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Old October 26th, 2004, 07:18 AM   #361
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TCL and AEL trains were built by CAF of Spain, and I remember some other company (I think it was Alstom) involved in the design. In my opinion, they still look the best out of the three MTR train types because of their plug doors and stylish front ends.
Plug doors should sound much quieter because they don't protrude from the train body. Therefore, wind has no chance of getting in (the old Metro Cammell trains have plenty of wind leak into the compartment), and the overall surface is much smoother in terms of aerodynamics. In terms of quietness, I'm talking about interior noise, just to clarify things.

I think it makes perfect logical sense.

EDIT: Oh yeah, it's Adtranz, not Alstom. lol
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Old October 26th, 2004, 11:59 AM   #362
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Trains of MTR:
-Modernized Stock [1979-1999(Refurbish)-Now](M trains)~Metro Cammell England (Alstom)
-Korean Stock [2003-Now](K trains)~Rotem/Mitsubishi Joint Venture
-LAR Stock [1988-Now](AEL and TCL trains)~Adtranz/CAF Joint Venture
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Old October 26th, 2004, 11:24 PM   #363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ignoramus
I was watching this TVB news video clip and the authorities were like telling passengers not to open the windows just because you see smoke.

Why?

And why do the trains come with windows that can be opened? I thought most new subway systems/lines have done away with windows that can be opened since the train car is now all air conditioned?

Thanks.

The train ventilation system should be strong enough to suck or filter most smoke out temporarily. The windows are probaby for emergency purposes, you don't want passengers suffocate or die of heat exhaustion during summers heat when electricity fails, although it almost never happens.
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Old October 26th, 2004, 11:27 PM   #364
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I also like the retrofitted glass doors more, I wonder who made the decision to install those glass panels that contain that ugly aluminum panel. Perhaps those Kaba ones are more expensive? I think most Asian platform glass panels are similar to the smaller glass panels with the aluminum bottom like some HK stations. I think Kaba is quite unique considering its huge size, I haven't seen any other metro system using it so far.
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Old October 26th, 2004, 11:36 PM   #365
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The older Platform Screen Doors in Singapore, as well as those in Taipei, Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur and Tokyo all have those metal strips both at the bottom and the middle of the doors.

Singapore's newer Platform Screen Doors as well as those in Guangzhou I think, which from the looks of it probably came from the same PSD company, are full glass panels.

It makes sense that the full glass panels that may be more expensive, after all, the glass in those panels have to be made to be strong cause without any additional support to hold the glass together in one big piece if the glass is not strong it will shatter easily. Thats what I think...
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Old October 27th, 2004, 12:47 AM   #366
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Maybe the non-retrofit doors were designed from scratch by local engineers, and the two-part nature of assembly made it cheaper or easier to install and maintain.

In any case, they're not terrible-looking, and it is a great privilege for a metro system to have PSDs implemented on the entire network. Hong Kong's new and renovated station environments are truly first-rate, comparable with the best and newest of Tokyo and Singapore's lines.

China's metro systems need to work on some form of innovation. Their stations are either blatant copies (albeit LEGAL copies with purchased designs and consulting) or boring derivatives.
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Old October 27th, 2004, 12:55 AM   #367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superchan7
Maybe the non-retrofit doors were designed from scratch by local engineers, and the two-part nature of assembly made it cheaper or easier to install and maintain.

In any case, they're not terrible-looking, and it is a great privilege for a metro system to have PSDs implemented on the entire network. Hong Kong's new and renovated station environments are truly first-rate, comparable with the best and newest of Tokyo and Singapore's lines.

China's metro systems need to work on some form of innovation. Their stations are either blatant copies (albeit LEGAL copies with purchased designs and consulting) or boring derivatives.
What do you mean by copies? Any pictures to act as a reference? Havent seen any pictures of any Chinese Station Design that wowed me as yet.

By the way when will the retrofit project be done? How many more Stations to go?
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Old October 27th, 2004, 01:34 AM   #368
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i think both screen doors look futuristic.
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Old October 27th, 2004, 02:36 AM   #369
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Guangzhou's subway stations are modeled after the Hong Kong system, including the signage and even the brush-stroke Chinese calligraphy for the station names.
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Old October 27th, 2004, 03:39 AM   #370
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Even the in train announcements are exactly the same as those in HK, except that Mandarin comes ahead of Cantonese for obvious reasons.

But Hong Kong's sounds much much nicer.
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Old October 27th, 2004, 04:21 AM   #371
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HK MTR PSD retrofit more than half done.

I too have yet to be wowed by pictures of a metro station in China. Recent projects such as the Chongqing monorail are not bad. Guangzhou's Line 1 was a copy of Hong Kong's old stations, and its Line 2 has station calligraphy and signage identical to HK's, except in simplified Chinese. The PSDs on Line 2 (very glassy), as well as the platform interior trim between the opening doors and the station ceiling, are unique (blue). Walls and ceiling trim patterns are similar to those of HKMTR.

Shanghai's new trains are pretty good-looking, but the station designs tend to be extremely bland and appear to be very basic in function.

EDIT: The retrofit started in 2002, and I'm guessing they're about 1/2 to 2/3 done. So the rest of the timetable can be pretty much guessed. Remember, these aren't just screen door installations; they're almost total platform-level renovations. The ventilation and climate control for each station gets a major overhaul, the ceiling gets fancy-looking aluminium trim and the entire station gets new lighting.
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Old October 27th, 2004, 04:42 AM   #372
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superchan7
HK MTR PSD retrofit more than half done.

I too have yet to be wowed by pictures of a metro station in China. Recent projects such as the Chongqing monorail are not bad. Guangzhou's Line 1 was a copy of Hong Kong's old stations, and its Line 2 has station calligraphy and signage identical to HK's, except in simplified Chinese. The PSDs on Line 2 (very glassy), as well as the platform interior trim between the opening doors and the station ceiling, are unique (blue). Walls and ceiling trim patterns are similar to those of HKMTR.

Shanghai's new trains are pretty good-looking, but the station designs tend to be extremely bland and appear to be very basic in function.
How long more?

I dont quite like the trains used in China's subways, they are too square. And in the case of Guangzhou's older trainsets, the yellow colour looks dirty and hideous.

Guangzhou's PSDs are I think the same as those in Singapore. The arrows on the doors speak for themselves.

The Chongqing Monorail looks like a copy of Tokyo's Monorail, and if thats not enough, its a bad copy too cause the Stations and trains are as boring as those in Tokyo.

Shanghai's new trains are made by Alstom, they look very very nice.

No Chinese Station I have seen so far has a very shocking design, all are boring. They should spend some of their skyscraper design juices on subway station designs instead.
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Old October 27th, 2004, 04:46 AM   #373
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Regarding Chongqing monorail: better a train from Japan than a copy based on a train from Japan! =P
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Old October 27th, 2004, 04:36 PM   #374
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[Video] KCR 80 Years On

This is a documentary clip of the history between 1910 and 1990 of Kowloon Canton Railway. The clip features with a narrator explaining the history of KCR, the development of Hong Kong and the future for both.

To download the clip, please feel free to right click and save file on any virtual images below or at this link:
http://video.natransit.com/Metrorail/KCR%2080%20Years%20On.rmvb


























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Old October 27th, 2004, 10:28 PM   #375
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Onboard route map of Ma On Shan line trains:



MTR can design a much better map than this.
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Old October 27th, 2004, 11:05 PM   #376
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Wow where you did get that exclusive picture from?

How better and why better?

Do passengers have to transfer trains at Tai wai if they want to go to ETST from Lo Wu for instance? Or will they be two different services, one heading to ETST from Wu Kai Sha and the other to Lo Wu from Wu Kai Sha?
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Old October 28th, 2004, 03:09 AM   #377
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MTR's on-board maps are also MUCH more expensive-looking. They have LEDs showing the train's position, direction of movement, and possible interchange movements for the passengers at a given station.
KCR, on the other hand, has its on-board TV screens to do the job. Just different methods.
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Old October 28th, 2004, 03:45 AM   #378
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When even a single new station is added to the MTR network it must be a headache for MTR to individually update each of these flashing maps in hundreds of train cars since it involves electrical stuff like wires etc.
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Old October 28th, 2004, 05:11 AM   #379
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Yes, I was thinking about that, and I thought there must be some easy way in the maps' design to be able to always update and reposition routes. Since there's a map above each door, and 10 doors per compartment and 8 compartments per train....and who knows how many trains.
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Old October 28th, 2004, 05:21 AM   #380
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Ya like they have to add a new flashing ''light bulb'' for every new station added to the map, connect the existing wires to the new wires connecting to this new bulb, and then programme everything to ensure that these new bulbs flash at the right moment...

Thats messy. Imagine if they really updated the maps using this tedious and complicated procedure, that would be nuts.

But on the plus side the maps are very cool, very fun to watch too. Though sometimes it makes you feel like an idiot cause they use flashing bulbs (moving objects) to show which station the train is at, which direction it is heading and so on when all adults need is just for a LED screen to tell them, next station name and direction of travel.

But anyways it adds a touch of uniqueness to the HK MTR that differentiates it from other subways elsewhere.
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