daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Subways and Urban Transport

Subways and Urban Transport Metros, subways, light rail, trams, buses and other local transport systems



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old August 7th, 2012, 08:25 PM   #181
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Quote:
Originally Posted by rouke View Post
Hi there,

Could anyone tell me what the last known pricetag was of Lines 9 and 10, if they completed the both lines in full?
Somewhere around €16bn (that is, in English, in Spanish it is €16,000 million, as a billion in Spanish is a million millions, unlike in English).
Crazy numbers, but that line is really needed and it is difficult to think of a cheaper solution (bar the platform screen doors perhaps, but crowding on the line, once finished, is expected to be very serious from day one).

Quote:
Iīm also curious about the 3 depots, would they build new one's?
No.

Quote:
Would the depots be underground aswell?
The one which is in service (the Can Zam depot) is.
The other two, at Zona Franca, are on surface, the access is through the L10, and itīs the main reason why the southern sector of L9 is not in operation yet, as the TBMs had problems with unexpected soils and a serious breakdown that halted works for more than a year.
Everything was going hunky dory till then... and then came the crisis.

Quote:
If they would've (have?) built the depots, underground, what buildingmethod are they using?
Cut & cover, I guess. All depots are finished, but only the underground depot at Can Zam is in use.
The other two, at Zona Franca, arenīt, as they cannot be connected to the L9 until the TBM ends its task...
Authorities say that by 2013/14 it will restart work to finish the remaining part of the southern branch of L10 between somewhere around Ildefons Cerdā till the Gornal portal where it will meet L9.
I hope it will, as it is the only possible way to open the southern branch of L9 (the airport branch), which is nearly finished and will wait longtime till being in service, as L10 has the depots of the southern branch.

Quote:
Would be nice if someone took the time to answer my questions.


Quote:
Ow, I forgot, is there A informative website by builders or the city of Barcelona about the building of new lines? (in Spanish)
Itīs not an official website, but Iīve found this blog in Spanish:

http://l9metrobarcelona.blogspot.com.es/

This is the official site. For the Spanish version, click in "castellano" in the right upper corner. Iīve tried the English version, but it doesnīt seem to work:

http://www.ifercat.cat/index.php?contenido=21#

Quote:
Thanks again, your effort will be highly appreciated.
Donīt mention...

Quote:
In the meantime..
I tried to figure out what the costs are of the line but I'm not sure..
Told you above.

Cheers.

Last edited by 437.001; August 7th, 2012 at 08:49 PM.
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old October 29th, 2012, 07:14 PM   #182
bmfarley
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 54
Likes (Received): 0

Good news. I searched and found a news article saying that the line extensions to Terrassa and Sebadell are resuming. The extension in Terrassa is anticipated to be completed in 2014. Sebadell in 2016.

Here's the article from El Peridico. Of course, my wife from Barcelona needed to translate for me.

http://www.elperiodico.com/es/notici...rrassa-2218206
bmfarley no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 29th, 2012, 09:24 PM   #183
arctic_carlos
Recondita armonia
 
arctic_carlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Sitges - Barcelona
Posts: 4,729
Likes (Received): 3953

Definitely good news!

Moreover, construction of the missing section of L10 (necessary to put L9 to the Airport into service) will be resumed next month, according to one forumer of the Spanish thread. However, so far there are no officials announcements regarding that issue.
__________________
Wer kämpft, kann verlieren. Wer nicht kämpft, hat schon verloren.

Bertolt Brecht
arctic_carlos está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old November 26th, 2012, 11:51 AM   #184
Antje
Public Transport Fan
 
Antje's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 407

Question: has anyone got around to film the whole of the L2 on the s9000?
Antje no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 5th, 2013, 07:12 PM   #185
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Quote:
Originally Posted by arctic_carlos View Post
Definitely good news!

Moreover, construction of the missing section of L10 (necessary to put L9 to the Airport into service) will be resumed next month, according to one forumer of the Spanish thread. However, so far there are no officials announcements regarding that issue.
Top secret sources said that before Christmas 160 m of the missing L10 tunnel had been bored. We expect to have more news soon.

