daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old April 22nd, 2014, 09:02 AM   #2441
K_
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,744
Likes (Received): 243

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcVD View Post
Not that hard ? You have to buy a ticket, sometimes at a machine where there is an half-an-hour queue.
Actually last time I bought my metro ticket from the SBB ticket office at the same time I bought my TGV tickets. But on the occasions I had to buy one at the station I've never had to queue. And the last time I was in Paris Nord I noticed that there were actually signs saying "Paris Lyon" that you could follow to get to the right platform. I have to check whether the reverse route is signposted in the same way though.
(I only change stations in Paris on the way to the UK. Switzerland - Belgium I always travel via Germany).
K_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old April 22nd, 2014, 09:06 AM   #2442
K_
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,744
Likes (Received): 243

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcVD View Post
In stations ? You have both cases. In Paris stations for example, Intercity and
suburban trains are mostly separated. In Germany, S-bahn tracks are often
separated too. Other countries (Belgium, Netherlands, Switzerland...) usually
mix all the traffic on the same tracks.
In smaller countries the distinction between suburban and intercity rail doesn't even really exist. Most of the Swiss ICs would be considered suburban trains in the US for example. And in Switzerland or the Benelux countries there is no difference in tariff between IC and local trains.
K_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 22nd, 2014, 11:57 AM   #2443
trance0
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 541
Likes (Received): 173

In Slovenia the difference between IC and local trains actually does exist. A surcharge of 1.5 EUR must be paid for all IC trains, which is not much, but for short journeys this can effectively double the price.

Last edited by trance0; April 22nd, 2014 at 12:03 PM.
trance0 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 22nd, 2014, 03:08 PM   #2444
bagus70
Ես ցանկանում եմ ծծել ձեր
 
bagus70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Surabaya. The City of Hot Headed Heroes.
Posts: 3,911
Likes (Received): 891

For those who mixed their commuter and intercity trains in the same lines, how do they manage the traffic to prevent conflicts?
__________________
Visit Indonesia and enjoy the railway tour, volcanoes tour such as visit to mount Bromo and Ijen. Click: http://www.indonesianrailwaytour.com/
bagus70 está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old April 22nd, 2014, 03:35 PM   #2445
DKF01
Registered User
 
DKF01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 571
Likes (Received): 253

Quote:
Originally Posted by bagus70 View Post
For those who mixed their commuter and intercity trains in the same lines, how do they manage the traffic to prevent conflicts?
Priorities
DKF01 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 22nd, 2014, 03:42 PM   #2446
Reivajar
__________
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 12,081
Likes (Received): 3340

In Spain for example most of the commuter networks share tracks with the rest of trains. However, generally, platforms for commuter trains are segregated and used only for those services. However, sometimes commuter services and regional services are sort of mixed at some point, so, those platforms are used too for regional services. However the segregation most of times is due to fare systems, as to get into those platforms you need to cross turnstiles -and not generally for other services- or because those platforms are shorter than the used ones by long distance trains.

Really few stretches are reserved only for commuter trains, just some particular branches and particular lines. However, along trunk lines sometimes you get reserved tracks for commuter traffic.

The point, finally, is that in Spain commuter trains and network standards are completely compatible with the rest of the network, so, ultimately it can be used by any kind of traffic (or in other way, a commuter train can be enrouted out of the usual commuter network).

For preventing conflicts, usually or night hours are reserved for the most "disturbing" trains or it is just about looking for room in between trains and having enough tracks for allowing passing and overtaking in stations while other trains are stopped. The peak times in the morning and in the evening usually commuter trains have a huge priority, while in the night a freight train can run without any kind of problem and i is not a priority to tun during the day that kind of traffic.
Reivajar no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 22nd, 2014, 07:28 PM   #2447
K_
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,744
Likes (Received): 243

Quote:
Originally Posted by bagus70 View Post
For those who mixed their commuter and intercity trains in the same lines, how do they manage the traffic to prevent conflicts?
The same way you manage potential conflicts between any two trains. Timetables.
K_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 22nd, 2014, 07:50 PM   #2448
AlexNL
Registered User
 
AlexNL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,629
Likes (Received): 537

Proper timetabling, setting of priorities and where necessary space for IC trains to overtake regional or freight trains.
__________________
We are shaping the future
AlexNL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 04:49 AM   #2449
bagus70
Ես ցանկանում եմ ծծել ձեր
 
bagus70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Surabaya. The City of Hot Headed Heroes.
Posts: 3,911
Likes (Received): 891

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKF01 View Post
Priorities
Can you elaborate further? Which trains are normally given bigger priorities? The commuters or the inter cities?
__________________
Visit Indonesia and enjoy the railway tour, volcanoes tour such as visit to mount Bromo and Ijen. Click: http://www.indonesianrailwaytour.com/
bagus70 está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 08:22 AM   #2450
XAN_
Registered User
 
XAN_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,034
Likes (Received): 760

Quote:
Originally Posted by bagus70 View Post
Can you elaborate further? Which trains are normally given bigger priorities? The commuters or the inter cities?
You can choose either to have more trains, but with the same average speed (that called parallel timetable - timetable were no train overtake any other train), or chose to have faster intercity trains, but at cost of lower line capacity.
__________________
"I'm lost but still I know//There is another world"
-H. Kürsch, 1995
"Well, we all know there's no other side"
-H. Kürsch, 2002
XAN_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 11:46 AM   #2451
AlexNL
Registered User
 
