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Old August 3rd, 2017, 08:05 PM   #2121
Gusiluz
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Since others who know more do not answer you, I will do it with my bad English.

28 may seem like many series but we must bear in mind that we speak of 2,361 trains, each series could have an average of 84 trains; In Europe are only above the TGV Duplex (202 in the park and 255 orders) and the German ICE3 + Velaro is approaching, in Japan there is an average of 36 trains per series and only stand out the N700 / N700A / N700S (156 in the park and 187 orders) that are from three Companies.
We must also take into account the climatic diversity of China, with deserts, jungles, extreme altitude and extreme temperatures.

Each maintenance bases will have very few so series they are more or less unified by lines. For example, the Lanzhou-Urumqi line began (I do not know if it will have changed) CRH2E NG night, CRH2G CRH5G and CRH2C for G trains.

In China I do not know how it will be, but in Spain when booking a ticket on the website there is a map with the seats, so if you know the distribution of each series (for each origin-destination route there may be one or two series of trains AVE one from Avant and one from Alvia, the partial routes Madrid-Zaragoza and Zaragoza-Barcelona have almost all series) you know what train it is.
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Old August 3rd, 2017, 08:44 PM   #2122
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Evolution of the CRH park

According to Wikipedia, and coincides with my notes, at the end of 2008 there were 191 CRH trains (174 for 220 / 250 and 17 for 300 / 350 km/h), in 2010 there were 483 (286 + 197), in 2012 there were 1,050 (520 + 530). In May 2015 there were 1,562 (676 + 886), in December 2015 there were 1,800 according to the media, just one year ago 2,063 (858 + 1,205) according to my notes, and now 2,361 (1,009 + 1,352).

Month/Year--200/250 km/h--300/380 km/h--Total-- % 300/380 km/h of total
12/2008 174 017 191 9%
12/2009 206 073 279 26%
12/2010 286 197 483 41%
12/2011 360 360 720 50%
12/2012 520 530 1,050 51%
05/2015 676 886 1,562 57%
12/2015 ---- ----- 1,800 ---
08/2016 858 1,205 2,063 58%
07/2017 1,009 1,352 2,361 57%
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Old August 21st, 2017, 11:47 AM   #2123
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Double-decker HST

There will be a double-decker HST for day trips for 350 km/h. The 8-car version will have 742 seats (209 meters long) and the 16-car version: 1,619 (414 meters long). Two levels, no less than 4,500 mm high and 3,360 mm wide, 5 seats per row on both floors, no shared boogies and only 16 tons per axle!
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Originally Posted by flankerjun View Post
double-decker train
The CRH3X nocturnal for 350 km/h with 8,320 kW and manufactured by Tangshan. Derivative of the derivatives of the Velaro CN. It has 394 places in 8 cars (first night HST of that size):



Also two-levels nocturnal for 350 km/h will be the CRH-0306 (prototype name), Belongs to the platform of the new standard CR400BF manufactured by Tangshan. It has 788 places in 16 cars and will be the most powerful HST in the world thanks to its 20,280 kW; The Shinkansen 500 had 18,240 when it was made up of 16 cars and the CRH380CL has 19,200.




The only double-decker HST it's a night train that is already on the conventional line between Beijing and Shanghai (the CRH2E NG) has 880 places in 16 cars and a maximum speed of 250 km/h. It is manufactured by Sifang and derives from the E2 Shinkansen (although it does not seem it outwardly) whose nocturnal version (CRH2E) had 630 places in 16 single-level cars.
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Old September 4th, 2017, 09:08 PM   #2124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusiluz View Post
... Also two-levels nocturnal for 350 km/h will be the CRH-0306 (prototype name), Belongs to the platform of the new standard CR400BF manufactured by Tangshan. It has 788 places in 16 cars and will be the most powerful HST in the world thanks to its 20,280 kW; The Shinkansen 500 had 18,240 when it was made up of 16 cars and the CRH380CL has 19,200.
Thank You very much, Gusiluz, for all those beautiful images and information. The finished product, the one based on CRH-0306 prototype, may be named CR400BFWL. Will it be the most powerful HST in the world? I am not so sure that the CRH380AL train wil be withdrawn from the service before the appearance of that one based on the already mentioned CRH-0306 prototype, and it means CSR Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd. CRH380AL, 16-car train, configuration 14M2T, powered by 56 CSR Zhuzhou Electric Co., Ltd YQ-365 3-phase 4-pole asynchronous traction motors (TM), each rated at 385 kW for this purpose, with the total traction motors´ power of 21.560 kW / 28.912 hp (29.313 PS) will remain the most powerful HST in the world (some sources cite the power of 20.440 kW, but that is the power measured on the wheels). Or maybe it will not?

