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Old May 16th, 2014, 06:07 PM   #4141
onewtclover
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I'm pretty sure this isn't true, but wouldn't it be funny if they said that they haven't released the final renderings because everyone hated the "current" design? If this was true, it would prove that Extell would not accept anything less than perfect. I personally don't really like the design in the renderings, but I think it would be weird for any architect firm to release renderings AFTER construction started, but they did that with One57.

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Old May 20th, 2014, 12:37 AM   #4142
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Community board asks Extell for transit improvements
http://www.capitalnewyork.com/articl...t-improvements

Quote:
Community Board 5 has another bone to pick with Extell.

The midtown Manhattan board, which famously took the One57 developer to task for the shadows its skyscraper is casting over Central Park, is demanding the developer contribute more money to mass transit, now that it's building an even taller tower down the block.

On Friday, the community board's chair, Vikki Barbero, and its land use chair, Raju Mann, sent a letter to Extell Development president Gary Barnett, New York City Transit president Carmen Bianco and City Planning Commission chair Carl Weisbrod asking the city and the M.T.A. to require the developer fund a project to make the nearby Q train station at 57th Street and 7th Avenue fully wheelchair-accessible by building an elevator shaft all the way down to the subway platform.

The community board's argument goes something like this.

In addition to yet more luxury condos, Extell's just-underway 217 West 57th Street tower will house the city's first Nordstrom department store and is poised to flood the nearby subway station with a lot more traffic.

In 2007, when the nearby One57 was just getting underway, Extell agreed to build an elevator to the subway, but only one that carried straphangers from the street to the mezzanine, not all the way down to the subway platform.

"[S]o (if the elevator is working) a person in a wheelchair takes it down to the mezzanine/fare control level and then realizes s/he can’t get down to the platform and therefore has to take the elevator back up to the sidewalk," reads the letter.

"Isn’t it silly?" said Jim Weisman, general counsel for the United Spinal Association and an advocate for the disabled. "If you do it, do it. Make it a usable station."

Now, Extell is requesting a waiver from a zoning requirement that it incorporate a new subway station entrance into its 217 West 57th Street development, a skyscraper that when it's complete will be the tallest residential tower in the country.

"We believe this application represents exactly the right opportunity to finish the job," wrote Barbero and Mann.

Instead, Extell is offering to widen and relocate a staircase.

And the M.T.A. is moving ahead with a contract to build two mezzanine-to-platform elevators on its own, without Extell funding.

"We’re not even saying that Extell should bear the entire cost of the project, though that would be nice," said Wally Rubin, the board's district manager, in an email. "But we do believe that with the added traffic that will result from Extell’s supertower, and especially the department store that will be at the base (think Macy’s at 57th Street), and with a billion dollar budget for the building of this megatower, and a $35 million tax break for One 57, tax payers should not have to bear the full freight of this ADA project alone and Extell should be expected to contribute to the project’s completion, from which its tenants will benefit."

In a statement, Extell spokesman George Artz said its "relocated and expanded subway stair" and a wider sidewalk "will accommodate subway riders and pedestrians now and in the future."
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Old May 20th, 2014, 07:39 PM   #4143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNYC View Post
We can't even build a skyscraper taller than the Sears anymore. In China, 2nd- or even 3rd- tier cities build taller towers than we do. Shame really, New York is falling behind, whereas Chicago is a already a lost cause.
Chicago is already a lost cause? What the hell are you talking about? What metric are you using to even make that statement? Chicago has the two tallest buildings in America, and the very real possibility of hosting America's first megatall tower.

If you want to throw endless waves of human suffering at a city; then sure, you can have as many supertall buildings as you want. Their gleaming spires will obscure all of your human rights violations quite nicely.

Unfortunately, and despite what cynics might prattle on about, America is in the first world. Shit, America is the first world. And in the first world, economic viability and conservative, respectful urban planning are things most people actually want.
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Old May 20th, 2014, 07:51 PM   #4144
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Skyscrapers are not infrastructure.
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Old May 20th, 2014, 08:38 PM   #4145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SupremeLord View Post
You got other countries a hundred years ago living in sand huts or homes made of wood or whatever now their building taller than us. We need to show that we can contend with the upstarts.
The "upstarts" are exceeding the US in height either because there is an oligarchy that has money to burn in an attempt to manufacture demand that isn't currently there (see Dubai / Jeddah) or as in the case of say China because they have demand due to having four times the population of the US, extremely low labor costs, a high rate of population growth in urban centers, and a double digit economic growth rate... All that is just catching up to much of the west though. And as China catches up and more of the population enjoys a better standard of living all the development will slow, labor costs will rise, economic growth will move into the single digits and much of the manufacturing will move out to the next location that has low labor costs and a stable government.

All that to say... the US doesn't have anything to prove. The US is wisely meeting demand with appropriate scale
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Old May 20th, 2014, 09:21 PM   #4146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SupremeLord View Post
You really think we are ivesting into our roads bridges or tunnnels
I don't know about the rest of the country but in New York there are a ton of big infrastructure projects underway. I would checkout the 2nd Ave subway, East Side Access for LIRR, WTC Path Station, Path tunnel being dug out from under hudson yards, or moynihan staton. In any case all of this is way off topic for this thread if you want to discuss infrastructure head over to this section.
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=3631
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Old May 20th, 2014, 09:25 PM   #4147
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I get what you're saying, but I think it's misguided to equate megatall skyscrapers with "investing in ourselves." Skyscrapers don't benefit large swaths of people, in fact as we've seen with the latest trend of superluxury residential development, modern skyscrapers benefit an increasingly narrow band of extremely wealthy people. Whereas it used to be, "Hey look at the Empire State Building and Sears Tower, what marvels of American industry," now it's "Hey look at 432 Park, what a marvel of investment opportunities for Russian oligarchs." And you know what, that's fine. This is American capitalism. Let the developers get theirs. But those towers do not represent some investment in "us."