AlexNL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,629
Likes (Received): 537

Quote:
Originally Posted by bagus70 View Post

Can you elaborate further? Which trains are normally given bigger priorities? The commuters or the inter cities?
Long distance overtakes short distance, international trains go before others. Freight is assigned a high priority as well as these trains need a long time to accelerate and to come to a stop, which is capacity intensive.
__________________
We are shaping the future
AlexNL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 01:42 PM   #2452
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post

Long distance overtakes short distance, international trains go before others. Freight is assigned a high priority as well as these trains need a long time to accelerate and to come to a stop, which is capacity intensive.
You'd think that in a small overpopulated country like Holland, you want to keep the masses moving. The hell with the international lines, people need to get to work. Imagine the London Underground coming to a standstill for a few minutes because the train to Paris needs to pass through...
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 03:25 PM   #2453
DKF01
Registered User
 
DKF01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 571
Likes (Received): 253

Quote:
Originally Posted by bagus70 View Post
Can you elaborate further? Which trains are normally given bigger priorities? The commuters or the inter cities?
It depends of what time is its.
If is rush-hour commuters trains are given a higher priority that inter cities trains and in some of the cases the Innercity train departs first since it does few stops along the way before the line is cramped with commuter trains.
When is not rush-hour ussualy the priority goes to Innercity and freight train since there isnt much traffic.
DKF01 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 06:04 PM   #2454
K_
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,744
Likes (Received): 243

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKF01 View Post
It depends of what time is its. If is rush-hour commuters trains are given a higher priority that inter cities trains and in some of the cases the Innercity train departs first since it does few stops along the way before the line is cramped with commuter trains. When is not rush-hour ussualy the priority goes to Innercity and freight train since there isnt much traffic.
The time of day shouldn't really matter. Railway like the NS or the SBB run the same timetable throughout the whole day. And basically you just time your trains such that fast trains overtake slower trains where overtake possibilities exists. The way an efficient railway does this is to first design the timetable, and then plan the infrastructure based on that timetable.
K_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 06:31 PM   #2455
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,539
Likes (Received): 21253

Quote:
Originally Posted by K_ View Post
The time of day shouldn't really matter. Railway like the NS or the SBB run the same timetable throughout the whole day. And basically you just time your trains such that fast trains overtake slower trains where overtake possibilities exists. The way an efficient railway does this is to first design the timetable, and then plan the infrastructure based on that timetable.
The downside of that approach is that when some disruption happens, chaos ensue.
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 06:43 PM   #2456
K_
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,744
Likes (Received): 243

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
The downside of that approach is that when some disruption happens, chaos ensue.
So you make sure disruption doesn't happen. My experience is that SBB is quite good at dealing with disruption anyway. My train back home today way actually an ICE, pressed in to service to replace an IC, and even rerouted part way. Yet most passengers on board could expect to reach their final destination on time anyway.
K_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 06:46 PM   #2457
K_
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,744
Likes (Received): 243

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
You'd think that in a small overpopulated country like Holland, you want to keep the masses moving. The hell with the international lines, people need to get to work. Imagine the London Underground coming to a standstill for a few minutes because the train to Paris needs to pass through...
Which is why some railways integrate international trains in the domestic network. The TGV from Zürich to Paris runs in an IC slot between Zürich and Basel, and is accessible for people with domestic tickets as well.
The advantage is that it this way gets a very convenient schedule, with good connections with trains to other places in Switzerland. The disadvantage is that two train sets are needed on the morning TGV to Paris just to fit all the commuters. The second set actually gets uncoupled in Basel, and only one set continues to Paris...
__________________

Road_UK, trance0 liked this post
K_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 07:02 PM   #2458
dimlys1994
Moderator
 
dimlys1994's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Dniepropetrovsk
Posts: 16,355
Likes (Received): 26177

From Rail Journal:

Quote:
http://www.railjournal.com/index.php...ml?channel=542

Eurostar reports strong first quarter growth
Wednesday, April 23, 2014

THE number of passengers travelling by Eurostar high-speed services between London, Paris and Brussels increased by 3% to 2.3 million, while revenue grew by 7% to £227m during the first quarter of 2014

Eurostar says growing economic confidence has translated in greater demand for business travel, with the number of Business Premier travellers increasing by 6%. It also says revenue would have grown by 8% had income not been affected by currency fluctuations.

"The improvement we have seen in the corporate travel market in recent months underpins the strong performance reported today," says Eurostar's CEO Mr Nicolas Petrovic. "Coupled with the benign winter weather which saw far lower levels of weather-related disruption than in previous years, the first quarter has set us on course for continued growth throughout the year."
dimlys1994 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 08:05 PM   #2459
AlexNL
Registered User
 
AlexNL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,629
Likes (Received): 537

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
You'd think that in a small overpopulated country like Holland, you want to keep the masses moving. The hell with the international lines, people need to get to work. Imagine the London Underground coming to a standstill for a few minutes because the train to Paris needs to pass through...
Most of the international trains can also be used for domestic travel, including ICE (altho a small surcharge is required if you're not a pass holder). Exceptions are all Thalys trains and CityNightLine or EuroNight trains.
__________________
We are shaping the future
AlexNL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2014, 08:21 PM   #2460
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

And yet - haven taken the CNL from Amsterdam to Munich a few times, I have always seen commuters getting on at Augsburg...
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 06:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium