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Old July 1st, 2014, 01:38 AM   #4281
LastConformist
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Originally Posted by Msradell View Post
For once I'll defend the NYPD on this issue. They didn't come up with the extravagant design with a soaring open-space and huge wings. What they did was request changes to make sure that the design was safe in the event of the worst possible thing happening. If the original design of the structure had been much more simplistic this building would not be as complex nor expensive.
Sorry, this is just wrong. The NYPD were obsessed with the towers falling on the Hub, causing it to collapse. Which is frankly ridiculous. Even in the event that something exactly like 9/11 happens again, the towers aren't going to topple over without notice. No one died on the ground when the WTC collapsed. Plenty of people died in the buildings, mainly because they were trapped, but there was plenty of time to evacuate the vicinity. And that was a very extreme circumstance, deeply unlikely to ever reoccur.

If the NYPD were serious about safety, they would be furious with the Port Authority for its one-exit temporary PATH station that even now would be an extremely easy terrorist target (block or obstruct the only exit and you could trap a thousand people underground at rush hour, easily). But they're not serious about safety, they're just serious about the appearance of doing something. (To be fair to the current NYPD, these decisions were made about a decade ago--but the Port Authority's combined obsession with security (an appalling 25% of their budget!) and insistence that their temporary station is safely designed is ridiculous.)
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Old July 1st, 2014, 02:28 AM   #4282
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No one died on the ground when the WTC collapsed.
a lot of people died on the ground when the towers collapsed. mainly because they weren't fast enough to run away from the dust and debris cloud and ended up dying from inhaling that air.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 03:36 AM   #4283
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Originally Posted by LastConformist View Post
Sorry, this is just wrong. The NYPD were obsessed with the towers falling on the Hub
Your speculation is one of the reasons I don't like to disclose this type of details. I'll keep my mouth shut and enjoy it for myself.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 06:36 AM   #4284
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a lot of people died on the ground when the towers collapsed. mainly because they weren't fast enough to run away from the dust and debris cloud and ended up dying from inhaling that air.
People who died months or years later from smoke/soot inhalation didn't die from having the towers fall on them, so that's neither here nor there.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 11:17 AM   #4285
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Originally Posted by LastConformist View Post
If the NYPD were serious about safety, they would be furious with the Port Authority for its one-exit temporary PATH station that even now would be an extremely easy terrorist target (block or obstruct the only exit and you could trap a thousand people underground at rush hour, easily).

Not exactly. There's the passage to the WFC.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 11:23 AM   #4286
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How will they fix number 6?

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Old July 1st, 2014, 01:44 PM   #4287
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wow, that second intermediate tube is severely misaligned....and the one below is welded up and the one beyond seems to have decent alignment.

i have heard the stories about the fit up issues they are having....
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Old July 1st, 2014, 03:35 PM   #4288
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Originally Posted by robbie42 View Post
Not exactly. There's the passage to the WFC.
There's only one exit from fare control. Then, once you're out of fare control, you can turn right or left, which defeats the safety purpose of multiple exits entirely if you've already created a bottleneck. In any case, the WFC passageway opened *ten years* after the temporary station.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 04:37 PM   #4289
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Too bad everyone is attacking Otie or the NYPD for something that happened years ago.

The new Path hall and the basement of the WTC is escentially a bunker and that's a good thing when it comes to safety, not only from terrorism but also for other kinds of disasters as an earthquake or another hurricane.

Many don't like the idea of a bunker because it is too expensive, but that money was already spent years ago and that's my point. Like some said, the billions it costed include the basement for all of the towers, the VSC and the memorial. The custom-made ribs were all manufactured a long time ago and are in a deposit somewhere, being periodically delivered here. So the best thing to do is to keep building the thing and finish it up so it can live up to the billions it costed, instead of keep complaining about the price.

