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Old June 26th, 2014, 03:55 AM   #4221
Msradell
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This project is a mess.
Certainly close to it! I wonder who is eating all the extra $'s when parts don't fit right? They could have built the building twice already if everything fit correctly the 1st time. Assuming the design was done with CAD which I have to believe it was the problems have to be the result of fabrication or erection errors. I wouldn't want to be the one trying to figure out who pays for what!
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Old June 26th, 2014, 03:56 AM   #4222
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this seems to be a trend with spanish architects and large ornate structure
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Old June 26th, 2014, 05:53 AM   #4223
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Looking back on it, I think they could of made a architectural masterpiece using cubes/rectangles and the transportation hub would be done.
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Old June 26th, 2014, 05:55 AM   #4224
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Nothing would ever compare to what's being built now. This is a true masterpiece and a one-of-a-kind, making it an immediate landmark in NYC once it's all done. Sure, it may be taking a while, but the reward will be truly remarkable. Good things come to those that wait.
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Old June 26th, 2014, 06:34 AM   #4225
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What a complicated structure to build. What could be the length of the largest rafter of the Hub?
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Old June 26th, 2014, 06:34 AM   #4226
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~190 feet
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Old June 26th, 2014, 09:02 AM   #4227
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Wow! And IMO it's one of the most interesting structures U/C, because of it's complexity and unique design
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Old June 26th, 2014, 12:46 PM   #4228
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!!...The real problem is that the P.A. Is running that project with public funding.Give that mess to Durst or Tishman and we probably go together to the grand opening in about six months.That project has NOTHING unique or particularly complex(all over Europe you can find Calatrava's works)As a reminder,more than a century ago,the Eiffel Tower was built in ....2 years!!
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Old June 26th, 2014, 04:35 PM   #4229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemeroscopium View Post
!!...The real problem is that the P.A. Is running that project with public funding.Give that mess to Durst or Tishman and we probably go together to the grand opening in about six months.That project has NOTHING unic or particularly complex(all over Europe you can find Calatrava's works)As a reminder,more than a century ago,the Eiffel Tower was built in ....2 years!!
You sound like someone who doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. Calatrava's projects have a long history of running way over budget and construction problems all around the world and he's been sued in several countries for these issues.
This is an infinitely complex construction site and the hub's design very unique and organic. Regardless of management it's a building that's insanely difficult to build.

Btw Tishman has been the construction manager of One World Trade. It took longer than half a year.
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Old June 26th, 2014, 05:28 PM   #4230
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You sound like someone who doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. Calatrava's projects have a long history of running way over budget and construction problems all around the world and he's been sued in several countries for these issues.
This is an infinitely complex construction site and the hub's design very unique and organic. Regardless of management it's a building that's insanely difficult to build.

Btw Tishman has been the construction manager of One World Trade. It took longer than half a year.
Your poor statement witnesses YOU are the one who is ignorant!
First,Calatrava had issues(like most of the world renown artichects) mainly in is native city of Valencia.
Second,you know obviously nothing about architecture and this project has nothing especially complex nor unique(do you lobby for the PA or for Skanska?)
And to finish,about One WTC,Tishman was only a contractor and we're gona see if he builds at the same pace his own project the"Hudson Spire".
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Old June 26th, 2014, 05:33 PM   #4231
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No, you don't know what you're talking about. How do you know if this is complex or not? Do you work at the project, no. I can assure it's one of the most complex structures in North America. Nothing Calatrava designs is easy to build.
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Old June 26th, 2014, 05:36 PM   #4232
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I doubt it would meet its completion deadline of December 17, 2015.

Looks like late 2016 or early 2017 before its finished.
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Old June 27th, 2014, 01:15 AM   #4233
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It is complicated, and one of a kind. The steel you see here is not common on most construction projects. I wouldn't say a mess, though.
Let me make it clear that my statement about the project being a mess no way implies that those working on it are responsible for, what I view as, the mess. I agree that the project is complicated and and as such has a slow construction process.

