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Old December 5th, 2015, 08:51 PM   #17121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hateman View Post
There's no need for hyperbole, this tower has clear antecedents in fascist architecture, like the Colosseo Quadrato (though lacking what grace it had, or the fine materials). The materials, height and proportions of 432 add to the dehumanizing quality of the building. But hey, life goes on, especially in New York City. New York can take a building like this.
Perhaps one of the stupidest things I've ever seen written here.
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Old December 5th, 2015, 10:47 PM   #17122
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To me 432 is basically a high modernist building. I think the Colosseo Quadrato comparison is apt but that building isn't really fascist, it just happened to get built by fascists. Whether 432 is a symbol for fascism is totally up to the individual and that's another story. But personally, I don't think it is.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 12:24 AM   #17123
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And Speer's vision of Germania wasn't fascist, it was simply innocent classicism that happened to be imagined by a fascist? That's quite a specious argument.

Insults and claims of ignorance are expected, but at least do some reading and thinking before you rush to insult or point fingers. It only makes you look bad. There is a definite relationship between high net worth and aesthetic elitism in the appropriation of fascist architecture, of which 432 Park Avenue is emblematic. It's catering to this compulsion in form and function.

http://www.architectural-review.com/...679074.article

Calling me a poopy head or an ignoramus does not offer any support for your opinion. If you cannot abide the disagreement of others and resort to simple name calling, then you're simply unworthy of engaging in a discussion.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 02:52 AM   #17124
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Originally Posted by generalscarr View Post
OMG, such dramatic choice of words! Complete nonsense of course, but so intense! Inmates, commie block...before you get too depressed about it I can assure you that noone living there will ever feel anything remotely close to what you've just desrcibed behind those unrealistically large windows above NYC.
Let people have their opinion without coming across as a snide smart ass. You are not the king of architectural opinion on this forum and I don't give a rats ass about your snark. Again, this forum is a public forum for everyone. If you only would like to talk to trained architects, I think you should head over some place else. it seems you are on here to troll given you pounced on my recent posts with the same attitude. This is a design forum and design is subjective, your rude replies are not warranted and will give you a bad name. Learn to play nice and stop attacking others opinions with your lame attempt to garner support on your side.

Again, the building to me appears like a commieblock, with bigger Windows. It is a disgrace to build like this today when you can build anything far more inviting to the street and the public with the wonders of modern technology. Few members of the public have warm feelings for this kind of drek anymore. It's hideous and does nothing for the street but alienate the pedestrian. I have taken several design courses in urban design, so I can confidently notice such a poor choice in the context of the whole. This tower was built to appeal to elitist billionaire philistine wankers without one bit of thought about urban design or the affect on the city as a whole

Last edited by JohnDee; December 6th, 2015 at 03:15 AM.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:03 AM   #17125
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People have been brainwashed to think every minimalist building is a commieblock. And you even have people comparing it to fascist architecture, even though Mussolini and Hitler (and Stalin) liked classical architecture.

Really, if that's the best criticism one has, it shows how little they understand modernism in general.
No brainwashing dude. It looks like that to me, a dehumanized concrete bunker. It's all about he rich interiors while giving a cold concrete smirk to most who actually have to look at the building from everywhere in midtown. There is nothing inspiring other than its height. A plain grid of stark cold grey concrete is not what NY needs to humanize the concrete jungle. Enough damage has been done with ugly dystopian modernist boxes throughout midtown which eradicated much of its former grandeur and beauty.

Maybe your just too elitist to understand that the average joe hates this kind of design today and how they have ruined the cores of countless cities. You are obviously taking on this anachronistic architects persona; thinking yourself beyond the people and knowing what's good for them. Do some surveys and I bet most will not have a favorable opinion of this design. if you give them some options to chose, I bet this one wouldn't even be in the top 5. However, you probably don't care what most people want and would prefer to force feed them a nice diet of blank face modernism if you were in some kind of position of power.

