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Old July 27th, 2013, 07:59 AM   #501
Silly_Walks
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Quote:
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Is there a relationship with that place and Sheung Shui in Hong Kong, or are the names just similar?
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Old July 27th, 2013, 10:05 PM   #502
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I also don't understand why they have this ongoing discussion about wether to use maglev or wheel-rail trains. If the maglev plan will be built they definitely have to start with an underground terminus in Wenjin because it is in a very dense urban part in Luohu. Plus, I don't see the advantage of building an elevated line to Xiaomeisha as there are a lot of mountains, so at the end they also need to built some tunnels to go through and Xiaomeisha has, as well as Dameisha, pretty limited space above ground. Furthermore they should consider the maintenance costs of a maglev fleet (is it higher/lower?), that you can't use those cars on other lines and vice versa and of course the aesthetic impact on the shoreline of an elevated line.
What happened to the plans to extend the whole line to Dapeng? There are every week some articles on the local newspaper that they gonna restrict the cars to this areas on holidays and during weekends. An extension could greatly relieve the car traffic. It took us last time 5 hours to Nan'ao from Coco Park by car.
They shouldn't go for maglev. Instead they should simply build Yantian Line (Line 8) as an extension of Shekou Line (Line 2) or Meilin Line (Line 9). This greatly reduces the number of transfers between lines and reduces the cost of construction near Lohu area.
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Old July 27th, 2013, 10:20 PM   #503
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Originally Posted by Silly_Walks View Post
Is there a relationship with that place and Sheung Shui in Hong Kong, or are the names just similar?
It should simply be a coincidence because it is read as Shang-shuijing, meaning Upper area of Shuijing, instead of Shangshui-jing. And there is a place nearby called Xiashuijing, meaning Lower area of Shuijing. For Sheung Shui in Hong Kong, there is no corresponding Sha Shui (Lower area of Shui) nearby.
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Old July 28th, 2013, 05:35 AM   #504
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wow!!! subway station in the middle of farm. Really nice. I wish i have an apartment in that farmland. This is really a good place to buy real state. It seems the developers are picking up. there's a construction just few meters from the entrance.

I hope they preserve the plants and grasses before it will be crowded with buildings.. Maybe wait 2 years or 3.. It will be pretty crowded.
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Old July 28th, 2013, 05:39 AM   #505
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don't worry this is Shenzhen the entrance will be surrounded by residentials and shopping malls soon
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Old July 28th, 2013, 09:26 AM   #506
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The owner of that small house must have some heavy weight friends at Shenzhen metro. Its either the metro entrance is just purposely built for him. Or the metro wants his properly appreciate much in value. In either way he wins.
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Old July 30th, 2013, 03:45 PM   #507
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I'd like to make a little observation about the metro in Shenzhen which also applies to Guangzhou. I did exactly the same observation in Shanghai last year.

It's about the 'delay' between the carriage doors have closed and the train starting to move. I know this is a little 'nerdy' even for SSC but I just don't understand why after the train and the platform screen doors have shut and all the visual and sound indicators have switched off the train does not start to move for another 8-9 seconds (it may range from ~7 to ~12 seconds but 8 seconds would probably happen in 80% of cases).

I used the following lines in SZ metro
- Luobao
- Shekou
- Longhua

And lines 1,2 and 5 in Guangzhou. Exact same thing.

A 7-9 second delay at every station after all doors are closed. Maybe I'm getting crazy and obsessed but it kinda drives me nuts. And once you have, say, 10 stations to go, it's almost one minute lost (in comparison to other sytems, not in total). Sounds not much but if you ad it all up. Especially when there seems no any explanation behind it.

I did similar observation in Hong Kong and Bangkok where I am right now. In both cases the delay after shutting the doors and train moving is 3-4 seconds. In Singapore and all metro systems in Europe that I have used also have similar delays or even less. So roughtly 4 seconds difference from systems that use similar rolling stock and, I assume, similar technology. I just can't understand why on earth are they wasting time in such a way and why metros in China (at least Shenzhen, Shanghai and Guangzhou) need those extra 4 seconds in every station before moving?

