DISCUSSION | Rebuilding CHC

[NZ1]

I see that the rumour mill has started. Two nasty ones:
1. The owners of the CTV building are to be prosecuted because they failed to remedy large cracks in the building from the previous quake.
2. It will take 9 months to a year before the CBD is inhabitable again.

Good to see the Mayor dismissing these rumours, earlier this afternoon. I wish people would just keep their mouths shut rather than spewing forth this type of crap - it just makes the situation worse.

[NapierMan]

Im just following everyones comments, and some of you make very good points.

It does worry me that Christchurch will rebuild slowly, and in lowrise nasty box shaped buildings like the one posted a page back.

Christchurch will have to take a long hard look at other cities that have been devistated by earthquakes, and learn from them.

It is extremely vital it reacts quickly. The last thing we need is for bussineses to abandon the CBD.

The other thing Christchurch will need to do is future proof the style of buildings that get built. It cant be a style that will look like it will date badly in 15 years time (thank god this earthquake didn't occure in the 1970's).

Style will be of huge importance, but it cant be bland, it has to be a "style", and modern architecture has a bad reputation of being boring.

The council should look at employing reputible well known architects and artists to creat a vibrant interesting CBD that is atractive, and a place that is safe.

High rise buildings can be VERY safe, we should'nt be afraid of building them safely in earthquake prone areas. (to note, it was low rise that killed the most people in this shocking earthquake, not highrise)

^and back to style, take a look at Napier, it was a style that atracts tourists, and if CHCH build quick and cheap modernist buildings, the CBD will die.

Christchurch has to save as many heritage buildings as possible, and earthquake proof them, they are christchurch's heart and soul, and there is nothing wrong with that if we are confident that they wont fall and cause more deaths.

my 2 cnts worth

[metroman]

It appears that high rise will not be on the agenda in a future cbd, if most articles are correct. C1 which is the tallest structure had a flag raised at half mast, the article said this was one of the safest structures in the city. My view is that if highrise are not allowed to be built in the cbd, it will hinder the city's ability to flourish significantly. I believe a secondary cbd maybe mooted, which may allow for highrise.

[Davee]

BusinessDay.co.nz

New Economic Development Minister David Carter says there needs to be an "aggressive" demolition programme of unsafe Christchurch buildings as soon as possible so rebuilding of the earthquake-shattered city can start.

"The first priority was to save lives, next was the recovery of bodies, and next making the city safe. A lot of buildings are okay but we don't know how many, so I think we should go in there quite aggressively and take down any building which is unsafe so we can open up the rest of the city. Once that is done we can start the rebuild," said Christchurch born and bred Carter.

Carter, who is also Minister of Agriculture and of Biosecurity, was appointed to the new job by Prime Minister John Key last week after a Cabinet reshuffle of portfolios to allow minister Gerry Brownlee, also of Christchurch, to focus on the task of rebuilding the city.

Carter said after the September 4 earthquake last year, there was a lot of resistance among Cantabrians to demolishing old and historic buildings but he did not anticipate opposition after the latest devastation.

Asked if he thought the national building code's earthquake provisions should be tightened, Carter said it was still early days after the earthquake and that "is a discussion we still need to have".

"Everything comes before a Cabinet process. We all have a role (in the Christchurch response) but we rely heavily on the minister responsible (Maurice Williamson) to develop a code, and that is work he is initiating now."

Carter has attended the funerals of two family friends killed in the earthquake this week.

He said "fair" criticism was developing in the city as to how long it was taking authorities to identify bodies and release them to loved ones.

"We were at a funeral yesterday (Tuesday) of a family friend. Even though his sister was with him when he died and he went to hospital and the hospital pronounced him dead it still took them some days to get the body."

Police and coroner services were "paranoid" about making a wrongful identification, which was understandable, but pressure was growing to speed up the process.

[buildemhigh]

Originally Posted by Davee

BusinessDay.co.nz

New Economic Development Minister David Carter says there needs to be an "aggressive" demolition programme of unsafe Christchurch buildings as soon as possible so rebuilding of the earthquake-shattered city can start. .

This really cant be helped, but I fear what this will mean for the economy (esp locally, but also nationally) the rebuild needs to be considered, and I cant really see much of the iconic heritage buildings being either saved or rebuilt other than the two cathedrals..

