Seattle Development News 8 - Page 92

LCIII · February 27th, 2012, 11:15 PM

Too bad he lost his balls in the great recession.

mSeattle · February 28th, 2012, 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bond James Bond

I actually agree with him somewhat on the apartment building frenzy. Where did I read recently that apartment vacancies in the Seattle metro are going up?

Not that I want a short office building there, I think he could have thought of something else. Maybe even just sit on the parcel for a while.

Bond, those might be condos or highest-end luxury apartment vacancies. I think that's the clientele he's after. The demand for more affordable units is very much still there and will grow.

mhays · February 28th, 2012, 04:08 AM

Per Times, Holland might start 40-story 815 Pine apartments in "late spring." Would love to see that. Phenomenal site for them, and very helpful for that side of Downtown. Also increasing unit count to 386 while reducing parking spaces. Parking was 279 spaces at one point.

InlandEmpire · February 28th, 2012, 04:25 AM

That would be great! I've always been a big fan of that project, it's a big one!

WESTSEATTLEGUY · February 28th, 2012, 05:01 AM

Was that the one catty corner from the defunct AVA?

InlandEmpire · February 28th, 2012, 05:26 AM

It is- here's the link to the project architect's website. It's a big building...

http://www.bumgardner.biz/projects/the-815-pine-tower/

CityView Jim · February 28th, 2012, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mhays

Per Times, Holland might start 40-story 815 Pine apartments in "late spring." Would love to see that. Phenomenal site for them, and very helpful for that side of Downtown. Also increasing unit count to 386 while reducing parking spaces. Parking was 279 spaces at one point.

I am starting to wonder if the building of apartments is becoming too much for the renter market to absorb. Lots and lots of units!! Then again, someone may know something I don't!

JiminyCricket · February 28th, 2012, 05:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CityView Jim

I am starting to wonder if the building of apartments is becoming too much for the renter market to absorb. Lots and lots of units!! Then again, someone may know something I don't!

Who cares? That means lower prices for the renters. Overbuilding apartments doesn't have the same economy ramifications as overbuilding homes/condos. Lower rents means more disposable income for the neighborhoods they're in.

Just part of the cycle, overbuild, let the renter market catch up, then overbuild again.

***Bond James Bond*** · February 28th, 2012, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mSeattle

Bond, those might be condos or highest-end luxury apartment vacancies. I think that's the clientele he's after. The demand for more affordable units is very much still there and will grow.

A spot like that would *not* go for affordable units.

And anyway, the rental vacancy stat I saw was for ... everything.

mhays · February 28th, 2012, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CityView Jim

I am starting to wonder if the building of apartments is becoming too much for the renter market to absorb. Lots and lots of units!! Then again, someone may know something I don't!

Maybe. But as a metro we still have relatively few housing units under construction overall. It's just that they're mostly apartments, and most are in core Seattle neighborhoods.

In the case of this project, it would go up against whatever crop of very close-in projects opens in 2014. That's in contrast to a lot of stuff that will open in 2012 and 2013, often in more distant areas like LQA, SLU, and Capitol Hill.

royal rose1 · February 28th, 2012, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mhays

Maybe. But as a metro we still have relatively few housing units under construction overall. It's just that they're mostly apartments, and most are in core Seattle neighborhoods.

In the case of this project, it would go up against whatever crop of very close-in projects opens in 2014. That's in contrast to a lot of stuff that will open in 2012 and 2013, often in more distant areas like LQA, SLU, and Capitol Hill.

Seattle has the second best housing market in terms of "days houses go before being sold" in the US. There is obviously an incredible amount of demand in Seattle for housing, I think downtown is relatively undeveloped right now in terms of housing, and obviously, Seattle being the amazing city it is, has a long way to go before it will have saturated its own housing market downtown.

CityView Jim · February 28th, 2012, 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by royal rose1

Seattle has the second best housing market in terms of "days houses go before being sold" in the US. There is obviously an incredible amount of demand in Seattle for housing, I think downtown is relatively undeveloped right now in terms of housing, and obviously, Seattle being the amazing city it is, has a long way to go before it will have saturated its own housing market downtown.

It's more a matter of condo construction financing. Builders can't get it. Homeowners can't get it. No one's building with their own money. Things will have to change before condos are built again on a large scale.

***Bond James Bond*** · February 28th, 2012, 08:53 AM

I added 815 Pine to the front page - and put it near the top of the "proposed" section since it sounds like it'll start construction soon.

LCIII · February 28th, 2012, 08:59 AM

The Martin should be moved to Under Construction, 8th and Seneca rendering needs to be updated to the current version and 2nd and Pike should be moved up the list as well.

Thanks Bond

bulabog jalaur · February 28th, 2012, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiminyCricket

Who cares? That means lower prices for the renters. Overbuilding apartments doesn't have the same economy ramifications as overbuilding homes/condos. Lower rents means more disposable income for the neighborhoods they're in.

Just part of the cycle, overbuild, let the renter market catch up, then overbuild again.

Agree!