Why is that? Is there one specific reason? Because I'm sure there must be one.
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Old July 30th, 2013, 05:09 PM   #508
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We have had this discussion in the Shanghai thread a couple of times. There is no absolute answer to the long dwell times, but it is mainly bc the drivers checks on the screens and the train visually and with gestures. He also needs to board the train.
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Old July 30th, 2013, 06:59 PM   #509
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You're not the only one Pansori. Waiting so long after the doors close on every stop would annoy me too, especially if I'm in a hurry. That sounds like another inefficiency in managing the metro.
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Old July 30th, 2013, 08:27 PM   #510
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Which metro systems in Europe have these delays? Do all doors close simultaneously or only half of the train at a time?
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Old July 30th, 2013, 11:05 PM   #511
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Quote:
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We have had this discussion in the Shanghai thread a couple of times. There is no absolute answer to the long dwell times, but it is mainly bc the drivers checks on the screens and the train visually and with gestures. He also needs to board the train.
But why? Why do drivers in Hong Kong don't need to do checks on the screens or gestures and board the train while similar train and system in Shenzhen (which is actually newer and should be more technologically advanced) requires that?

I'm not saying they don't need to double check the screens but we are comparing other systems which use similar standards and rolling stock and yet they start moving quicker after doors are closed. Why?
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Old July 31st, 2013, 12:24 AM   #512
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Originally Posted by Pansori View Post
But why? Why do drivers in Hong Kong don't need to do checks on the screens or gestures and board the train while similar train and system in Shenzhen (which is actually newer and should be more technologically advanced) requires that?

I'm not saying they don't need to double check the screens but we are comparing other systems which use similar standards and rolling stock and yet they start moving quicker after doors are closed. Why?
I think it might have to do with sticking to the time table.

During rush hour, you need those extra seconds to get people on the trains in time.

When it's not so busy, the passengers board faster, so the train COULD leave the station sooner, but then it would be at the next station too quickly, and after some stations the metro would be minutes ahead of the time table.
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Old July 31st, 2013, 03:14 AM   #513
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It could be the fact that the trains in general have a very loose schedule due to how relatively infrequent they are. Also for shanghai there has been injuries and deaths with people boarding and alighting the crowded trains so they kinda went into safety overdrive.
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Old July 31st, 2013, 06:50 AM   #514
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I feel that this could be remedied by following the Japanese style of operations - a secondary personnel in the last car to check for clearance, personnel midway down the platform to wave the flag on the all clear mark. After all, China doesn't have a shortage of a workforce.
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Old July 31st, 2013, 08:42 AM   #515
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silly_Walks View Post

I think it might have to do with sticking to the time table.

During rush hour, you need those extra seconds to get people on the trains in time.

When it's not so busy, the passengers board faster, so the train COULD leave the station sooner, but then it would be at the next station too quickly, and after some stations the metro would be minutes ahead of the time table.
OK but why they don't do that elsewhere then? Are there no timetables in other metro systems? And the delay occurs during rush hours too so I don't think this is the reason anyway.
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Old July 31st, 2013, 09:49 AM   #516
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Excessive safety measures sound like the most likely reason but is it really necessary? I mean there are all kinds of sensors and safety systems which ensure that things work properly. And most stations have platform doors anyway so as long as all doors are shut there should be absolutely no reason to take additional visual checks. It's just that I fail to make sense of it.
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Old July 31st, 2013, 09:50 AM   #517
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I feel that this could be remedied by following the Japanese style of operations - a secondary personnel in the last car to check for clearance, personnel midway down the platform to wave the flag on the all clear mark. After all, China doesn't have a shortage of a workforce.
Seems that's exactly what they are doing now in Shanghai.
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Old July 31st, 2013, 10:49 AM   #518
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Could Shenzhen beat Guangzhou in most lines and better system? Or Guangzhou would still be better
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Old July 31st, 2013, 12:36 PM   #519
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Could Shenzhen beat Guangzhou in most lines and better system? Or Guangzhou would still be better
Is Guangzhou better? Perhaps it takes more than just a few days of sightseeing to get a better idea but Shenzhen metro feels more pleasant to me.
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Old July 31st, 2013, 01:14 PM   #520
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I think those extra seconds is necessary for safety. It's very often that the doors close and almost have a leg or hand or head still in between. Even the body can be between the metro carriage's doors and the security doors, like squeezed in between. Since it's crowded you almost get squeezed into that dead zone everytime. Image if the train would just leave if you some body partstill outside...

There has been several cases a couple of years ago people getting killed and even getting their heads chopped off...

Safety is better than getting that 5 mins earlier to work...
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