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View Poll Results: host city of Olympics 2012
London, UK 280 25.23%
Madrid, Spain 342 30.81%
Moscow, Russia 90 8.11%
New York, USA 206 18.56%
Paris, France 192 17.30%
Voters: 1110. You may not vote on this poll

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Old April 13th, 2006, 09:23 PM   #3001
MoreOrLess
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Indeed that was certainly part of it, you can't tell me that the fact there was going to be a purpose built stadium close to athlete accomodation didnt help though. I'm not trying to bash the US but for many I'm sure the Atlanta stadium is a symbol of the problems with those games, The Stade De France does I believe have a reputation for poor sightlines in athletics mode aswell.

I actually don't think its going to be so much a case that the IOC would never pick a stadium that was not purpose built for athletics but that most bids will try to include such a stadium to enhance their chances. Its not is just a technical matter afterall but also a means for highlighting the level of commitment to a bid as a whole.

Last edited by MoreOrLess; April 13th, 2006 at 09:31 PM.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 01:38 AM   #3002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoreOrLess
It may not have been in the past but I believe that a large part of the reason for London winning the 2012 games was that like Beijing they were offering a purpose built stadium that would be kept for athletics use(albeit with a reduced capacity). That sends a clear message that the bid values the olympics and athletics more than one which features a stadium to be converted for other uses plus of course provides more athletics facilites.
Maybe in a perfect world but I don't believe the IOC share the same moral values as you do. Sadly most IOC delegates only deal with $$$ and are a part of one of the worlds most corrupt organizations. I remember watching a BBC documentary a few years back where a couple of London reporters were posing (with hidden cameras) as 2012 officials trying to buy votes off IOC delegates through their agents . . . and succeeding. That same agent also claimed that Beijing won their bid on the back of some major infrastructure projects they were funding in Africa in return for votes.

IMHO, I don't believe some if not most IOC delegates give a flying proverbial about the quality of a bid when there's money involved.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 02:06 AM   #3003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NavyBlue
Maybe in a perfect world but I don't believe the IOC share the same moral values as you do. Sadly most IOC delegates only deal with $$$ and are a part of one of the worlds most corrupt organizations. I remember watching a BBC documentary a few years back where a couple of London reporters were posing (with hidden cameras) as 2012 officials trying to buy votes off IOC delegates through their agents . . . and succeeding. That same agent also claimed that Beijing won their bid on the back of some major infrastructure projects they were funding in Africa in return for votes.

IMHO, I don't believe some if not most IOC delegates give a flying proverbial about the quality of a bid when there's money involved.
I think that's always been the case. I wouldn't be surprised if in the coming years London2012 was rumoured to have been similarly generous but that's the only way to win. Sad but true.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 03:26 AM   #3004
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london won cause of
1.its marketing
2. final presentation
3.paris's awful final presentation
4. its project was exciting,.....

the IOC are people just like u and i....they vote with their hearts..mind...and uh pockets...but london certainly won the vote fair and square...i doubt the ioc would have sent the games back to spain...the voting error wasnt an error but a pure abstention...
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Old April 14th, 2006, 01:15 PM   #3005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NavyBlue
Maybe in a perfect world but I don't believe the IOC share the same moral values as you do. Sadly most IOC delegates only deal with $$$ and are a part of one of the worlds most corrupt organizations. I remember watching a BBC documentary a few years back where a couple of London reporters were posing (with hidden cameras) as 2012 officials trying to buy votes off IOC delegates through their agents . . . and succeeding. That same agent also claimed that Beijing won their bid on the back of some major infrastructure projects they were funding in Africa in return for votes.

IMHO, I don't believe some if not most IOC delegates give a flying proverbial about the quality of a bid when there's money involved.
I wouldnt be supprized if some favoures had been offered. Really though I'm not talking so much about the technicalities of the stadiums as the image they create. A stadium that does not have athletics as its primary consideration potentially sends a message(wheather true or not) about your level of comitment to the bid as a whole.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 01:49 PM   #3006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mo Rush
the IOC are people just like u and i....they vote with their hearts..mind...and uh pockets...but london certainly won the vote fair and square...i doubt the ioc would have sent the games back to spain...the voting error wasnt an error but a pure abstention...
I have no problem with London hosting the 2012 games even if evidence arises that they had done something untoward to win. They clearly had the best bid and fully deserve to host the OG. It's the whole IOC bid process that gives me the shits. A process that is anti-fairness and fully open to corruption which in itself goes against what the Olympic Games stand for.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 05:38 PM   #3007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mo Rush
london won cause of
1.its marketing
2. final presentation
3.paris's awful final presentation
4. its project was exciting,.....

the IOC are people just like u and i....they vote with their hearts..mind...and uh pockets...but london certainly won the vote fair and square...i doubt the ioc would have sent the games back to spain...the voting error wasnt an error but a pure abstention...
didn't London win because of a voting error?

Further more, London was a finalist because of the redevelopment plans.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 05:42 PM   #3008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rantanamo
didn't London win because of a voting error?

Further more, London was a finalist because of the redevelopment plans.
I think the voting error was overstated. In any case, if Madrid's supporters can't work out how to vote properly then they don't deserve to win.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 05:47 PM   #3009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rantanamo
didn't London win because of a voting error?

Further more, London was a finalist because of the redevelopment plans.
no ways
even if there was an error..madrid would have face london in the final round...u seriously think that the IOC would send the games back to spain again?..what kinda message would that be sending...