InlandEmpire · February 28th, 2012, 06:19 PM

I agree too- rent prices in most of the newer construction buildings (and even the older ones now) downtown and in the adjacent neighborhoods is getting awfully steep. It would be nice to see some incentives and competition again to get things a little more in line with what people earn.

mhays · February 28th, 2012, 06:41 PM

New construction won't get any cheaper unless there's a bust, which would stop construction. Right now, construction prices and financing are both dirt cheap.

Reducing/eliminating parking requirements has been a massive improvement in making things more affordable...that's a huge reason for what's been getting built lately and what's planned. It's cutting often a double-digit percentage off the cost of everything built. It's also related to the fact that central neighborhoods (which have reduced/eliminated requirements) are getting most of the construction so far.

Our housing levy is pretty rare.

But as always, affordability is served by older buildings, not new ones.

Matt the Engineer · February 28th, 2012, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mhays

But as always, affordability is served by older buildings, not new ones.

Every new home means one more family can afford to live in Seattle. The low income residents might be moving into the older buildings, but that's just because the people that used to live there moved into the new ones.

LCIII · February 28th, 2012, 08:50 PM

Its funny for me to see people complaining about rent costs but compared to NYC and DC where I lived before coming here the rents are cheap! At the end of the day it costs a pretty penny to live in nice spaces in desireable locations. Thats just the way it is.

InlandEmpire · February 28th, 2012, 09:08 PM

Fair enough, but I don't think I'd say Seattle is 'cheap', at least not outside of the NYC, DC, SF, Bostons out there. My apartment rent has moved from somewhat reasonable to definite mortgage payment territory in a short time, and wages are not growing nearly as quickly as rent. Anyway, I'll be glad to see some more options out there.

February 28th, 2012, 08:53 AM	#1833
*Bond James Bond* Licence to kill. Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Apple Maggot Quarantine Area Posts: 6,996	I added 815 Pine to the front page - and put it near the top of the "proposed" section since it sounds like it'll start construction soon. __________________ Please DO NOT "like" any of my posts or request "friend" status. I don't care if you like me, or my posts. Thank you. - If you do either of these more than once you will be put on my ignore list.

February 28th, 2012, 06:41 PM	#1837
mhays Journeyman Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 8,394 Likes (Received): 119	New construction won't get any cheaper unless there's a bust, which would stop construction. Right now, construction prices and financing are both dirt cheap. Reducing/eliminating parking requirements has been a massive improvement in making things more affordable...that's a huge reason for what's been getting built lately and what's planned. It's cutting often a double-digit percentage off the cost of everything built. It's also related to the fact that central neighborhoods (which have reduced/eliminated requirements) are getting most of the construction so far. Our housing levy is pretty rare. But as always, affordability is served by older buildings, not new ones. Last edited by mhays; February 28th, 2012 at 06:48 PM.

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February 27th, 2012, 11:15 PM	#1821
LCIII Registered User Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 2,871 Likes (Received): 64	Too bad he lost his balls in the great recession.

February 28th, 2012, 04:08 AM	#1823
mhays Journeyman Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 8,394 Likes (Received): 119	Per Times, Holland might start 40-story 815 Pine apartments in "late spring." Would love to see that. Phenomenal site for them, and very helpful for that side of Downtown. Also increasing unit count to 386 while reducing parking spaces. Parking was 279 spaces at one point.

February 28th, 2012, 04:25 AM	#1824
InlandEmpire Mixologist Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 197 Likes (Received): 0	That would be great! I've always been a big fan of that project, it's a big one!

February 28th, 2012, 05:01 AM	#1825
WESTSEATTLEGUY Here Join Date: May 2007 Location: Seattle/Chicago Posts: 2,016 Likes (Received): 7	Was that the one catty corner from the defunct AVA?

February 28th, 2012, 05:26 AM	#1826
InlandEmpire Mixologist Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 197 Likes (Received): 0	It is- here's the link to the project architect's website. It's a big building... http://www.bumgardner.biz/projects/the-815-pine-tower/

February 28th, 2012, 08:59 AM	#1834
LCIII Registered User Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 2,871 Likes (Received): 64	The Martin should be moved to Under Construction, 8th and Seneca rendering needs to be updated to the current version and 2nd and Pike should be moved up the list as well. Thanks Bond

February 28th, 2012, 06:19 PM	#1836
InlandEmpire Mixologist Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 197 Likes (Received): 0	I agree too- rent prices in most of the newer construction buildings (and even the older ones now) downtown and in the adjacent neighborhoods is getting awfully steep. It would be nice to see some incentives and competition again to get things a little more in line with what people earn.

February 28th, 2012, 08:50 PM	#1839
LCIII Registered User Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 2,871 Likes (Received): 64	Its funny for me to see people complaining about rent costs but compared to NYC and DC where I lived before coming here the rents are cheap! At the end of the day it costs a pretty penny to live in nice spaces in desireable locations. Thats just the way it is.

February 28th, 2012, 09:08 PM	#1840
InlandEmpire Mixologist Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 197 Likes (Received): 0	Fair enough, but I don't think I'd say Seattle is 'cheap', at least not outside of the NYC, DC, SF, Bostons out there. My apartment rent has moved from somewhat reasonable to definite mortgage payment territory in a short time, and wages are not growing nearly as quickly as rent. Anyway, I'll be glad to see some more options out there.