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Old May 12th, 2010, 12:42 AM   #61
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Im surprised to be writing this, but I think the best proposal won actually!
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Old May 12th, 2010, 08:17 AM   #62
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Thanks Nixon for an excellent update.

Really disappointing that the other 2 offices didn’t manage to deliver.

I think that both Snøhetta and Libeskind look much better in Nixon’s pictures. They are more edgy then the winning proposal and the more I look at the Libeskind proposal the more I like it. If they just would have done something more with that high-rise they would have received my vote. Still, all things considered I think the best proposal won and I hope that the small “boxy buildings” in the upper right corner as I.R Baboon call them will be built as a block and not as a couple of ”punkthus”. I also hope that the high-rise will be 2 ¾ of a cigarette pack and not 1 ¾ as it is now.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 08:30 AM   #63
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I also would like to express my gratitude for the fine imagery provided.

Personally, I prefer the Liebeskind proposal. I believe the main focus should be to make a concert hall that will stand out. Regarding the density of the buildings and the urban atmosphere, we need to remember that these are not final drawings. They can and will change before the shovel hits the dirt. The most appealing quality of the winning proposal was the entrance and entrance bridge. Such a bridge could be added to the Liebeskind proposal as well.

What scares me in the SHL proposal is that a lot of the appeal is created by lighting. A bit like the Entre building which looks really nice in the evenings between october and february but is otherwise a box with a 60's glass cover.

"That which we call a shoe-box, by any other name would look as dull."
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Old May 12th, 2010, 09:16 AM   #64
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I agree totally with you smastad. It really feels like malmö already have got enough of box-shaped buildings. I think both other proposals would have had a longer lifespan (from a design point of view) and might have been a better investment even if they cost more to construct. Liebeskind is my favourite as well...

I also have high hopes for the whole area next to the water however. The strongest part of the SHL-proposal imho...
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Old May 12th, 2010, 10:09 AM   #65
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I agree that we have enough boxy buildings (I love the new emergency ward, or Tietgenkollegiet... look what a circular building can do to a neighborhood!), and I generally like opera houses and concert halls to be challenging and bold buildings like the Liebeskind and Snöhetta proposals we see here.

But not in locations such as Neptuniparken.

It works in Sydney, Oslo etc, imo because as they're situated they're not in anyone's way. But since Malmö is striving to connect (both irl and in people's minds) VH to the rest of the city (of which Universitetsholmen is the area doing just that) I think it just wouldn't work with such a building.

Like some here have observed, both losing proposals waste a lot of valuable inner city space (with their sloping walls and roofs) whereas SHL actively seek to attract people to the area, even if it's just as a shortcut on the way to another destination. I think that shows in the design, as opposed to the other proposals.

I believe that Snöhetta's and Liebeskind's proposals would be perceived somewhat as barriers if they were to be built, much like the windmill factory and Malmömässan, simply because they're big and, more importantly, don't connect to their surroundings very well (especially since they don't seem to address the problem with one side being more of a back side than the others, a barrier as good as any). It is an urban area, lots and lots of people work and study there and live nearby. Makes sense to choose the proposal which promotes that aspect the most.

If Malmö Stad decided to build at the northern tip of VH, which was discussed a few years back iirc, I would definitely cast my vote on one of the other two. As it stands, I think the right proposal won.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 11:42 AM   #66
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Hmm, kom igen nu gubbar nu ska vi inte gråta över spilld mjölk.
Med vinnaren får Malmö nästan tre HH,
och de står i sin tur i en mycket snygg trappeffekt, den trappeffekten går sen igen i de små boxarna i det nord-västra hörnet, om en i mindre skala.
Och sen så mycket volym Malmö får för pengarna, är det något som alltid kraftigt drar ner känslan av urbanitet i norden så är det bristen på tät bebyggelse...
De andra förslagen gav för mycket av "tomt-torg-känsla", lite i millionprogram-stil,
/Ses

Last edited by denvise; May 12th, 2010 at 12:05 PM.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 11:47 AM   #67
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Tomt torg som är fint att titta på på avstånd, men lite ödsligt sådär att besöka.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 12:00 PM   #68
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juxta I totaly agree, you just mention the exact thing I was thinking on but to lazy to write......

and about the height of the tallest building, I spoke yesterday to a Skanska representative present at the exhibition and he told me that the height of the tallest building is 75m but since there are some conference floors at the buttom of the building it could turn out even 80m tall when finished. so I guess it turns out to be almost 2 cigarette pack high..