I don't know why you're dismissing rlw77's point, because it's basically the exact point I want to make as well. In the current economic climate, developers are not in the business of building bigger than what will make them a profit. Again, capitalism. It would be nonsense to ask them to do so, tantamount to me saying, "Hey, I like your restaurant. I know it's new and it will probably mean bankrupting you, but you should move into the biggest, most prestigious storefront in the City. That would be cool." If you owned that restaurant, you'd think I was a ******* moron.

Because private developers aren't dumb enough to break the bank on vanity projects, the largest buildings going up around the world are being built by centralized governments, which have deemed these iconic prestige buildings to be more important than investing in the public good. That money could be going to actual infrastructure, to modernizing parts of these countries that are still very much Third World, but instead, because the power is so centralized with these governments, the vast majority of people who could benefit from that civic investment are left out in the cold. Now I love tall buildings, but you know what I love more? Democracy and basic labor rights, two things with which you would never see a Kingdom Tower built.

I'm all for investing in the public good. Infrastructure improvements would be great. Crumbling bridges and freeways are an embarrassment. But trying to rally some kind of public support around building taller skyscrapers is not only unrelated to solving those problems, in the current climate it's actually antithetical to it.
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Old May 20th, 2014, 11:24 PM   #4148
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I normally just lurk in this thread to see updates on the tower because I have an interest in watching this tower. Is there a mod for this forum area that can clean up the mess or give some infractions for the stuff being posted by a few people above?

Do we have anyone that lives in NY that could post a new photo of the construction or know of a construction camera?
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Old May 20th, 2014, 11:37 PM   #4149
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The most recent photos we have were posted on May 2. I'm never up in that neck of the woods, otherwise I'd go snap some new photos myself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostface79 View Post
Construction Update: 217 West 57th Street & 220 Central Park South

http://newyorkyimby.com


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Old May 21st, 2014, 01:34 AM   #4150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNYC View Post
We can't even build a skyscraper taller than the Sears anymore. In China, 2nd- or even 3rd- tier cities build taller towers than we do. Shame really, New York is falling behind, whereas Chicago is a already a lost cause.
We don't even know the final height of this building nor the ones for the west side, relax.

Building a building higher than Sears that's profitable is not easy, Sears is still extremely tall and would be a major skyscraper in any Chinese city.
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Old May 21st, 2014, 01:37 AM   #4151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordArthurWellesley View Post
Also, who knows how high Tishman will build.
2.85 msf of mainly office will be quite the skyscraper.

Also, how many accounts do you have? Yeesh man
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Old May 21st, 2014, 02:16 AM   #4152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SupremeLord View Post
Back to the conversation about this building it looks like 432 park but it's not I hope it goes taller at 1550 or 1600.
It looks like it'll be made of solid blue reflective glass and the final height will probably be low 1400's but I'm only basing that on what we've heard so far, it could be subject to change.
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Old May 21st, 2014, 04:28 AM   #4153
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Sorry to bring this back up, but I just had to say my . Height is NOT everything, people. Get that through your mind. As people have been saying, amazing design will always trump height. Why should America build supertalls or even megatalls when we don't have the demand for something of that stature. Our country doesn't build to show off like China. I'm glad we're doing what we are doing, we're being smart about it. I'm finished.
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Last edited by weidncol; May 21st, 2014 at 05:56 AM.
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Old May 21st, 2014, 02:06 PM   #4154
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Someone from Texas saying size doesn't matter... Now I've heard it all

That being said I like the fact that US billionaires invest their legacy in clean water, education, erradication of malaria ect. and not in a mile high mousuleum for their eternity.

(last time I'll say so on a skyscraper forum...)
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Old May 21st, 2014, 10:02 PM   #4155
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But I agree. Design over height. Always.
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Old May 22nd, 2014, 06:23 PM   #4156
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What ever happened to Robert Walpole?
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Old May 22nd, 2014, 07:39 PM   #4157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Munwon View Post
What ever happened to Robert Walpole?
He finally crawled all the way up his own ******* and disappeared into another dimension.
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Old May 22nd, 2014, 07:54 PM   #4158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeKindOfBug View Post
He finally crawled all the way up his own ******* and disappeared into another dimension.
Are you sure?

Anyway, that's not a very nice way to talk about other forum members. Even banned ones.

I hope that when the renders of this building are show, they prove worthy of a certain politician's photo.
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Old May 22nd, 2014, 08:09 PM   #4159
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Originally Posted by Munwon View Post
What ever happened to Robert Walpole?
He was banned but posts as LowKey Lion and Lord Wellesley currently.
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Old May 22nd, 2014, 09:17 PM   #4160
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Originally Posted by spectre000 View Post
If true, he won't be around for long.
I am not Robert, but I don't understand the animosity. The dude was probably the best poster on this site. One of the main reasons I used to come here. Everyone just needs to chill.
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