By 2014, L9 should finally be in service between Collblanc and Aeroport T1 stations (politicians said between Zona Universitāria and Aeroport T1, though...).

Whatever happens, it will be the biggest extension ever of the Barcelona underground (14 stations at once, being pessimistic).
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 6th, 2013, 12:10 AM   #186
arctic_carlos
Recondita armonia
 
arctic_carlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Sitges - Barcelona
Posts: 4,729
Likes (Received): 3953

Quote:
Originally Posted by 437.001 View Post
Top secret sources said that before Christmas 160 m of the missing L10 tunnel had been bored. We expect to have more news soon.

By 2014, L9 should finally be in service between Collblanc and Aeroport T1 stations (politicians said between Zona Universitāria and Aeroport T1, though...).

Whatever happens, it will be the biggest extension ever of the Barcelona underground (14 stations at once, being pessimistic).
You are the forumer who gave us the good news 2 months ago, so we'll trust you again!

Now let's hope they decide to open the new section in early 2014, not in the last weeks of December... If the tunnel has already been bored there's not a lot more to do, besides installing tracks, electrification and signalling systems in that short stretch. The rest of the line is ready since a couple of years ago.
__________________
Wer kämpft, kann verlieren. Wer nicht kämpft, hat schon verloren.

Bertolt Brecht
arctic_carlos está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old January 8th, 2013, 10:56 PM   #187
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Quote:
Originally Posted by arctic_carlos View Post
You are the forumer who gave us the good news 2 months ago, so we'll trust you again!
No, it wasnīt me.

Quote:
Now let's hope they decide to open the new section in early 2014, not in the last weeks of December...
Doesnīt really matter, as long as it is 2014 and not 2015. But the sooner, the better.

Quote:
If the tunnel has already been bored there's not a lot more to do, besides installing tracks, electrification and signalling systems in that short stretch.
No, it hasnīt yet. But it shouldnīt take very long, that is, unless something stops the works again.

Quote:
The rest of the line is ready since a couple of years ago.
Not really, rails and electrification are already in place between the airport and the place through the TBM will resurface.
Whatīs missing are the rails, electrification and signalling system on the L10 branch between the viaduct and Gornal.

The opening of the HSL only makes this extension of the underground more urgent.
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2013, 09:19 PM   #188
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Quote:
Originally Posted by 437.001 View Post
Top secret sources said that before Christmas 160 m of the missing L10 tunnel had been bored. We expect to have more news soon.
The TBM that has been boring the L10 tunnel has finished its work today, at last.
It will be extracted as soon as possible.
It has tunneled the sector between Motors and Gornal of the southern branch of the L10.

Once the rails and signalling in place, this will allow the opening of the southern branch of L9 between Collblanc and Aeroport T1, weīve been told that next year.

It will be the biggest extension ever of the Barcelona underground: 14 new stations at once.

This new stretch of L9 will start at Collblanc, next to the Camp Nou, providing a link to L5, and then going to Torrassa (connection to L1), Europa-Fira (connection to FGC suburban commuter lines), El Prat station (connection to Renfe suburban commuter lines), Aeroport T2 (same connection), and Aeroport T1.

Above everything else, it will finally provide a decent public transport service to the Airport.

Last edited by 437.001; January 17th, 2013 at 09:27 PM.
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 18th, 2013, 07:02 AM   #189
dwdwone
Subway Dave
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 569
Likes (Received): 39

I was reading that Spain is in a lot of trouble financially. If yes, how can they afford to build all these metros?
dwdwone no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 18th, 2013, 09:46 AM   #190
Isek
Registered User
 
Isek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,337
Likes (Received): 1226

Long term structural fonds granted by the EU government. So it is essentially no Spanish money but German, Dutch, Austrian.....
Isek no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 18th, 2013, 08:03 PM   #191
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwdwone View Post
I was reading that Spain is in a lot of trouble financially. If yes, how can they afford to build all these metros?
This line was nearly finished before the crisis started, and works were halted because there was a big problem with the TBMs, and itīs taken all this time to be able to get the money to resume the works and make the TBM bore a 800m tunnel, which is the missing link that keeps the line from being able to open.