Does it looks like a stegosaurus? Yeah.
Do I like it? Actually I prefer it how it looks now than what was on the previous renderings with less ibs and more glass. Somehow I prefer to think that those ribs are not going to fall over or the shards of glass end-up killing thousands of people. And, the "stegosaurus", as shown by Otie's renderings or the Westfield ones, is far more elegant than the glass-steel thing that existed in the first renderings.

So please Otie, don't abandon us and keep showing us how incredible the building of the WTC is.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 05:17 PM   #4290
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#12 NW rafter went up. 21 rafters installed in total now.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 05:47 PM   #4291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msradell View Post
For once I'll defend the NYPD on this issue. They didn't come up with the extravagant design with a soaring open-space and huge wings. What they did was request changes to make sure that the design was safe in the event of the worst possible thing happening. If the original design of the structure had been much more simplistic this building would not be as complex nor expensive.
Its not their job to dictate what is safe. Its their job to patrol what is there.

Just for the record, I love the Transit Hall and how its shaping up ... but I don't like NYPD meddling in general.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 07:21 PM   #4292
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Originally Posted by Riley1066 View Post
Its not their job to dictate what is safe. Its their job to patrol what is there.

Just for the record, I love the Transit Hall and how its shaping up ... but I don't like NYPD meddling in general.
Nobody wants opinions on here, just facts. Lets allow Otie and the other great contributors to this site to educate us in the progress of this excellent building without fear of retribution on people's opinions.
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Old July 1st, 2014, 11:08 PM   #4293
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Nobody wants opinions on here, just facts. Lets allow Otie and the other great contributors to this site to educate us in the progress of this excellent building without fear of retribution on people's opinions.
What the hell are you talking about??Everybody should feel free to release his opinions and feelings!As long as i am respectful and on topic i don't need a Goering like dude to care about by education.It is a forum,a place where people exchange thoughts and informations.Of course everybody appreciate Otie.s posts but he seems to be a professional!There is also that guy VerticalGotham who has always great tips and that one from New York(i forget the name)who release incredible pics;Nevertheless,most of the folks here have only their passion for architecture to communicate also please
give us a break!!
And by the way,a thought for that guy Zensteeldude;i was about sixteen at that time,reading SSC as a guest...Zen was a master.
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Old July 2nd, 2014, 12:39 AM   #4294
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I'm wondering why they continued putting up the south side rafters after the purlin connecting #5 and #6 is so misaligned. You would think that would throw off all the rafters following.
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Old July 2nd, 2014, 03:57 AM   #4295
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I think they didn't pay attention to the alignment of #6 before installing it.
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Old July 2nd, 2014, 04:05 AM   #4296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemeroscopium View Post
What the hell are you talking about??Everybody should feel free to release his opinions and feelings!As long as i am respectful and on topic i don't need a Goering like dude to care about by education.It is a forum,a place where people exchange thoughts and informations.Of course everybody appreciate Otie.s posts but he seems to be a professional!There is also that guy VerticalGotham who has always great tips and that one from New York(i forget the name)who release incredible pics;Nevertheless,most of the folks here have only their passion for architecture to communicate also please
give us a break!!
And by the way,a thought for that guy Zensteeldude;i was about sixteen at that time,reading SSC as a guest...Zen was a master.
I've read alot of Zen's post aswell.

Shame he passed.
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Old July 2nd, 2014, 04:44 AM   #4297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weidncol View Post
I'm wondering why they continued putting up the south side rafters after the purlin connecting #5 and #6 is so misaligned. You would think that would throw off all the rafters following.
There are similar adjustment issues on US Navy ships that literally get hammered into alignment.
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Old July 2nd, 2014, 05:51 AM   #4298
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hi, i made a somewhat accurate model.
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Old July 2nd, 2014, 05:55 AM   #4299
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Very nice first post! Welcome to SSC.
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Old July 2nd, 2014, 10:12 AM   #4300
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andymillman that's nice! but I think you made a mistake... can you spot it?



[IMG]http://oi61.************/261jkie.jpg[/IMG]this image by Otie
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