Since the other trains´power data You mention; CRRC Changchun Railway Vehicles Co., Ltd. CRH380CL, 16-car train, configuration 8M8T, powered by 32 CRRC Yongji Electric Co., Ltd. YJ105B asynchronous TMs, each rated at 615 kW, with the total power of 19.680 kW / 26.391 hp (26.757 PS) as and Hitachi / Kawasaki Heavy Industries Rolling Stock Company / Kinki Sharyo / Nippon Sharyo 500-series Shinkansen (W1 set), 16-car train, configuration 16M, powered by 64 Hitachi WMT204 asynchronous TMs, each rated at 285 kW, with the total power of 18.240 kW / 24.460 hp (24.800 PS), are actually total traction motors´ powers (ΣTMp) of those trains, I suggest that we take the CRH380AL´s power of 21.560 kW as the suitable value in this comparison.

On 03. Dec 2010, standard CRH380AL train, reg. CRH380A-6041L, 16-car train, configuration 14M2T, powered by 56 CSR Zhuzhou Electric Co., Ltd YQ-365 asynchronous TMs, each rated at 385 kW, with the ΣTMp of 21.560 kW / 28.912 hp (29.313 PS), reached the maximum speed of 486,1 km/h (302,0 mph). Unlike this standard train, on 09. Jan 2011, a modified CRH380BL train, reg. CRH380B-6402L, 12-car train, 8M4T configuration (instead of standard 8M8T), powered by 32 CRRC Yongji Electric Co., Ltd. YJ105C asynchronous TMs, each rated at 586 kW, with the ΣTMp of 18.752 kW / 25.147 hp (25.496 PS), reached the speed of 487,3 km/h (302,8 mph). It would be very interesting to see which speeds could be reached by some other CRH380BL´s 16-car configurations, like 10M6T, with the ΣTMp of 23.440 kW / 31.434 hp (31.870 PS) or even 12M4T configuration, with the ΣTMp of 28.128 kW / 37.720 hp (38.243 PS). Huh …

Between 2008 and 2010, eight of the original nine, 500-series Shinkansen sets have been shortened from 16 to 8 cars (V sets, 500-7000 series), configuration 8M, for use on Sanyo Shinkansen Kodama services and since then Hitachi / Kawasaki Heavy Industries Rolling Stock Company / Kinki Sharyo / Nippon Sharyo N700 series Shinkansen, 16-car train, configuration 14M2T, powered by 56 Hitachi WMT208 asynchronous TMs, each rated at 305 kW, with the ΣTMp of 17.080 kW / 22.905 hp (23.222 PS) is the most powerful Shinkansen train…

As the CRRC Tangshan Co., Ltd. CRH-0306, 16-car, two-level, prototype train (derived from the CR400BF), configuration 8M8T, has the total wheel power of 20.280 kW, it means that its ΣTMp could be around 21.400 kW, very similar to that of CRH380AL train. Since it has 32 TMs, each of them has approximately 670 kW. Now, the only question is if those TMs are CSR Zhuzhou Electric Co. Ltd. YQ-600 or YQ-625 asynchronous TMs or maybe even their new TQ-600 permanent magnet synchronous TM. Personally, I am of the opinion the word is here about CSR Zhuzhou Electric Co. Ltd. YQ-625 asynchronous TM*. In any case, by installing a smaller number of YQ-625 (735 kg) or TQ-600 (635 kg) type of TMs instead of larger number of those of type YQ-365 (465 kg), for approximately the same power output, not only a great energy savings and efficiency are achieved but also a reduction in the total weight of the TMs as and that of the train itself.

* The latest CSR Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd. CR400AF and CRRC Changchun Railway Vehicles Co., Ltd. CR400BF, both 8-car trains, configuration 4M4T, use CSR Zhuzhou Electric Co., Ltd YQ-625 3-phase 4-pole asynchronous TMs ...

I put some numbers on the paper for the CRH380AL train, in order to find out what differences would it bring if its propulsion configuration would be changed (this calculation is just framed and does not take into account some other parameters that could affect the accuracy of the calculation):

CRH380AL, 16-car train, 14M2T [56 x YQ-365 TMs]
Σm(CRH380AL)=890.000 kg
Σm(YQ-365)=56 x 465 kg=26.040 kg
m0(CRH380AL)=Σm(CRH380AL)-Σm(YQ-365)=863.960 kg

P=56 x 385 kW=21.560 kW

Σm(CRH380AL)/P=k
[m0(CRH380AL)+Σm(YQ-365)]/P=41,28 kg/kW

and came to conclusion that, if 56 YQ-365 TMs of CRH380AL train would be replaced by 32 TMs of type TQ-600, keeping the same train´s power to weight ratio (configuration 8M8T instead of 14M2T), the power of each TQ-600 TM should be around 670 kW.