The other consideration is that there will be a dramatic reduction in population which the density will have to reflect.

[Davee]

GLENN CONWAY - 03/03/2011

Business owners and residents will soon be able to re-enter parts of locked-down central Christchurch to retrieve vital equipment, but a retail leader fears much of the inner city could remain closed until Christmas.

A new organisation, the Canterbury Business Recovery Group, said a plan would be completed today to allow limited access to outer areas of the four-avenues cordon.

It said devastated inner-city blocks and areas where rescue and recovery work was continuing would remain off-limits.

Richard Brewer, a spokesman for the group, formed between the Canterbury Chamber of Commerce and the Canterbury Development Corporation, said businesses would be able to retrieve records and equipment from safer areas of the cordon.

Many firms needed to get their computer servers so they could work from other locations, he said.

Inner-city residents would be allowed to collect personal items, and some car owners could get their vehicles if they were undamaged and in safe areas.

He would not put a time frame on the re-entry, but Civil Defence and search and rescue officials were working on the safety issues of the plan. Access would be for a strictly limited period and would be closely controlled.

Christchurch lawyer Grant Cameron said many small businesses would "fall by the wayside" for want of their records and data stored on servers and information technology systems.

He said a small magazine business in Peterborough St employing 14 staff feared it would fold if it could not re-enter soon and retrieve vital IT equipment. The area was low-rise and there was no risk of buildings falling on the owner.

Central City Business Association manager Paul Lonsdale said yesterday it could take at least seven months before the city centre reopened, and that could stretch to Christmas.

He said up to two-thirds of all inner-city buildings could be demolished. Removing them could take at least seven months, but he could not rule out access being restricted until close to Christmas.

Officials had to contend with "highly unstable" areas, such as the Hotel Grand Chancellor.

Although the earthquake was devastating, Lonsdale said, it also gave the city a chance to rebuild Christchurch "in a far better way that inspires the community".

Mayor Bob Parker said it was only a "rumour" that the CBD might not be open for business by Christmas.

"Really at this stage we are still in the planning and shaping process. We don't know exactly when that entry to the city will be," he said.

Christchurch Central MP Brendon Burns said it was "not wise" to put a time on when the central city could be reopened and there were other priorities facing the city.

"We can all have a guess, but all we know is that the central city will be closed for months. But it's not a one-size-fits-all situation."

Ballantynes property general manager Philip Richards said there was "an awful lot of speculative comment" about when the city might reopen.

The company's City Mall department store was closed but it continued to run its branches at Timaru and the Christchurch International Airport.

- The Press

[Richard7666]

Originally Posted by NZ1

I think it's a psychological factor that being closer to the ground is perceived to be safer. I'm not convinced that you are actually safer though.

True. You're probably much safer in the Taipei 101 than the ground floor of your 1950s 2 story office building.

[Bowhill]

Originally Posted by Rooty

Get this oaf out.

Hear hear. Putting people before buildings is, of course, necessary, but you don't just barge in and destroy the soul of a place. A delicate touch is required here.

[seanoff]

Originally Posted by Bowhill

Hear hear. Putting people before buildings is, of course, necessary, but you don't just barge in and destroy the soul of a place. A delicate touch is required here.

I live in Darwin. we were totally destroyed and that destruction totally changed the place. it's going to be difficult to avoid this. the owners of the buildings are going to be (understandably) reticent to re-build in the same style as before having seen the results. even if the tech exists for them to do so.

i can also see masonry buildings becoming unpopular in Chch, much like timber framed buildings are rare as hens teeth in darwin.

[chris lewis]

When I stated I agreed with Brownlee that 'old building kill people' I was generalizing even thou his basic premise is correct - a number of structural building experts have aslo stated this. However I certainly hope they are very careful in which buildings are demolished. I am sure that local building engineers and architects will have a large input in this process. I am sure Brownlee will not be making any unilateral decision's as there will be many checks and balances and the various historic societies will be keeping a close eye on him. I am no fan of Brownlee and I hope he modifies his 'bull dozer' attitude and approach. He does however want to get he city up and running ASAP which is a good thing.
One fear I have is that new building contracts are not just given to 'big brother' Fletchers.
Fletchers tend to have a monopoly in large building projects in NZ and it will have a 'job for my mates' flavor if they get the tender. Tenders need to be transparent and open to international tenders.
I lived in Sumner for 10 years so I do have affinity to Christchurch and its architecture and the destruction with the old buildings is just horrific.