When I follow the directions on an IKEA assembly diagram and I get to the awkward part where you have to push, twist, turn and wear an exclamation point on your head, I categorize that as a mess too.

I'm guessing the engineers would love if it were that easy.
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Old June 27th, 2014, 01:18 AM   #4234
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With all of the tools that the construction industry has ranging from CAD to create drawings that can be assembled and disassembled in 3-D images before parts are ever made to computer-controlled machines to build the parts I really don't understand why things don't fit better together in the field! As pointed out by a previous poster, the Eiffel Tower was built over 100 years ago without the benefit of any of today's modern technology yet it only took 2 years to build! Over 70 years ago the Pentagon, is still one of the world's largest buildings at 6.5 million square feet was built in 16 months, again without the benefit of today's modern technology! It certainly seems like the human factor gets in the way more these days with people not committed to making things work like they used to. It applies to this building as well as others in this complex as well as others in the world but it does seem that the ones in America have the most problems!
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Old June 27th, 2014, 02:04 AM   #4235
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PATH work continues @WTC Transportation Hub


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Old June 27th, 2014, 04:49 AM   #4236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msradell View Post
With all of the tools that the construction industry has ranging from CAD to create drawings that can be assembled and disassembled in 3-D images before parts are ever made to computer-controlled machines to build the parts I really don't understand why things don't fit better together in the field! As pointed out by a previous poster, the Eiffel Tower was built over 100 years ago without the benefit of any of today's modern technology yet it only took 2 years to build! Over 70 years ago the Pentagon, is still one of the world's largest buildings at 6.5 million square feet was built in 16 months, again without the benefit of today's modern technology! It certainly seems like the human factor gets in the way more these days with people not committed to making things work like they used to. It applies to this building as well as others in this complex as well as others in the world but it does seem that the ones in America have the most problems!
Both of those examples are of simple construction. In order to achieve the desired look, this structure is comprised of massive pieces, all if which are unique. I've posted a list of reasons before but just consider these few: the pieces change size and shape depending on the time of day due to air temperature, exposure to sun, etc. As weight is loaded onto the structure it changes shape. During fabrication, pieces this large will change dimensions due to temperature. Even 0.01% shrinkage can be significant on large pieces. On simple, non-artistic structures the design allows for that slop using bolted junctions that can be enlarged or shrunk as needed. This structure is intended to show no such gaps.
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Old June 27th, 2014, 04:53 AM   #4237
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Molto bello, regazzi!
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Old June 27th, 2014, 05:24 AM   #4238
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Molto bello, regazzi!
ciao signor, sei adesso italiano?
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Old June 27th, 2014, 06:00 AM   #4239
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Molto bello, regazzi!
tutte queste strutture al centro del commercio mondiale sono meravigliosi.
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Old June 27th, 2014, 06:56 AM   #4240
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Both of those examples are of simple construction. In order to achieve the desired look, this structure is comprised of massive pieces, all if which are unique. I've posted a list of reasons before but just consider these few: the pieces change size and shape depending on the time of day due to air temperature, exposure to sun, etc. As weight is loaded onto the structure it changes shape. During fabrication, pieces this large will change dimensions due to temperature. Even 0.01% shrinkage can be significant on large pieces. On simple, non-artistic structures the design allows for that slop using bolted junctions that can be enlarged or shrunk as needed. This structure is intended to show no such gaps.
All of your reasons are nothing but excuses for poor design and manufacturing. The expanding and contracting with temperature changes should to be an issue because both of the parts are kept in the same area so they both should be either expanding or shrinking relative to each other. If it's that big a problem the entire structure will self-destruct in several years with weather changes! I've worked in fabrication shops where the tolerances we held with so critical that we couldn't even open the door during the machining process or parts wouldn't match up. I've worked in the field installations with tolerances that are many times tighter than what's required for this structure. In reality for this structure only the 2 adjoining pieces have to meet, there is actually no critical fit between me of the pieces such as slip fits or interference fits. The design of this project, the manufacturing of sections and the assembly have many problems that could be easily avoided if true engineering processes had been applied.
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