Most of the rest of the line was already finished by then, but this 800m long tunnel contains the only access to the depot!!!
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 18th, 2013, 08:05 PM   #192
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Quote:
Originally Posted by Isek View Post
Long term structural fonds granted by the EU government. So it is essentially no Spanish money but German, Dutch, Austrian.....
Not so much.

The majority of the money comes out of Spanish pockets.

Barcelona (among others, like Madrid) has access to many less EU funds than other Spanish regions.
Besides, France and Germany themselves use this funds very often as well.
__________________

OsKr_BcN, Highcliff liked this post
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 20th, 2013, 08:01 AM   #193
OriK
Usuario Registrado
 
OriK's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 721
Likes (Received): 173

Quote:
Originally Posted by Isek View Post
Long term structural fonds granted by the EU government. So it is essentially no Spanish money but German, Dutch, Austrian.....
In Barcelona? I doubt so...

http://medias2.cafebabel.com/6139/th...on-europea.jpg

Red regions are the ones with granted funds in the 2007-2013 budget... paid by the blue regions (the richest).
OriK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 30th, 2013, 07:08 PM   #194
Antje
Public Transport Fan
 
Antje's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 407

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barcelo...ro_9000_Series

An article about a train that runs on the system appeared on the Front page as part of the Did you know series. By the way, what are the exact fleet numbers? I spotted one car with 9093 on (http://catalunyaconstruye.com/bcn-rail-07/).
Antje no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 27th, 2013, 11:46 PM   #195
gincan
Gincan
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 888
Likes (Received): 186

Quote:
Originally Posted by aniuska View Post
Terrassa and Sabadell lines are not a real metro, they can be better considered as something like RER in Paris.
Not at all, if anything it resemble the German S-Bahn systems such as the one in Berlin.

The Vallčs Metro is a hybrid system working both as a proper metro system inside Barcelona but also as a suburban rapid transit system between Barcelona and Terrassa/Sabadell Once the two new tunnels are built they will work as proper metro systems within those two cities.
gincan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2013, 01:38 AM   #196
gincan
Gincan
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 888
Likes (Received): 186

Here are three different type of historical rolling stock formerly used on what today is line 6 in Barcelona metro.

This year the line that corresponds to L6 in Barcelona metro will celebrate its 150th year in operation, 23-6-1863. It was originally built as a broad gauge railroad between what was then Barcelona and the village Sarria. One of the original steam engines is on display at the railroad museum in Villanova south of Barcelona. In 1905 it was electrified and the rolling stock switched to trams, these were used until 1921. The trams were replaced between 1920 and 1921 by electric railcars built in Philadelphia by J.G. Brill and then shipped in boxes for assembly at the railroad workshops. Here is a restored one.


In 1916 the railway was extended beyond the city out to San Cugat and a few years later out to Terrassa and Sabadell. Philadelphia built interurban rail cars were used on the interurban service between Barcelona and Terrassa/Sabadell, they were the same that were used on the Philadelphia and Western Railroad and several other american interurban railways. In this video a restored one can be seen.


Between 1945 and 1952 the first proper metro rolling stock was introduced and by 1953 the whole line between Plaįa Catalunya and Sarria (today L6) was built to metro standard, around this time also line 7 opened.
__________________

Ribarca liked this post

Last edited by gincan; February 28th, 2013 at 01:45 AM.
gincan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2013, 02:16 AM   #197
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Hence the problem of travel time.
Coexistence of both types of services (urban and commuter rail) disturb both.
Urban services should have better frequencies, as well as commuter rail services.
But thatīs not possible due to this coexistence. The only solution is to have separate tunnels, and thatīs very expensive, and should have been forseeen.
If these lines arenīt more used, itīs precisely because of that.

