terrible and contribute to the immense traffic problem. You cannot have traffic lights on a major highway it defeats the object lol. Once they get rid of this- traffic will be REDUCED and an alternative method of transport (especially along the east-west corridor) like this proposed train system wll kill it off in my view.
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Old March 24th, 2010, 03:53 AM   #9
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is this the same as the TriniTrain?
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Old March 24th, 2010, 01:08 PM   #10
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Yes I believe so.
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Old March 24th, 2010, 02:46 PM   #11
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I have already opened up a thread for this, no need to duplicate.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1068563

@DreamerGuy: Please move triniiphone's post to the thread I started.

Also please change the name of my thread from "TriniTrain | Official Thread" to "Trinidad & Tobago | TriniTrain"

Gracias
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Old March 24th, 2010, 04:15 PM   #12
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I already did that yesterday lol

Well as yoda would say, merged they will be
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Old March 25th, 2010, 04:23 AM   #13
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I think that the thread title should have read "Rapid Rail". TriniTrain is actually the name given to the group of companies that is designing and constructing the train system and not the train system itself.
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Old March 25th, 2010, 04:29 AM   #14
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changed it is

any pictures yet of the project?
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Old March 26th, 2010, 05:49 AM   #15
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OPERATIONS, MAINTENANCE AND STORAGE FACILITY (OMSF)




CONCEPTUAL STATION DESIGN








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Old March 26th, 2010, 05:51 AM   #16
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Forgot to add that the rapid rail has a new website that was launched last week.

http://www.trinitrain.co.tt


And there's a public notice out now regarding public consultations since it is required to get a CEC.


Last edited by Trini2D Bone; March 26th, 2010 at 06:00 AM. Reason: Forgot to include a picture
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Old March 27th, 2010, 01:55 AM   #17
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Absolutely amazing!! Thanks for sharing
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Old March 28th, 2010, 02:45 PM   #18
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Looks really really amazing!!! thanks for sharing-i just wish they had something like this demonstrating the planned national highway network.
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Old April 1st, 2010, 04:08 AM   #19
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WOW! Been looking forward to these renders for a long time.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 03:37 AM   #20
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a nice place, i love T&G another modern city on the caribean
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