IOC Reiterates Voting Details For Host City Of The XXX Olympiad

27 December 2005
Following media speculation with regard to a possible error having been committed in the third and penultimate round of the election of the Host City of the Games of the XXX Olympiad, the International Olympic Committee has reiterated the facts of that round of voting:


* 104 voting boxes were distributed to the members eligible to vote (this does not include the IOC President, who chooses not to vote).
* 103 votes were cast.
* One IOC member did not vote.
* No abstentions were recorded, no votes were voided.
* The result of the vote was:
o London 39
o Paris 33
o Madrid 31.
* Having the least number of votes, Madrid was eliminated.
* Even if the 104th vote had been cast, it is mathematically impossible that it could have changed the outcome of the third round of voting i.e. even if the 104th vote had been cast for Madrid, that city would still have been eliminated, having one vote less than Paris, leaving Paris and London in the final round.

In accordance with the IOC's transparent process, full voting details were made available to media attending the IOC's 117th Session in Singapore.

Last edited by Mo Rush; April 14th, 2006 at 10:56 PM.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 08:16 PM   #3010
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I don't know if they would send it back to Spain or Not. I do know the US had two games within 12 years. And might get another for 2016.

My point about the voting error, is that you guys are going on about winning because of some purpose built stadium or not, when there were clearly many other factors going on. All you have to do is read articles about the IOC's decision and what they liked about London's bid: Re-use and Rehabilitation.

As for Turner Field, you might not like the look or that one end was torn down, but the fact is, it is a MLB stadium. It was one of the nicest, most amenity laden olympic stadiums ever because of that and served its purpose well. It also didn't have annoying roof shadows.
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Old April 14th, 2006, 11:14 PM   #3011
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Atlanta was lucky enough to have money poured in from Coca-Cola and other businesses in the Area for 96, plus the Dream Team II, but otherwise it was a big sham for the olympics, plus the godawful stadium. The games were going to go to Athens, but they were not ready.

However, Montreal had the worst stadium in Olympic history, in addition it was the worst olympic games to date, considering the fact that many countries did not participate in the game, and that ugly stadium costed a billion of dollars to build, and is still underfunded. The Expos would never survive in that stadium, and now play in DC.
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Old April 15th, 2006, 05:25 AM   #3012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habte
Atlanta was lucky enough to have money poured in from Coca-Cola and other businesses in the Area for 96, plus the Dream Team II, but otherwise it was a big sham for the olympics, plus the godawful stadium. The games were going to go to Athens, but they were not ready.
Melbourne had a good chance of getting 1996.

Atlanta also altered city record lowering crime rates and poverty issues to make its bid look more attractive.
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Old April 17th, 2006, 12:17 PM   #3013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habte
Atlanta was lucky enough to have money poured in from Coca-Cola and other businesses in the Area for 96, plus the Dream Team II, but otherwise it was a big sham for the olympics, plus the godawful stadium. The games were going to go to Athens, but they were not ready.

However, Montreal had the worst stadium in Olympic history, in addition it was the worst olympic games to date, considering the fact that many countries did not participate in the game, and that ugly stadium costed a billion of dollars to build, and is still underfunded. The Expos would never survive in that stadium, and now play in DC.
Did you know that Montreal is still paying for the Olympics because they were something like 4 or 5 times over budget. And this is like almost 40 years later.
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Old April 17th, 2006, 05:39 PM   #3014
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rantanamo
I don't know if they would send it back to Spain or Not. I do know the US had two games within 12 years. And might get another for 2016.

My point about the voting error, is that you guys are going on about winning because of some purpose built stadium or not, when there were clearly many other factors going on. All you have to do is read articles about the IOC's decision and what they liked about London's bid: Re-use and Rehabilitation.

As for Turner Field, you might not like the look or that one end was torn down, but the fact is, it is a MLB stadium. It was one of the nicest, most amenity laden olympic stadiums ever because of that and served its purpose well. It also didn't have annoying roof shadows.
OH wow no shadows...thats amazing thats certainly a good enough reason why its better than the 110,000 now 80,00 telstra stadium previously stadium australia rrright. amenity laden...yeah well because it was used before...i dont think any VIP's or athletes or spectators went short on amenities at the 2000 stadium..
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Old April 17th, 2006, 08:18 PM   #3015
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The shadows were still horrible. Athletes don't like them. They will tell you that if you ask. In a place like London, its likely not a problem. In sunnier climates it is. Why do you think the use of 'bird cloth' materials are becoming so vogue? Fashion? No.
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Old April 17th, 2006, 08:23 PM   #3016
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The cloth materials are probably more popular because shadows cause grass to not grow properly. I can't imagine shadows being that big of a problem for someone who's job it is to run 100 meters as fast as possible.
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Old April 18th, 2006, 03:09 AM   #3017
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That stadium in New York could never have been built at that location. For all it's reputation as a progressive place they're pretty conservative when it comes to sporting facilities. Notice that the baseball facilities are pretty old and that's their so-called national past-time. The NFL stadium is in East Rutherford, New Jersey. Yes, East Rutherford, New Jersey. The Madison Square Garden was built on what was a rail station and people there got angry about that (understandably).

The Olympic stadium was an idea by the mayor and the Jets and was going to go on what is now a railyard shed. And they got white heat for that. For my fellow Euros, there's a section in New York called the West Side, also called Hell's Kitchen. The people there are pretty hardcore when it comes to anti-stadium. So much so that they organised blogs and websites to further their cause. Politicians from that area came out against it because they were afraid of those people. West Siders have a reputation for killing off big projects, like the stadium. I don't know how the convention centre got built considering.

Therefore, no stadium there. No Olympics and maybe never in New York.
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Old April 18th, 2006, 10:06 PM   #3018
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The main reason it was cancelled was b/c nobody wanted to pay for it, and this was even for those who supported having it.
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Old May 3rd, 2006, 10:13 PM   #3019
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Old May 3rd, 2006, 10:44 PM   #3020
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delhi or dubai, it somewhere where thers never been an olympics (south asia)
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