Still, many of us donīt consider FGC lines as real metro, and thatīs the reason.

Last edited by 437.001; February 28th, 2013 at 02:26 AM.
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2013, 02:58 AM   #198
gincan
Gincan
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 888
Likes (Received): 186

Quote:
Originally Posted by 437.001 View Post
Hence the problem of travel time.
Coexistence of both types of services (urban and commuter rail) disturb both.
Urban services should have better frequencies, as well as commuter rail services.
But thatīs not possible due to this coexistence. The only solution is to have separate tunnels, and thatīs very expensive, and should have been forseeen.
If these lines arenīt more used, itīs precisely because of that.

Still, many of us donīt consider FGC lines as real metro, and thatīs the reason.
In many metro systems you have 10 minute frequency on branch lines or outer parts of the system. Even 20 minute frequency of peak. The FGC lines have 10 minute frequency on the interurban stretches and even 5 minute out to San Cugat and on the important stations on L6 such as Sarria, Gracia, Provenįa and Pl Catalunya you have up to 30 trains per hour per direction. With a maneuver track at Pl Catalunya you could run 40 trains per hour with 5 minute frequency on the whole system.

Then the debate what is a metro is a never ending one but FGC Valles system fullfill all criteria to be considered a real metro.

*Isolated/doesn't share tracks with other traffic
*Fast loading unloading trains (multiple doors)
*High Frequency up to 30 trains per hour
*High Plattforms with level train floor
*No level crossings/closed railway corridors
gincan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2013, 07:33 PM   #199
437.001
Sister Greed U
 
437.001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: on the road (Spain)
Posts: 31,998
Likes (Received): 15427

Quote:
Originally Posted by gincan View Post
In many metro systems you have 10 minute frequency on branch lines or outer parts of the system. Even 20 minute frequency of peak.
A 10 minutes frequency on a metro line is considered unacceptable in Madrid and Barcelona, even off-peak.

Quote:
The FGC lines have 10 minute frequency on the interurban stretches and even 5 minute out to San Cugat and on the important stations on L6 such as Sarria, Gracia, Provenįa and Pl Catalunya you have up to 30 trains per hour per direction. With a maneuver track at Pl Catalunya you could run 40 trains per hour with 5 minute frequency on the whole system.
Oh, yes, yes... but thatīs a wrong idea, you see.
That would mean spending millions in a tunnel that soon would be underused.
Why? Because itīs two kinds of services that youīre managing, thus there are two different kinds of needs.

Users of the urban lines want a full metro service, not a "looks-like-metro-but doesnīt-call-at-each-station" thing.

Users of the commuter services donīt want to travel for that long, calling at nearly all inner Barcelona stations, because in many cases, the car is still an option. It takes the same from Terrassa to Barcelona (Pl.Catalunya) if you travel by FGC or if you travel by Renfe, although Renfe uses a much loonger route (with higher frequencies at peak hours and longer trains than FGC, btw).

Both services would be more used if they were separated.

Quote:
Then the debate what is a metro is a never ending one but FGC Valles system fullfill all criteria to be considered a real metro.
Trains are short for Barcelona metro standards. Theyīre short even for Renfe commuter train standards. And this is a main supposed-to-be-metro line weīre talking about. Different fares donīt help, either.

And... you might be talking about FGC Vallčs alone, but ignoring FGC Llobregat is a big mistake, because it has exactly the same problems.
437.001 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2013, 07:54 PM   #200
Ribarca
Registered User
 
Ribarca's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 6,705
Likes (Received): 3345

Quote:
Originally Posted by gincan View Post

Between 1945 and 1952 the first proper metro rolling stock was introduced and by 1953 the whole line between Plaįa Catalunya and Sarria (today L6) was built to metro standard, around this time also line 7 opened.
Awesome. Brings back memories these old trains to Sarria!
__________________
This is my world,and I am the World Leader Pretend.


Hong Kong by Xavibarca, www.xavibarca.com
Ribarca no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
barcelona, spain in the world

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:45 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium