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Old April 22nd, 2010, 12:03 PM   #41
allurban
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It seems like the DC area has a well-connected network of public transport with room to grow - and it seems like they are putting some good investments in place.

So why dont more people know more about the DC Metro & surface transport?

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Old April 22nd, 2010, 04:22 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allurban View Post
So why dont more people know more about the DC Metro & surface transport?
Well, it may not be too well known outside of the USA, but it is a rather popular form of transit for locals and tourists. It has the second highest ridership of US metro systems, after New York City.

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Old April 22nd, 2010, 05:25 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allurban View Post
It seems like the DC area has a well-connected network of public transport with room to grow - and it seems like they are putting some good investments in place.

So why dont more people know more about the DC Metro & surface transport?

Cheers, m
I'm not sure why it doesn't have more of a following internationally, other than the fact that SkyscraperCity posters notwithstanding, most non-U.S. Americans think of N.Y.C., L.A., or even Chicago before Washington D.C. as the quintessential American "city". It's not as large or impressive as those in London, Paris, Tokyo, or Madrid or growing as fast as the Chinese metros.

Within the U.S., more people seem to be aware of it. It's often held up as an example of a very successful from-scratch heavy-rail Metro.

Tourists, locals, and working commuters alike use it. It functions well both for moving large numbers of people in and out of the city from the suburbs (the inner and mid-suburbs, at least) and also for moving within the city itself.

Last edited by Dan78; April 22nd, 2010 at 05:32 PM.
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Old April 22nd, 2010, 05:30 PM   #44
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They Need to extend MARC Service to Fredrick form Baltimore and to Newark,DE. DC to Annapolis via MARC express bus. As for VRE , they need to extend that to Richmond and Electrify it. Hows the Streetcar scandal , did they pass a bill allowing Catenary wires?
It will most likely be a hybrid system, or a mix of catenary and in-ground power transmission if they don't change the old law that bans overhead wires that are visible from the National Mall (this is still being debated).

Hybrid systems require either batteries (heavy) or super-capacitors (possibly heavy, probably expensive, still in the development) stage or diesel engines (heavy, noisy, polluting) on board to provide power.

In ground systems are basically proprietary or in development (APS or Siemens) or conduit. Old style conduit was very expensive, labor intensive, and could be troublesome - especially in snow/ice conditions. Modern conduit should be much cheaper (shallow as opposed to deep), no additional labor (but possibly still problematic in snow/ice).

http://greatergreaterwashington.org/post.cgi?id=3587
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Old April 22nd, 2010, 06:02 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan78 View Post
It will most likely be a hybrid system, or a mix of catenary and in-ground power transmission if they don't change the old law that bans overhead wires that are visible from the National Mall (this is still being debated).

Hybrid systems require either batteries (heavy) or super-capacitors (possibly heavy, probably expensive, still in the development) stage or diesel engines (heavy, noisy, polluting) on board to provide power.

It would be interesting to see if they have to change the vehicles to support something other than catenary since they are already built and waiting in the Czech Republic....

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Old April 23rd, 2010, 07:51 AM   #46
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The purple light rail line will definitely relieve pressure on downtown trains for those that want to go from suburb to suburb. Once they connect to Dulles, I think that will be even better to have both DC airports connected by rail. BWI is connected too.
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Old April 23rd, 2010, 04:25 PM   #47
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The purple light rail line will definitely relieve pressure on downtown trains for those that want to go from suburb to suburb. Once they connect to Dulles, I think that will be even better to have both DC airports connected by rail. BWI is connected too.
Yes, the Purple Line will be great for Montgomery County and will help take some pressure off the Capital Beltway as well (traffic is painfully slow during rush hour, which is pretty much all day anymore). Since HRT was axed as a possibility, LRT was clearly the right option here; BRT would have been a bust.

BWI is connected to D.C. and Baltimore by MARC. It's a bit too far from the D.C. city center to justify Metro (10 miles further out than Dulles is, I believe).

I hope that Baltimore goes ahead with their new Red Line addition and Green Line extension. It would be a great thing for the city to have. I was hoping they'd go for heavy rail for the Red Line, but light rail for this line will work, just not as well (less capacity).

I'm not sure that the Blue and Yellow extensions shown in that one Baltimore map have ever been seriously considered, but they seem like a good idea. They'd have to be in a tunnel with two new underground stations (that area of Baltimore has narrow, crowded streets), but they'd be going a relatively short distance, so the expense may not be that great.

D.C., in my opinion, should concentrate on increasing core capacity via proposals like the new Blue Line tunnel under M and H streets, rather than trying to reach every far-flung suburb. Some modest extensions like extending the Orange Line to Centreville and Bowie, the Green Line to Laurel, the Yellow Line to Hybla Valley, and the Blue Line to Lorton should be considered, perhaps.
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Old April 23rd, 2010, 06:59 PM   #48
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Good thread.
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Old April 24th, 2010, 06:33 PM   #49
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Quote:
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I hope that Baltimore goes ahead with their new Red Line addition and Green Line extension. It would be a great thing for the city to have. I was hoping they'd go for heavy rail for the Red Line, but light rail for this line will work, just not as well (less capacity).

I'm not sure that the Blue and Yellow extensions shown in that one Baltimore map have ever been seriously considered, but they seem like a good idea. They'd have to be in a tunnel with two new underground stations (that area of Baltimore has narrow, crowded streets), but they'd be going a relatively short distance, so the expense may not be that great.
At this point the red line looks like it has a good chance of being built. Although the red line will be built as Light Rail, unlike the Central Light Rail Line (existing LRT), the line will be in a tunnel in the central city (see map), which is a tremendous improvement in planning over the Central Light rail Line


Indeed, the Yellow and Blue line extensions have never seriously been considered, although if the Red Line is a success, it would certainly give plans for the extensions a boost. Right now the MTA's first priority is the Red Line. After that is built, they may begin to work more seriously on the Green Line extension.
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Old April 24th, 2010, 06:36 PM   #50
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A rendering of an underground station on the Red Line:
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Old April 24th, 2010, 09:25 PM   #51
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I think the Red line will go first , then the Green line extension. Then by the Time we get to the opening year of the Green line Ext , people will want more. The Yellow and Blue line spurs will be pushed or even in the finally stages of planning. As for the Orange line , maybe they can replace Marc's Camden line with it. I hope that one day MARC will build a line along the I-70 Corridor to Fredrick and down the I-97 corridor to the Annapolis. It seems that Baltimore will one day become the next DC in Transit terms although a bit smaller.
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Old April 26th, 2010, 04:17 AM   #52
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It would be interesting if this ever came true , although i do believe the bulk of it will.

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Old April 26th, 2010, 04:31 PM   #53
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Quote:
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It would be interesting if this ever came true , although i do believe the bulk of it will.
The above plan isn't as far-fetched as it may at first seem, all of the schemes shown in the D.C.-area of this map have been taken under consideration recently. Interest has been on the upswing on installing streetcars in Arlington along Columbia Pike, and also in Alexandria.

The Metro Silver Line to Dulles Airport and the D.C. streetcar track routes are currently under construction, and the Purple Line from Bethesda to New Carrollton is all but guaranteed.

The most expensive proposals shown would probably be the new D.C. Blue line subway, the Washington Beltway circular Purple Line, and the new Baltimore Red Line. To me, the biggest "long shot" (no pun intended) is that extra lonnnnnnnng Baltimore Yellow Line light rail route running all the way from Lithincum to Silver Spring.

As the Commuter Rail proposals shown (in light green) would use existing ROW and tracks, these would be less difficult to implement.
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Old April 28th, 2010, 01:07 AM   #54
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I agree, most of the extensions on the on the map are actual proposals and will likely occur sometime in the next 20-30 years. The few things on the map that i don't see happening are:
1) The Extending of the Baltimore Yellow Line all the way to Silver Spring. The current proposal to extend the line to Columbia would still create a very long light rail line.
2) The Extension of the Corridor Cities Transitway to Frederick. There just isn't significant commuter potential from Frederick County (and granted, maybe there will be in the future) to make it logical to extend the CCT beyond Clarksburg.
3) i think it will be quite a long time before the Purple Line is extended all the way around DC. I'm not saying it shouldn't or won't ever happen, but i think it will face significant opposition from residents in Fairfax County and there is also the issue of funds.
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Old April 28th, 2010, 04:25 AM   #55
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I guess the new DC Metrorail stock will have neither wider doors nor open gangways.

Last edited by manrush; April 28th, 2010 at 04:42 AM. Reason: sounds less pretensious
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Old April 28th, 2010, 03:20 PM   #56
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I guess the new DC Metrorail stock will have neither wider doors nor open gangways.
Doesn't appear so. The big change will be to longitudinal seating, like NYC and Boston already have. At least our D.C. cars have 3 doors per side of the car as opposed to the two that S.F.'s BART cars have.

http://greatergreaterwashington.org/post.cgi?id=5625
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Old May 3rd, 2010, 09:36 PM   #57
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More interesting maps ive found.



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Old May 4th, 2010, 01:05 AM   #58
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Some new photos I shot the other day of the support pylons for the Dulles Silver Line extension. The Silver Line will diverge from the existing Orange Line where I-66 meets Route 267 (The Dulles Toll Road). Construction is also well underway along 267, in Tyson's Corner, and as far out as Wiehle Avenue in Reston.

image hosted on flickr


Large:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3386/...6b0ffc40_o.jpg

image hosted on flickr


Large:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3380/...a9993e42_o.jpg

The tracks between East and West Falls Church will be shutdown for three weekends in order to facilitate construction.
http://www.wmata.com/about_metro/new...ReleaseID=4424
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Old May 4th, 2010, 08:51 AM   #59
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Red Line Update - Posted by Itus on the Baltimore Board

MTA Announces Improvements to Red Line
Tunnel Enhancements, Other Improvements Included in Request for Federal Funding

The Maryland Transit Administration’s (MTA) request for funding for the Red Line will include $121 million in key enhancements to the project announced last summer, including a two track tunnel under Cooks Lane in western Baltimore City. The Red Line is a 14.5-mile light rail line that will serve communities between Woodlawn and the Johns Hopkins Bayview Medical Center and enhance the regional transit network with connections to the Metro Subway, Light Rail and MARC Train. In announcing his selection of the route in 2009, Governor O’Malley recognized the potential for efficient, dependable transportation to provide access to job opportunities for corridor residents.