Chris

[SYDNEY]

I really hope that they save as much as possible and incorporate it into the new building or at least try to rebuild the new building in the original style. For those buildings that can't be saved maybe they should do what was done in Dunedin - print the facade of the original building onto the glass of the new structure eg.



I also remember seeing a building in Paris where they took mouldings of the original (heritage) building and incorporated it into the new building - this will at least retain some of the city's soul

Anyways - I have sent Bob Parker and email and a referral to this post - let's see if it helps

[Svartmetall]

I actually agree, Syd. I really liked that development in Dunedin (I was surprised that such a small city had something like that to be honest).

[jarden]

Originally Posted by metroman

It appears that high rise will not be on the agenda in a future cbd, if most articles are correct. C1 which is the tallest structure had a flag raised at half mast, the article said this was one of the safest structures in the city. My view is that if highrise are not allowed to be built in the cbd, it will hinder the city's ability to flourish significantly. I believe a secondary cbd maybe mooted, which may allow for highrise.

That will be just what the nimby's would love to hear, more ammo for their guns, in their argument for no high rises in the CBD. So if no new office tower developments are allowed in the future a lot more business will relocate up to Wellington or Auckland that will only make Christchurch suffer even more.

[Davee]

A week and a half after the earthquake, a theme that recurs through many conversations in Christchurch is of a desire to return to normal.

While there is still much grieving to do for those who have been lost and while it is clear that reconstruction will take a very long time, the human instinct to get back to the familiar and comfortable – to get back to normal – is overwhelming. For Christchurch, though, returning to normal will not mean returning to things as they were before.

The old normal has gone forever and Christchurch must now learn to adjust to a "new normal". Many things about it will be hugely different. After the basic amenities are restored, people have to begin to get their heads around what life is going to be like in this radically altered city.

For many, the first return to normality will be to get their children back to school. This should be high priority for the education authorities, who should be working to bring it about as rapidly, and with as little bureaucratic nonsense, as possible.

Regrettably, the hidebound bureaucrat's mindset can be hard to dislodge and there have been anecdotal accounts of out-of-town paper-shufflers raising difficulties with documentation and paperwork, to the distress of schools and pupils alike. It can only be hoped that such events are not widespread, although the fact that they happen at all shows an appalling lack of sensitivity.

A lot of schools are relatively unscathed so that will be straightforward for their own pupils. Some schools and school grounds, though, are heavily damaged and for them the new normality will mean a vastly different way of operating.

Most schools, if not all, want to retain themselves in as intact a form as possible. If this is achievable, it is plainly desirable both for the benefit of the teachers and employees, who tend to be close-knit and supportive little communities in their own right, but above all for the benefit of the pupils, whose desire to be with teachers with whom they are familiar and with friends will be particularly compelling at this time.

Schools may have to share premises and accommodate the extra numbers by running split shifts – with one school being taught in the morning and the other in the afternoon. Whatever the arrangements, they will require flexibility and great co-operation.

Another part of the new normality is the relocation and re-establishment of businesses in order to save as many jobs as possible.

One thing that just has to be accepted is that many of the small shops and cafes and restaurants in the inner city have disappeared forever.

The destruction of so many of the smaller buildings in Manchester St and Colombo St that housed many of the shops of inner Christchurch mean those businesses will never return. But hundreds of other firms and businesses are making herculean efforts to get up and running from new premises in the suburbs. Already, a kind of de facto central business district is coming into being in the area near Westfield Riccarton mall, around Birmingham Dr and Tower Junction.

Everything must be done to ensure that businesses and jobs are rescued so that the city remains economically viable.

Because of the cordon, the reality of just how badly the centre of the city has been damaged has probably not yet come home to most people. The proposal raised by the Mayor, Bob Parker, to allow people back into the city soon should change that.

The idea is a good one, which will not only allow people to properly grieve for lost lives and property but also help in the process of moving on. It will bring home, as television pictures are not able to do, the reality of how the city is going to have to change.