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Old May 12th, 2010, 12:18 PM   #69
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Good to hear that there is a chance of almost 2 cigarette packs but how about 2 packages of Marlboro 100's I will call Skanska and ask them.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 12:28 PM   #70
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Can a mod change the title to;

MALMÖ | Counterpoint | ~2 cigarette packs | 21fl | Pro
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Old May 12th, 2010, 12:32 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by staff View Post
Can a mod change the title to;

Reload this Page MALMÖ | Counterpoint | ~2 cigarette packs | 21fl | Pro


I called Skanska and they guy I spoked to didn't smoke but he used "snus" instead and suggested 2 "snus dosor" on top of each other but I said that was not good enough...

From now on I will get back on topic, sorry
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Old May 12th, 2010, 12:35 PM   #72
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nixon
Glad I could be of assistance
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Old May 12th, 2010, 02:25 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [juxtaposition] View Post
I agree that we have enough boxy buildings (I love the new emergency ward, or Tietgenkollegiet... look what a circular building can do to a neighborhood!), and I generally like opera houses and concert halls to be challenging and bold buildings like the Liebeskind and Snöhetta proposals we see here.

But not in locations such as Neptuniparken.

It works in Sydney, Oslo etc, imo because as they're situated they're not in anyone's way. But since Malmö is striving to connect (both irl and in people's minds) VH to the rest of the city (of which Universitetsholmen is the area doing just that) I think it just wouldn't work with such a building.

Like some here have observed, both losing proposals waste a lot of valuable inner city space (with their sloping walls and roofs) whereas SHL actively seek to attract people to the area, even if it's just as a shortcut on the way to another destination. I think that shows in the design, as opposed to the other proposals.

I believe that Snöhetta's and Liebeskind's proposals would be perceived somewhat as barriers if they were to be built, much like the windmill factory and Malmömässan, simply because they're big and, more importantly, don't connect to their surroundings very well (especially since they don't seem to address the problem with one side being more of a back side than the others, a barrier as good as any). It is an urban area, lots and lots of people work and study there and live nearby. Makes sense to choose the proposal which promotes that aspect the most.

If Malmö Stad decided to build at the northern tip of VH, which was discussed a few years back iirc, I would definitely cast my vote on one of the other two. As it stands, I think the right proposal won.
As it happens, I agree with your arguments. However, most of the "fringe buildings" seems to be just decorative 3D objects created as a back-drop rather than anything else. The SHL cubes reminded me of some useless but decorative glass candle holders from Duka. These fringe buildings will decide a lot of the interaction with the surrounding blocks and - since they don't seem anywhere near a finished state yet - I at least am reluctant to have an opinion on that particular issue. Look at Kronprinsen for instance (also Fältöversten in Stockholm) that is built as a huge ... well, box. It is surrounded by lower buildings that obscure the high-rise from a street level and connects with the surrounding closed block structure. Without knowing how the shops around it would be formed, there is no way of deciding how it interacts with it's surroundings.

Nevertheless, I do (and did) agree that SHLs idea had good qualities in that respect, primarily created by the angular bridge. Even with that, there will be scarce possibilities to take a shortcut while remaining dry.

Regarding the wasting of valuable inner-city space, I'm not sure. The whole of Malmö is built with rather a special combination of wasted space and dense areas.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 10:57 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by staff View Post
Can a mod change the title to;

MALMÖ | Counterpoint | ~2 cigarette packs | 21fl | Pro
LOL

I like both this one and Libeskind, even though I get a feeling that SHL uses the space better. Libeskind seems more spectacular, but I'm sure the winning one will work out great too.
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Old May 13th, 2010, 10:14 PM   #75
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Congrats Malmö, a really great project! Personally, I think Libeskind had the clearly the best proposal, but all of them was worthy winners
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Old May 13th, 2010, 11:39 PM   #76
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The jury's decision (full text) can be found here: http://malmo.se/Medborgare/Stadsplan...files/KKH1.pdf

The winning proposal has obviously been updated and remodeled since then. On an interesting note; Libeskind was the first proposal to be eliminated.
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Old May 14th, 2010, 08:38 AM   #77
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It is interesting to see the old version of the winning proposal and I am glad that they have remodeled the winning proposal. It looks awful in the original renderings.
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Old May 22nd, 2010, 11:02 AM   #78
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TRIOLOGI - Konsert, kongress och hotell - Neptuni, Malmö

Pictures Krook & Tjäder











Quote:
Krook & Tjäder har tillsammans med Baumschlager & Eberle utarbetat ett förslag till Malmös kommande konsert- och kongressanläggning i Neptuniparken.
http://www.krook.tjader.se/
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Old May 22nd, 2010, 11:06 AM   #79
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Thanks for sharing. This one was apparently disqualified for not having met the basic requirements or something.
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Old May 22nd, 2010, 11:10 AM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by staff View Post

Thanks for sharing. This one was apparently disqualified for not having met the basic requirements or something.

Yes and it doesn't look particulary nice, it reminds me of something else, can't remember what though!

The winner is the best one big time!
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