Last edited by JohnDee; December 6th, 2015 at 03:21 AM.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:16 AM   #17126
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I do not like this building at all. It is too tall, stick-thin, and it has a facade with absolutely no character. It is proof that rich people generally do not care about what their home looks like from the outside, they only care about the view they get from the inside. One57 and buildings buildings owned by Donald Trump are practically the only exceptions to this. The New York supertall movement is such a shame
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:28 AM   #17127
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Originally Posted by spidey7312 View Post
I do not like this building at all. It is too tall, stick-thin, and it has a facade with absolutely no character. It is proof that rich people generally do not care about what their home looks like from the outside, they only care about the view they get from the inside. One57 and buildings buildings owned by Donald Trump are practically the only exceptions to this. The New York supertall movement is such a shame
some other new other towers are marginally acceptable and a couple are great, but this elitist attitude of building for the interior and paying little homage to the public/street with something that most people can actually appreciate is just poor practice. We can build far more aesthetically interesting buildings yet they chose to build these dumb concrete grids or plain glass boxes everywhere to Save cash. They are greedy philistinies, these builders.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:32 AM   #17128
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This one is my least favorite of all the New York residential supertalls. One57 is the best looking in my opinion. I also dislike how these buildings have roofs higher than 1WTC. It is a sign of disrespect, in my opinion. 432 Park is like a middle finger pointed at ESB and 1WTC
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:40 AM   #17129
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Are you advocating the democritisation of architecture? Who would you like to sit in judgement: a committee of concerned citizens?

Best of my knowledge almost every great building in Manhattan was built by "greedy philistines" who didn't give a damn about your opinions. And good on them. Who appointed you Culture Czar, comrade?

Stop moaning. Go find your own investors and build it yourself. Or avert your eyes; no one's forcing you to look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDee View Post
some other new other towers are marginally acceptable and a couple are great, but this elitist attitude of building for the interior and paying little homage to the public/street with something that most people can actually appreciate is just poor practice. We can build far more aesthetically interesting buildings yet they chose to build these dumb concrete grids or plain glass boxes everywhere to Save cash. They are greedy philistinies, these builders.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:43 AM   #17130
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Originally Posted by Nuwanda View Post
Are you advocating the democritisation of architecture? Who would you like to sit in judgement: a committee of concerned citizens?

Best of my knowledge almost every great building in Manhattan was built by "greedy philistines" who didn't give a damn about your opinions. And good on them. Who appointed you Culture Czar, comrade?

Stop moaning. Go find your own investors and build it yourself. Or avert your eyes; no one's forcing you to look.
No, I'm advocating the design of decent interesting towers that have some detail on their facades, and not stuff that harkens back to the mid 20th century plain boxy Corbusien era. We should move on from the cold heartless boxes of yesteryear when we can practically design any form today with technology.

And of course everyone has to look at this drek they are putting up. A life of averting your eyes isn't a life anyone would enjoy.

Oh, and I'll stop moaning when they start getting it and give some respect to the average joe of NYC rather than designing purely for the sumptuous interiors to be enjoyed by a very tiny percentage of people. I'll stop moaning when the towers give something back to the city, and that isn't this tower.

You sound like you have these philistine developers back. It is quite obvious that a design board is needed like in London, to diminish the chances that large Crap conspicuous objects get built that lack any interest or charm whatsoever. People don't relate late to dull boxes. They are dystopian and dehumanizing, they remove the pleasures of the city that people once enjoyed.

Why do people love Paris, Rome, Venice and Mayfair? Why do people rush to Charleston, Edinburgh? For the beautiful architecture. How many people now say Ny is beautiful? Few.

Old NYC used to be akin to London in beauty before they put up so many plain and boring boxy towers that lack any detail compared to the ornate beauties they ruined. Now that we can build interesting forms quite easily with computer technology, we don't have to be erecting towers that a 5 year old could roughly think up.
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Last edited by JohnDee; December 6th, 2015 at 03:54 AM.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:44 AM   #17131
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I haven't looked in person because I have not been to NYC. But I love 1WTC and ESB but skyline shots now feature this big stick that is twice as tall as almost everything else in the city. It looms over everything. Atleast its shadow is thin. Also JohnDee is right about this tower. It does not give back goodness to the city.

Last edited by spidey7312; December 6th, 2015 at 03:49 AM.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 03:54 AM   #17132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuwanda View Post
Are you advocating the democritisation of architecture? Who would you like to sit in judgement: a committee of concerned citizens?