It may also prompt a radical rethink of how the area might be rebuilt to become the vibrant city centre of the future. One idea, for instance, might be to consider returning the university, or at least substantial parts of it, to the central city.

Not only would such a development correct the wrong decision made 50 years ago to send the university to the suburbs, it would enable a rapid rejuvenation in an area that will urgently need it.

- The Press

[Brojoro]

Originally Posted by jarden

That will be just what the nimby's would love to hear, more ammo for their guns, in their argument for no high rises in the CBD. So if no new office tower developments are allowed in the future a lot more business will relocate up to Wellington or Auckland that will only make Christchurch suffer even more.

In Auckland the trend of late is a move away from high rise office developments to more campus style office developments with plenty of open space e.g the new Telecom building(s) and the Carlaw Park redevelopment; and Britomart to a certain extent. IMO this style of development would suit Christchurch well.

[metroman]

It is good to hear some positive ideas being floated, the idea of the university in the inner city sounds particularly good. As our university is real symbol for the future, and to have that in the city's heart would be great. I would describe what is happening now as absolutely critical for the future, possibly the most critical time in Canterbury's history. The city's leaders and planners, are going to have to come up with something very quickly, it is imperative.

[timnz2000]

Agreed... it's scary to think of the possibility of screwing this up and having a city without a CBD (in a much more literal sense than we complained about for all those years).

Moving the University back into the city is a FANTASTIC idea (T&G site comes to mind but I imagine there are now dozens of similar sites available)... in other cities (notably Sydney and Melbourne) the inner city Universities so directly inject life into the CBD that to move UC back into the CBD could only bring about positive change.

There needs to be a whole new approach to CBD living, working and entertaining. Projects like the Press Precinct and Sydenham Square need to go ahead and be replicated right throughout the CBD, creating street-level atmosphere with mixed-use buildings above. Big box developments and carparks will be the single worst possible outcome and if a 'free market' ideology prevails here, it is also by far the most likely one.

To the people in charge: Please, please don't fuck this up.

[badbehaviour]

Originally Posted by metroman

It is good to hear some positive ideas being floated, the idea of the university in the inner city sounds particularly good. As our university is real symbol for the future, and to have that in the city's heart would be great. I would describe what is happening now as absolutely critical for the future, possibly the most critical time in Canterbury's history. The city's leaders and planners, are going to have to come up with something very quickly, it is imperative.

Indeed. Integrated with major PT infrastructure? It's an exciting thought anyway.

Originally Posted by timnz2000

To the people in charge: Please, please don't fuck this up.

You don't happen to watch Drag Race do you? <3

......"Good luck... And DON'T fuck it up."

[metroman]

It is possible that much of the cbd will become parkland, which appears to be a popular theme amongst civic leaders. If the idea of having the university or part of it relocated to the cbd eventuates, we will probably become more of a uni town something akin to Dunedin. Hopefully the tram extension can proceed. It does seem likely that a secondary cbd is being looked at. Parts of the Tower junction and Riccarton are beginning to emerge as a defacto cbd, while parts of Colombo Street have also been suggested to fill the void. I have even heard suggestions of building some form of cbd or satellite cbd in Hornby. While I can understand the apprehension about highrise in the cbd, I do feel, an area perhaps outside the cbd possibly could be made compatible for highrise, provided it complied with zoning and regulations. Canterbury must look to the future, and it needs some ambitious and bold leadership in the months and years to come.

[MattTheTubaGuy]

moving the uni to the inner city.
that could be an interesting idea. the buildings would have to be spread out a little in empty plots, and all of it would have to be in the central city.
one problem would be what to do with the old campus?
one idea I just thought of, is, what if there was a second CBD built around where the uni is?
I think a major focus should be making the central city much more pedestrian and bike friendly, maybe even banning non service vehicles from two or three blocks away from cathedral square, and adding in a lot more tram ways.
it kind of sucks that the NIMBY's are probably going to get their way, and as for the style, who knows? maybe in 20 to 30 years time, the modern clean cut glassy buildings might be looked back as a great style.
personally I wouldn't mind a few more buildings like the new white one beside the art gallery.

just some thoughts.