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Old June 8th, 2005, 03:18 AM   #21
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weve had this in notts for years
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Old June 12th, 2005, 02:25 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertigo
Does any of you have a picture of passenger information displays on London bus stops?

This is an example from the Netherlands:



I took a picture with my phone on Friday evening on my way out to greenwich.

The display shows only one bus as the other bus at that stop was currently at the stop.

It was reasonably accurate in my opinion.
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Old June 12th, 2005, 03:58 PM   #23
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It's interesting that following this anouncement there is also discussion to fit all cars with satalite tracking systems and tax cars on distance travelled with certain times of day and certain roads being more expenisvely priced.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 07:01 AM   #24
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Goodbye to London's Routemasters!

London Bids Farewell to Routemaster Buses
By JILL LAWLESS, Associated Press Writer
Thu Dec 8, 2:34 PM ET



LONDON - After half a century, London's red Routemaster buses are rattling into retirement. Thousands of fans said farewell to the hop-on, hop-off buses Thursday, the last full day of regular service for the icon that has been the subject of thousands of tourists' photographs and postcards.

Transport authorities are withdrawing the blunt-nosed double-decker from its last route — the 159 from Marble Arch to Streatham Hill — on Friday. The final Routemaster was leaving central London just after noon, bound south of the river to a bus garage in Brixton.

"My experience of London is diminished by their passing," said Travis Elborough, author of the Routemaster book "The Bus We Loved."

Many Londoners agree. In a poll last month for the city's Evening Standard newspaper, 81 percent opposed scrapping the Routemaster.

But city transport bosses say the venerable vehicle cannot accommodate disabled people and must be replaced by more user-friendly buses. Some of the replacements are doubledecker, but don't allow people to get on or off while the bus is moving.

"We want to provide the most modern, fully accessible safest buses we can," Transport for London spokesman Stephen Webb said. "It's not romantic, but it works."

The bus is not disappearing completely. Sixteen Routemasters, restored to gleaming 1960s glory, will remain on two "heritage routes" that run through central London between 9:30 a.m. and 6:30 p.m.

But its demise as part of everyday London life has triggered an outpouring of nostalgia. The British Broadcasting Corp. is running an evening of TV programs Saturday celebrating the bus. Composer Tom Smail has created "Requiem for the Routemaster," an orchestral piece that evokes the throb of an engine, the tinkle of a bell and the zip of a conductor's ticket machine.

"It's actually more of an 'in memoriam,'" Smail told BBC radio. "So you have the sadness, and you have the joy of being on a bus."

The snub-nosed, open-backed Routemaster entered service in the mid-1950s as a replacement for electric trolley buses. It was the last bus to be designed specifically for London, by engineers who had worked on World War II bombers. Supporters say its light but durable aluminum frame, fuel efficiency and easy-to-repair components make it a classic piece of British design.

Travelers appreciate the conductors who dispense tickets — and offer travel information — once passengers are seated.

By the 1960s, the scarlet bus had become a symbol of vitality in a city reviving after years of postwar austerity. The 1966 Time magazine cover celebrating "Swinging London" featured a Routemaster.

"The Routemaster is a child of austerity, but it comes into its own in the late '50s and early '60s, when London is becoming a much more polychromatic city — the Kodak-color, James Bond, color-supplement London," said Elborough. "It becomes an embodiment of London at that point."

The long-lived bus has been condemned and reprieved in the past.

The first warning sign came in the early 1980s, with the introduction of a bigger, boxier double-decker operated by a driver alone.

In 1996, London transport authorities said the Routemaster would be phased out within five years because modern safety regulations frowned on the hop-on, hop-off platform at the back. Many a Londoner has suffered a twisted ankle, or worse, while making an unauthorized exit between stops.

A potential savior appeared in the person of Ken Livingstone, a populist Cockney who in 2000 became London's first elected mayor. In 2001, Livingstone said that "only some ghastly dehumanized moron would want to get rid of the Routemaster."

During Livingstone's first term, old Routemasters were refurbished, and fans hoped they would stay in service at least until 2016, the deadline for making all buses wheelchair-accessible under
European Union rules.

But in 2003, Routemasters began disappearing, replaced by newer double-deckers or even by single-decked, articulated behemoths known as "bendy buses." Two years ago, there were still 500 Routemasters running in London; after Friday, there will be only the 16 "heritage" vehicles.

Fans see their passing as a missed opportunity to preserve a bit of London's heritage.

"We live in an era where brands are constantly reinvented — new VW Beetles, new Minis, new London cabs," said Elborough. "It's just a shame that we are losing this key piece of London vernacular."
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Old December 9th, 2005, 09:11 AM   #25
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It is sad especially for people who have been with these buses their entire lives. But for the sake of the future, safety, convenience and efficiency are what is best for a city and its utilities. At least they are preserving sixteen of them!
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Old December 9th, 2005, 09:49 AM   #26
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I absolutly loved them...
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Old December 9th, 2005, 03:38 PM   #27
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This day had to come I suppose... they couldn't keep going forever

Its still very sad, but I've already done my mourning because the route I use every day (38) went 'bendy' 6 weeks ago. I'll post some pics of its last day in a bit.
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Old December 10th, 2005, 06:33 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superchan7
It is sad especially for people who have been with these buses their entire lives. But for the sake of the future, safety, convenience and efficiency are what is best for a city and its utilities. At least they are preserving sixteen of them!
Very agree with you. London still has to enter into an era of fully Low-floor buses on all the main routes.
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Old December 10th, 2005, 12:01 PM   #29
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It was even on the evening news on several German TV channels. (But they misunderstandably said that the double deckers would disappear from London.)
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Old December 10th, 2005, 12:08 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by micro
It was even on the evening news on several German TV channels. (But they misunderstandably said that the double deckers would disappear from London.)
It seens that German TV station doesn't really know the reality in London!!!
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Old December 10th, 2005, 03:59 PM   #31
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It's very sad for London as it was as iconic for the city as the London Undergroud symbol, Hackney cabs & red phone boxes.

There's at least one of these in Liverpool, I'm sure I noticed it had 12 or 13 on it'sservice board, though I can't recall exactly. It serves students for Liverpool Uni on high demand routes. I suspect there's more than one of them here, possibly two or three of them. I suspect other parts of the UK and even abroad may get hold of some of them as they're too iconic to be scrapped in my opinion.
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Old December 10th, 2005, 06:10 PM   #32
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An article from Del Spiegel (International).

Actually, I perfer this route use the Dennis Enviro or Volvo Super Olympian after the Routemasters.
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Old December 10th, 2005, 08:31 PM   #33
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Why...?
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Old December 10th, 2005, 08:40 PM   #34
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nooooo
so sad
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Old December 10th, 2005, 08:51 PM   #35
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I actually saw one today in Hemel Hempstead in amazing condition, obviously someone had bought it and done it up to how they were when made.

Very sad as I love them (how can't you) but it had to happen for many reasons. There will still be 2 routes using them on heritage routes. What I don't see is why they couldn't update the routemaster in a way that preserved their style but updated them? Hope most of them aren't replaced by nasty bendy buses and most are replaced by double deckers.
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Old December 11th, 2005, 02:54 AM   #36
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It's sad to see them go...
At least I got to ride in one in a comercial service once. And it's good they are keeping two heritage routes. That way some will still be seen on London's streets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRS
Hope most of them aren't replaced by nasty bendy buses and most are replaced by double deckers.
Why don't you like the bendy buses? I consider them more modern and better than double decker buses.
Double decker buses are more "special".. they are linked to London... But I still think the bendy buses are better buses.
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Old December 11th, 2005, 01:40 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitxofo

Why...?
The Law.

Routemasters contravene the Disability Discrimination Act (DDA) because they aren't accessible to wheelchairs. They're also 'discriminatory' towards women with children and buggies. It p*sses me off though; all disabled people get free travel, cars paid for by Social Services, Dial-a-Ride Taxis (free)... and yet despite having several better options than a bus we are still forced to scrap the RM Bus to accommodate them. Incidentally, since the #38 which I use daily went 'Bendy' 2 months ago I am yet to see a single wheelchair-bound person on one.
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Old December 11th, 2005, 01:53 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nephasto
Why don't you like the bendy buses? I consider them more modern and better than double decker buses.
Double decker buses are more "special".. they are linked to London... But I still think the bendy buses are better buses.
Bendies are shit.

Once you're on one, you're trapped until the next bus stop. Central London's traffic is a very stop-start affair and this is specifically what the RM was designed for; you could jump on and off wherever the bus is stationary. I'd say at least half the times I ever jumped on or off a RM (i.e. thousands) it was at traffic lights, you could even take advantage of traffic and run forwards to a bus in front of yours when there was a queue at a set of lights. If you grind to a halt between stops, fine... just hop off. Because so many people boarded and alighted when buses were stationary at lights anyway, dwell times at actual bus stops were minimal.

Bendies take up nearly twice as much road space as a RM, when two or three turn up at once at a stop they overwhelm it and people will often miss their bus if its at the back of the three and therefore 60m from the actual stop where they're waiting (you'll often not even see its there). Why on earth, in a city where all bridges can accommodate the passage of a double decker, would we take a step backwards and make our buses twice as long and half as tall?

Also, nobody bothers paying now as you can board anywhere and I am yet to see a single inspector.

New Double Deckers (e.g. my other local route, #19) insist that every person boarding file past the driver one by one showing tickets, the #19 route is now easily 50% slower than it was this time last year when it still had RM buses.

So, since the demise of the RM...

- Bus routes are slower (MUCH slower in some cases like the #19)
- There are fewer buses because a Bendy can pack in more people (standing)
- Buses take up more roadspace
- They are losing money hand over fist because no-one pays
- There is no flexibilty to jump on and off at lights or in traffic

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Old December 11th, 2005, 02:16 PM   #39
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I agree with Tubeman although I have seen some disabled people using the the wheel chair ramp that comes out of the bus and I have had my ticket checked on a bendy bus, although most people don't buy tickets as you say. Double deckers look better and are more linked to London and they're much easier to use and take up less space.
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Old December 11th, 2005, 03:14 PM   #40
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Nicely summed up. I agree with you tubeman, while I'm not from London I've been there enough times and traveled on enough routemaster busses to understand your arguments fully. I think there are few things more infuriating than being stuck in traffic that's not moving an inch knowing that if you could only get off the bus you'd be able to get to your destination in a quarter of the time walking.

Quote:
"We live in an era where brands are constantly reinvented — new VW Beetles, new Minis, new London cabs," said Elborough. "It's just a shame that we are losing this key piece of London vernacular."
I agree with the last comment of the article, maybe they could not have updated the current vehicles but if they had to replace them I would have thought it possible to have designed a new version. One that complies with the disability discrimination act whilst allowing people to hop on or off at their own leisure, a bus designed for London just like the routemaster. I bet it's also got a lot to do with the fact that people are forever blaming people other than themselves for their accidents, I bet transport for london are so worried about being sued that they won't allow people to get on or off anywhere other than at designated stops.
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