Best of my knowledge almost every great building in Manhattan was built by "greedy philistines" who didn't give a damn about your opinions. And good on them. Who appointed you Culture Czar, comrade?

Stop moaning. Go find your own investors and build it yourself. Or avert your eyes; no one's forcing you to look.
I cannot get investors as I have not graduated yet. Also most Manhattan skyscrapers atleast look descent compared to this, something that JohnDee understands but that you seemingly do not. Now if you could please be more respectful to me, I would really appreciate it.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 04:11 AM   #17133
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Oh, right, so not a committee of concerned citizens but a "design board".

You're just a NIMBY variant who's got the idea that there's got to be some official standard for design or the philistines will destroy everything that's good and holy.

Grow up: New York was built by your so-called philistines. It's constantly getting torn down and built up again. It's loud and brash and sometimes it's a little bit ugly. But I'd rather have some ugliness than your subjective opinion of what should or should not be built.

I don't like 432 Park Ave. and I've said so above, but your desire for an Old World-style Design Dictatorship is far uglier than that or any other building I've ever seen.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDee View Post
No, I'm advocating the design of decent interesting towers that have some detail on their facades, and not stuff that harkens back to the mid 20th century plain boxy Corbusien era. We should move on from the cold heartless boxes of yesteryear when we can practically design any form today with technology.

And of course everyone has to look at this drek they are putting up. A life of averting your eyes isn't a life anyone would enjoy.

Oh, and I'll stop moaning when they start getting it and give some respect to the average joe of NYC rather than designing purely for the sumptuous interiors to be enjoyed by a very tiny percentage of people. I'll stop moaning when the towers give something back to the city, and that isn't this tower.

You sound like you have these philistine developers back. It is quite obvious that a design board is needed like in London, to diminish the chances that large Crap conspicuous objects get built that lack any interest or charm whatsoever. People don't relate late to dull boxes. They are dystopian and dehumanizing, they remove the pleasures of the city that people once enjoyed.

Why do people love Paris, Rome, Venice and Mayfair? Why do people rush to Charleston, Edinburgh? For the beautiful architecture. How many people now say Ny is beautiful? Few.

Old NYC used to be akin to London in beauty before they put up so many plain and boring boxy towers that lack any detail compared to the ornate beauties they ruined. Now that we can build interesting forms quite easily with computer technology, we don't have to be erecting towers that a 5 year old could roughly think up.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 05:14 AM   #17134
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Old December 6th, 2015, 05:45 AM   #17135
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Originally Posted by spidey7312 View Post
I do not like this building at all. It is too tall, stick-thin, and it has a facade with absolutely no character. It is proof that rich people generally do not care about what their home looks like from the outside, they only care about the view they get from the inside. One57 and buildings buildings owned by Donald Trump are practically the only exceptions to this. The New York supertall movement is such a shame
Donald Trump wouldn't know good taste if it stared him in the face.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 06:11 AM   #17136
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You know this how? He's got great taste in golf resorts and private transportation.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 09:16 AM   #17137
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I don't like it. It is a prison in the sky for overpaid inmates with all the charm of a 1950s era commie block from east Berlin. Screw that tower. All that's missing is bars on the windows to complete the effect or washing lines hanging out...
moldings big enough to have a 4 some plus coke lines.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 11:13 AM   #17138
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I don't know about the rest of you, but I think this tower is spectacular!

It's sleek, slender form seems to defy structural limitations- I've yet to see another building that's tall but so slender. I applaud the engineers who made this possible.

I'm not worried about the future of NYC's skyline- if this build is anything to go by, I'm genuinely excited!
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Old December 6th, 2015, 11:48 PM   #17139
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" Why do people love Paris, Rome, Venice and Mayfair? Why do people rush to Charleston, Edinburgh? For the beautiful architecture. How many people now say Ny is beautiful? Few. "

Sad.
This discussion is def not worth continuing.
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Old December 7th, 2015, 12:27 AM   #17140
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" Why do people love Paris, Rome, Venice and Mayfair? Why do people rush to Charleston, Edinburgh? For the beautiful architecture. How many people now say Ny is beautiful? Few. "

Sad.
This discussion is def not worth continuing.
New York isn't just beautiful, it's stunning, breathtaking, and awe inspiring! I have never visited a city that I fell more in love with.
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