CRH380AL1, 16-car train, 8M8T [32 x TQ-600 TMs]
m0(CRH380AL1)=863.960 kg
Σm(TQ-600)=32 x 635 kg=20.320 kg
Σm(CRH380AL1)=m0(CRH380AL1)+Σm(TQ-600)=884.280 kg

k=41,28 kg/kW

P1=[m0(CRH380AL1)+Σm(TQ-600)]/k=21.421,5 kW
P(TQ-600)=P1/32=669,4 kW

With the 32 TMs of type TQ-600, the mass of the CRH380AL1 train, configuration 8M8T, would be 5,7 t lower than that of the CRH380AL train, configuration 14M2T with 56 YQ-365 TMs. And, if we would like to add as much as possible TMs of type TQ-600 to configuration 8M8T, remaining in the area of mass of the CRH380AL train with 56 YQ-365 TMs,

Δm=Σm(CRH380AL)-Σm(CRH380AL1)=5.720 kg
Δm/m(TQ-600)=9,0

it is clear that 2 more motor cars ie. 8 more TQ-600 TMs could be added, converting it to the configuration 10M6T, with the ΣTMp of 26.800 kW / 35.939 hp (36.438 PS). In this configuration we have 33,19 kg of total train´s mass per 1 kW of ΣTMp, instead of 41,28 as in the previous cases with CRH380AL, 16-car train, configuration 14M2T with 56 YQ-365 TMs or CRH380AL1, 16-car train, configuration 8M8T with 32 TQ-600 TMs.

CRH380AL2, 16-car train, 10M6T [40 x TQ-600 TMs]
m0(CRH380AL2)=863.960 kg
Σm(TQ-600)=40 x 635 kg=25.400 kg
Σm(CRH380AL2)=m0(CRH380AL2)+Σm(TQ-600)=889.360 kg

P2=40 x 670 kW=26.800 kW

[m0(CRH380AL2)+Σm(TQ-600)]/P2=33,19 kg/kW

Interesting to note that the value of the required power of TQ-600 TM, the one obtained by the simplified calculation, is very similar to the one of the TM of CRH-0306 train prototype. Are we maybe talking about the same traction motor type? New TQ-600 permanent magnet synchronous TM in the new Chinese HST? … No, not yet. It seems to me still a little bit too early ...

Kind regards

Mario
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Last edited by mfranjic; October 6th, 2017 at 11:13 PM.
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Old September 5th, 2017, 01:30 PM   #2125
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Equally. thank you very much! And very interesting the theme of the different engines, it is clear that you know the subject perfectly. I hope you will often go through the Forum.

I was aiming less power for the CRH380AL, thanks for clarifying that is the power in wheel. The same thing happens with weight: there is no way to compare because each source measures it as you want.

I need to know the power of several series, as well as other data.



Thanks in advance!
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Old September 9th, 2017, 04:57 PM   #2126
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China's CRH6A-A, CRH6F-A intercity trains go off production line in Qingdao

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/20..._136597038.htm


Photo taken on Sept. 9, 2017 shows a CRH6 intercity train with the four-car configuration in Qingdao, east China's Shandong Province. China's CRH6A-A and CRH6F-A intercity trains, with the four-car configuration, went off the production line in Qingdao on Saturday. (Xinhua/Zhang Jingang)


Photo taken on Sept. 9, 2017 shows a CRH6A-A intercity train


Photo taken on Sept. 9, 2017 shows the interior of a CRH6A-A intercity train















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Old September 12th, 2017, 11:55 AM   #2127
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CRRC to supply trains for Beijing Daxing airport rail link
Quote:
CRIC has awarded CRRC Sifang a contract to supply 10 160km/h EMUs for services to Beijing’s new international airport at Daxing.

Each eight-car train will accommodate 512 seated and 1026 standing passengers.

Deliveries will take place next year and the trains will enter service when the 78km Beijing - Daxing - Bazhou high-speed line opens in September 2019.

Which series? CRH6F?
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Old September 12th, 2017, 05:52 PM   #2128
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New-generation bullet train rolls off production line in N China

A new-generation bullet train rolled off the production line in northern China's Hebei Province Friday. The passenger train could run at a speed of 250 kilometers per hour to connect Xi'an, capital of northwestern Shaanxi Province with Chengdu in southwest China's Sichuan Province.