To comply with strict federal standards for cost effectiveness, the previously-announced Red Line Locally Preferred Alternative only included a one-mile single track tunnel under Cooks Lane. Subsequent refinements to the ridership forecast provide additional project benefits that offset the additional cost of the second track of the Cooks Lane tunnel--- a high end signal system; enhancements to the train maintenance facility to be constructed on Calverton Road; a crossover in the three-mile downtown tunnel; and four additional light rail vehicles to handle increased ridership. With all of these enhancements the current capital cost estimate for the Red Line is $1.778 billion, in current dollars.

MTA’s goal has been to design a project that would receive a “medium” rating for cost effectiveness by the Federal Transit Administration. The cost effectiveness rating captures capital costs, operating and maintenance costs, and ridership-related user benefits. Prior to a recent federal policy change, a transit project was required to achieve a medium cost effectiveness rating and a medium overall project rating to advance through the approval process. While the recent policy change will remove the medium cost effectiveness threshold as an absolute requirement, the Red Line will still be competing nationally, and a lower cost effectiveness number will help in that competition. The current range for a project to achieve a medium rating is $16.00 to $24.99. The updated Red Line has a cost effectiveness of $22.77.

Red Line ridership estimates have increased as a result of using the most recent and updated set of land use and demographic forecasts adopted by the Baltimore Metropolitan Council, incorporation of the findings from a 2007 survey of MTA riders, and a more detailed analysis of both home-based and non-home based travel patterns. The year 2030 ridership forecasts for the Red Line are projected at 59,200 trips per day, up from 54,000 in August 2009.

The MTA is currently working with the Federal Transit Administration to move the Red Line into the Preliminary Engineering phase of the project. This includes a review of all aspects of the project by the FTA. Preliminary Engineering is scheduled to begin in late summer 2010 and take approximately two years to complete. Assuming funding is available, Preliminary Engineering would be followed by Final Design, with construction underway after 2013. This summer, station area advisory committees comprised of community representatives will begin meeting to help the MTA design the 20 stations planned for the corridor.

http://www.baltimoreredline.com/home...ts-to-red-line

---

I just noticed this and have no idea when it was announced.

Relevant FAQs:
http://www.baltimoreredline.com/loca...sked-questions

Why are you updating the LPA now?

Since the LPA was announced, MTA has continued to refine the forecast of project benefits and cost estimates in preparation for a request to the Federal Transit Administration to enter a process that will eventually lead to federal funding for the project. This additional work showed that we could support enhancements that would make the Red Line more reliable and less costly in the long run. All of these enhancements had been considered previously but were removed from the LPA last year to meet federal requirements for cost effectiveness.

What are the specific changes?

Changes include the following:
Double Bore Cooks Lane Tunnel $67 million
Yard & Shop Improvements $15 million
Full CAB Signaling $16 million
Increase Length of Underground Crossover to Allow 10 MPH Operation $7 million
Increase Vehicles from 34 to 38 $16 million
Total $121 million

If the cost has increased why has the cost effectiveness improved?

The project cost effectiveness has decreased which is a good thing (our goal is to have the most benefit for the least cost). This is a result of increased ridership which means increased user benefits. The increase in user benefits more than offsets the increase in cost.

Why did the ridership forecast increase?

Since August 2009, the travel demand model used to estimate ridership has been improved. Average daily ridership is now 59,000. The primary reasons for the increase in ridership are as follows:

1. The model used Round 7A, the most recent and updated set of land use and demographic forecasts adopted by Baltimore Regional Transportation Board. Round 7A includes, among other enhancements, far more residential development in the downtown area.
2. The model used MTA's 2007 rider survey. The Phase I model used 1996 survey data which was the best available at the time. The 2007 survey showed significantly higher level of transit dependency and off-peak trip making than the prior model.
3. Ensured distribution of trips for home-based work travel is reflective of the patterns observed in the Journey-to Work data from the U.S. Census. The improvements made in representing this key market translated into a much improved and more sensitive model.

What is the justification for adding a second tube to the Cooks Lane tunnel?

The Cooks Lane tunnel is a one-mile segment of the Red Line. This is the only portion of the 14.5 mile project that was proposed as single track in August 2009, which was done to help achieve the medium cost effectiveness rating. Single tracking would have supported the headways needed for 2030 ridership, but is not ideal because it would result in service disruptions if the track is blocked and it would be more costly to construct the second tube in the future. This was of particular concern to citizens and elected officials, including, in particular, the District 41 delegation and the Red Line Citizens Advisory Council.

[additional Q&A is on the linked page]
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Old May 7th, 2010, 04:39 AM   #60
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Courtesy of BeyondDC:

image hosted on flickr


New D.C. streetcars are on display through May 8th, 2010.
Photo Gallery: http://www.flickr.com/photos/beyondd...00098562/show/

More at DCist:
http://dcist.com/2010/05/click_click...its_modern.php
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