Transit City Dead?

[dleung]

Originally Posted by Grey Towers

As many of you know, the TTC is the least-subsidized transit system in N.A. More than 70% of operating funds come from the fare box. That paradigm must change if we want to see any meaningful improvements. Grandiose one-off announcements, especially ones that are partially rescinded, are not enough.

What a continuing joke!

I was skeptical and looked it up... check out Toronto's fare-recovery rate compared to the rest of North America. That's impressive:


source: wikipedia, where else

The American systems are major money-losers

And the only reason Vancouver gets even 54% back, with our low ridership per capita (second-lowest of the 6 major cities) is the extremely high fares.

As expected, the Asian transit systems are making a profit, lol

Originally Posted by AndrewJM3D

if you have to travel outside of the 416 and into the 905 you're paying more as well, $5-$6.

Does the 905 have a different zone?

[vid]

The 905 has different transit systems entirely, and you usually have to pay another fare to get on them.

Thunder Bay's cost recovery is about equal to Edmonton's.

[Epi]

Originally Posted by dleung

As expected, the Asian transit systems are making a profit, lol

Interestingly enough, the Asian systems are also the most capitalistic/privatized. Although I would admit that they also benefit from density.

[TRZ]

Originally Posted by Epi

Interestingly enough, the Asian systems are also the most capitalistic/privatized. Although I would admit that they also benefit from density.

Some of that density in the immediate area of private railways is built by the same company as the railway. The density is another element of the capitalist quality to the urban built form. Railway companies build their own ridership base, collecting not only their fares, but part of their rent, too. They're also in retail.

[TRZ]

Originally Posted by vid

The 905 has different transit systems entirely, and you usually have to pay another fare to get on them.

Thunder Bay's cost recovery is about equal to Edmonton's.

The 905 systems only get about 40-50%.

[vid]

Originally Posted by TRZ

Some of that density in the immediate area of private railways is built by the same company as the railway. The density is another element of the capitalist quality to the urban built form. Railway companies build their own ridership base, collecting not only their fares, but part of their rent, too. They're also in retail.

Streetcars did that in the 1800s and early 1900s here. One streetcar line in Thunder Bay branched off the public system to what was supposed to be a high class subdivision and country club. They got as far as building the line before the war.

[TRZ]

Originally Posted by vid

Streetcars did that in the 1800s and early 1900s here. One streetcar line in Thunder Bay branched off the public system to what was supposed to be a high class subdivision and country club. They got as far as building the line before the war.

The legend of the streetcar-suburb was far-reaching.

[Epi]

Originally Posted by TRZ

Some of that density in the immediate area of private railways is built by the same company as the railway. The density is another element of the capitalist quality to the urban built form. Railway companies build their own ridership base, collecting not only their fares, but part of their rent, too. They're also in retail.

I always get a kick out of how Japanese rail companies also down major department stores at their main stations. I dunno why, it just seems so strange coming from Canada to see that, even if it makes perfect sense.

[allurban]

Originally Posted by AndrewJM3D

That's fine, but if you have to travel outside of the 416 and into the 905 you're paying more as well, $5-$6. A large chunk of commuter do that each day.

when I came in from Mississauga it was 8 per day - using 2 TTC tickets and 2 MT tickets.

No way I could buy a metropass and recover the costs by taking rides.And around Mississauga I would usually bike or walk wherever I needed to go.

Cheers, m

ps. it would be nice to have more up-to-date date for those Asian & european cities. Only 3 of them reporting from the 2000s....

m

[allurban]

Originally Posted by TRZ

The legend of the streetcar-suburb was far-reaching.

I always think of the BC Hydro Example - they built the suburb, provided the power and the streetcar as well.

Cheers, m

[Electrify]

Originally Posted by Filip

I just witnessed my first transit collapse since coming back to Toronto on vacation...

The Queen car must be REPLACED. It is unreliable, traffic snarls affect it and it is nearly always packed even in off peak hours.

I was waiting at University/Queen for the tram, over 20 mins, then I decided to walk toward the west because I was meeting a friend at the Drake. I got to OSSINGTON before the first streetcar passed me! WTF.

While I know the ends of the line have disgraceful service, I've never seen that happen with the Queen car through the core (probably an accident further down the line). With that said, from the central core if I'm going any further than Bathurst or Broadview, I find it quicker to head up to Bloor, across on the subway, and back down with a connecting bus route.

[AndrewJM3D]

Proof how smooth of a ride a streetcar is and why we love them. I was able to make these videos from Bloor West to Broadview last Saturday.

2x the speed, I suggest playing them both at the same time and turning the music off whatever side suits you fancy.

[Taller, Better]

I've never lost my thrill of riding in a streetcar. It just blows away any other form of public transport in my books. Great vids!!
It is trippy watching them side by side!

[vid]

You mean it doesn't slam on its breaks and push everyone into the seat in front of them when it stops?

I almost fell on a bus driver the other day because he stopped too hard.

[Taller, Better]

I hate buses, and despise the forward/backward/side to side motion. Uggh. They have zero character, too.

[dleung]

Buses routes aren't permanent, and that takes away a lot of confidence from relying on it. Also, as my cousin in LA would put it... "buses are for black people"

[vid]

The bus route I live on has existed since 1892, first as a streetcar line, then as a trolleybus line, and now as a city bus line. The frequency was every 30 minutes in 1892, every 10 minutes in the 1980s, and is once again every 30 minutes. It's possibly the oldest government owned mass transit route in Canada, though it has had minor route changes over time, and the name has changed a couple times. Considering how many people depend on public transit in this neighbourhood I think it is safe to say it isn't going anywhere.

The good thing about riding buses regularly is that I no longer get sea sick. And I can stand up on a moving vehicle without falling.

[AndrewJM3D]

Originally Posted by dleung

Buses routes aren't permanent, and that takes away a lot of confidence from relying on it. Also, as my cousin in LA would put it... "buses are for black people"

Wow, you just hit an all time low with that post. Your cousin sounds like a really nice person. Why would you post that?

[Filip]

You two should kiss and make up.

[dleung]

You'd think I raped his sister or something... he's just offended on behalf of a few condo buildings in Toronto that I wasn't friends with, haha

And for the record I don't buy into the school of thought that one can only joke about his own race.