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Old September 12th, 2017, 05:54 PM   #2129
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China's new CRH6 commuter high-speed trains roll off assembly line

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Old September 18th, 2017, 06:07 PM   #2130
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China's EMU fleet

Credit: 罗一童@weibo

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Old September 25th, 2017, 08:03 PM   #2131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjrgx View Post
Xi'an-Chengdu railway to come on stream within 2017
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/20..._136630300.htm
...

...
They are also testing new trains.
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Old September 27th, 2017, 12:13 PM   #2132
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Significant differences 4

After the first three parts (Significant differences 1 Significant differences 2 and Significant differences 3), where I compare different trains with the same series, let us now see some novelty.

We can see the aesthetic differences between the prototypes of the CR400BF (0503 Golden Phoenix, left), and the CR400AF (0207 Blue Dolphin, right), and the trains finally put into service.



CR400AF: There is a third (smaller) window between the door and the cab, which causes the upper red line to be higher than the original blue.


CR400BF: the two windows on a black background are now the same size and larger, and the one next to the cabin is now bigger and different. It also lowers the black roof over the side. They have also removed a vertical division next to the nose.


I take this opportunity to comment on this one, much smaller:
CRH1B #1076/1080 that outwardly it is like the CRH1E (based on Bombardier Zefiro 250 but not NG)...


...instead of like the rest of the CRH1B based on Bombardier Regina:

Well, the photo is from a CRH1A, but they are aesthetically the same.
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Old September 30th, 2017, 10:59 AM   #2133
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Significant differences 5

CR400BF #5001 has the final design and numbering, but is white (source):



On the other hand, the CRH2H #2417 was the first trainset presented in september 2014 (in a workshop) for the Lanzhou-Urumqi line:



Here are a CRH2G with the same number and the same windows:


The CRH2G #2418 with three small windows, like the rest of the G series:

I have also seen the number 0001 also with three small windows, of course.

The CRH2G #2417 now with three small windows!!! (video)


Amazing!!!

H: anti-sandstorm and cold resistant, for example: Lanzhou-Urumqi line. No longer trainsets called H.
G: cold resistant, in principle only for the deep cold in North of China. G series: CRH2G (origin Kawasaki E2), CRH5G (origin Alstom New Pendolino) and CRH380G (18% Siemens).

Note: I try to put photos from Wikipedia, but I have a problem with PhotoBucket and I'm out of file, so I've put the first photos I've found, sorry.
I appreciate very much the photos you put on the forum!
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Old October 1st, 2017, 05:33 PM   #2134
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China’s latest high-speed train consumes 3.8 KWh per 100 passenger-km

http://en.people.cn/n3/2017/0929/c90000-9275504.html

China’s latest high-speed train the Fuxing consumes 3.8 KWh per 100 passenger-km when running at a speed of 350 km/h, according to Chinese newspaper Science and Technology Daily.

The height of the Fuxing model CR400AF increased to 4.05 meters from 3.7 meters, expanding its section by 7.3%.

The enlarged locomotive calls for improved aerodynamic performance. In order to achieve this, the design team conducted lots of simulated calculations, wind tunnel tests, and moving model tests, said Ding Sansan, deputy chief-engineer of CSR Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd., the producer of the locomotive.

After multiple technical evaluations, the final scheme was chosen out of 46 preliminary conceptual plans.

Compared with older versions of China’s high-speed trains, the Fuxing has 12% lower air resistance and 17% of the energy consumption per 100 km.

It saves more than 5,000 KWh of electricity for a round trip between Beijing and Shanghai, Ding noted.

In addition, a number of sensing systems have been added to the train, empowering it with a smarter brain.

The 2,500 sensors can sample more than 1,500 kinds of information, including vibration, bearing temperature, traction system, and carriage environment, said Tao Guidong, deputy director of technical center of CSR Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd.

The smart high-precision sensing systems are able to sample one million pieces of data in just one second, Tao added.

The Fuxing bullet train has also applied passive safety technology for the first time. The technology, which uses energy absorption devices, guarantees the non-deformation of passenger in the event of a crash, Ding noted.
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Old October 1st, 2017, 10:21 PM   #2135
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what gorgeous these double decker trains
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Old October 2nd, 2017, 10:00 AM   #2136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjrgx View Post
http://en.people.cn/n3/2017/0929/c90000-9275504.html

China’s latest high-speed train the Fuxing consumes 3.8 KWh per 100 passenger-km when running at a speed of 350 km/h, according to Chinese newspaper Science and Technology Daily.

The height of the Fuxing model CR400AF increased to 4.05 meters from 3.7 meters, expanding its section by 7.3%.

The enlarged locomotive calls for improved aerodynamic performance. In order to achieve this, the design team conducted lots of simulated calculations, wind tunnel tests, and moving model tests, said Ding Sansan, deputy chief-engineer of CSR Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd., the producer of the locomotive.

After multiple technical evaluations, the final scheme was chosen out of 46 preliminary conceptual plans.

Compared with older versions of China’s high-speed trains, the Fuxing has 12% lower air resistance and 17% of the energy consumption per 100 km.

It saves more than 5,000 KWh of electricity for a round trip between Beijing and Shanghai, Ding noted.

In addition, a number of sensing systems have been added to the train, empowering it with a smarter brain.

The 2,500 sensors can sample more than 1,500 kinds of information, including vibration, bearing temperature, traction system, and carriage environment, said Tao Guidong, deputy director of technical center of CSR Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd.

The smart high-precision sensing systems are able to sample one million pieces of data in just one second, Tao added.

The Fuxing bullet train has also applied passive safety technology for the first time. The technology, which uses energy absorption devices, guarantees the non-deformation of passenger in the event of a crash, Ding noted.
I guess this train will have airbags if in a crash?
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Old October 2nd, 2017, 02:59 PM   #2137
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Quote:
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I guess this train will have airbags if in a crash?
Not made by Takata, without a doubt.
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Old October 10th, 2017, 03:02 PM   #2138
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Beijing Winter Olympics high-speed train design unveiled

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/20..._136669411.htm

CHANGCHUN, Oct. 10 (Xinhua) -- The design of the trains that will run on a new high-speed railway line linking Beijing and Zhangjiakou, co-hosts of the 2022 Winter Olympics, was unveiled in Beijing Tuesday.

The Olympic trains will be even "smarter and greener" than the Fuxing bullet trains, which were put for service on the Beijing-Shanghai high-speed railway in September, according to Chinese railcar maker CRRC Changchun Railway Vehicle Co.

The company said the new trains were designed specifically for the Winter Olympics, featuring a media carriage with WiFi service and TV screens for live broadcasting, an athlete drug testing area and and a storage area for winter sports equipment.

CRRC Changchun also produced subway trains for the Rio Olympics and operated the system smoothly for the duration of the Games last year.

In April 2016, construction began on the world's first ballast track with maximum speed of 350 kph between Beijing and Zhangjiakou. The project is scheduled for completion by the end of 2019 and will shorten the trip between the two cities from the current three hours to just one hour.

Construction also began in 2016 on a 53.2-km extension of the Beijing-Zhangjiakou railway to Hebei's Chongli District, where most of the Olympic skiing events will be held. The trip from Zhangjiakou to Chongli will take 25 minutes.
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Old October 10th, 2017, 06:46 PM   #2139
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I Like CRH2E/2G .
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Old October 11th, 2017, 06:51 PM   #2140
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October 9, 2017
New fleet of trains help to showcase nation's expertise
China Daily Excerpt

The development of, and services offered by, new-generation bullet trains will benefit the government's promotion of the country's high-speed railway technology in the international market, according to officials at China Railway Corp.

In a statement published on its website in September, the State-owned railway operator said it plans to design and export bullet trains based on the CR400 Fuxing, or "rejuvenation", model, the nation's newest fleet of trains.

The statement added that the trains will meet the requirements of users overseas and will be competitive in the global market.

As prime examples of China's world-leading expertise, the CR400AF and CR400BF models were put into operation on the Beijing-Shanghai High-speed Railway in late June, running at about 300 kilometers per hour.

On Sept 21, the speed was increased to 350 km/h on the 1,318-km-long line, becoming the world's fastest operational wheeled rail vehicles. Their deployment cut the journey time between the municipalities by 60 minutes, reducing the trip to four and a half hours.

Their development began in 2012 under the Ministry of Railways, the predecessor of CRC, which aspired to manufacture bullet trains with "Chinese standards".

Before Fuxing came into service, trains running on the country's high-speed rail network had been designed and built in accordance with a range of standards in use overseas.

The new models have longer service lives than their predecessors - 30 years compared with 20 - and their streamlined designs allow lower power consumption and more space for every passenger, according to Zhang Bo, a designer at the China Academy of Railway Sciences.

Zhang said the overall design and all of the key parts - such as traction equipment, brakes and the control software - were developed by Chinese engineers.
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