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Old April 21st, 2017, 01:22 AM   #3461
sotavento
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K_ View Post
And as these things are all completely superfluous they can be abolished, saving everyone 30 minutes, and saving some money too. How is that not superior to investing billions in more direct route from Calais to Paris?

Compare the Eurostar with the train from Helsinki to st. Petersburg. That train crosses an external EU/Schengen border, to a country that needs visa from most people. Yet immigration formalities are done on board.
How many karelian vs eurostar passengers a day ??? can france/EU or the UK/england return a passenger who actually boarded a train to the origin without losing the following lawsuit in court ???


Calais-Paris route:

Current layout by Calais-Lille-Arras = 330km
Remove loop by Lille and go by:
Direct Armentieres-Lens shortcut = 310km ~5-10 minutes less travel time
Direct Calais-SaintOmer-Bethume-Arras line = 280km ~10-20 minutes
Direct Calais-Etaples-Amiens-Beauvais = 260km
Direct Calais-Amiens-Paris = 230km (~40 minutes at 350km/h?)
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"O País perdeu a inteligência e a consciência moral. Ninguém se respeita nem crê na honestidade dos homens públicos. O povo está na miséria. Os serviços públicos vão abandonados. A mocidade arrasta-se das mesas das secretarias para as mesas dos cafés. A ruína económica cresce o comércio definha, a indústria enfraquece. O salário diminui. O Estado é considerado um ladrão e tratado como um inimigo.
Neste salve-se quem puder a burguesia proprietária de casas explora o aluguel. A agiotagem explora o juro…"”
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Last edited by sotavento; April 21st, 2017 at 01:38 AM.
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Old April 21st, 2017, 01:40 AM   #3462
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcVD View Post
You cannot justify the existence of à high speed line with just 2 or 3 trains each way per day in the morning and afternoon.
Tell that to the spanish.
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"O País perdeu a inteligência e a consciência moral. Ninguém se respeita nem crê na honestidade dos homens públicos. O povo está na miséria. Os serviços públicos vão abandonados. A mocidade arrasta-se das mesas das secretarias para as mesas dos cafés. A ruína económica cresce o comércio definha, a indústria enfraquece. O salário diminui. O Estado é considerado um ladrão e tratado como um inimigo.
Neste salve-se quem puder a burguesia proprietária de casas explora o aluguel. A agiotagem explora o juro…"”
— Eça
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Old April 21st, 2017, 01:31 PM   #3463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotavento View Post
How many karelian vs eurostar passengers a day ??? can france/EU or the UK/england return a passenger who actually boarded a train to the origin without losing the following lawsuit in court ???
Karelian was used by ~400000 passengers in 2016 and it is not comparable at all because of there will be the border and different regions for infinite time, the historical and cultural differences are too big and the demand will remain small.
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Old April 22nd, 2017, 02:16 PM   #3464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtManDoo View Post
Karelian was used by ~400000 passengers in 2016 and it is not comparable at all because of there will be the border and different regions for infinite time, the historical and cultural differences are too big and the demand will remain small.
True about the border, but the demand would triple or quadruple if it ever became possible to do this trip without first acquiring a visa.
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Old April 24th, 2017, 09:43 AM   #3465
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True about the border, but the demand would triple or quadruple if it ever became possible to do this trip without first acquiring a visa.
Yes because the price would become cheaper, but as we know it is unrealistic.
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Old May 4th, 2017, 03:53 PM   #3466
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Eurostar Class 373 / TMST at the scrapyard

https://www.flickr.com/photos/37260/...n/photostream/

https://flic.kr/p/S55xqY

Last edited by 33Hz; May 4th, 2017 at 03:59 PM.
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Old May 4th, 2017, 04:03 PM   #3467
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Great news!

The border checks on the Öresund (Copenhagen / Malmö) seem to come to an end shortly.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39784715
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Old May 5th, 2017, 02:43 PM   #3468
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotavento View Post
How many karelian vs eurostar passengers a day ??? can france/EU or the UK/england return a passenger who actually boarded a train to the origin without losing the following lawsuit in court ???
That is a matter of having the right legislation and international agreements in place. I would expect that to be cheaper than building a new high speed railway...
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Old May 6th, 2017, 12:39 AM   #3469
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpUp View Post
Great news!

The border checks on the Öresund (Copenhagen / Malmö) seem to come to an end shortly.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39784715
Finally! That farce of border controls was just a dumb excuse to bully train passengers! Why? Because the road was just wide open! Ending this hypocrite situation, which also would not have worked after all since Denmark is stricter than Sweden on immigration apart from border controls, is the only right thing to do.
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Prohibit the construction of new single-family dwellings without stacking apartments in Amsterdam (A10), Rotterdam (motorway ring), The Hague, Utrecht (outer ring), Eindhoven (ring), Tilburg (ringbanen) and Groningen (provincial ring)!

And prohibit the use of agricultural land for new dwellings!
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Old May 6th, 2017, 12:42 AM   #3470
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I wonder when trains between Groningen (Netherlands) and Bremen (Germany) will start running again. It's been a long time since service was replaced by bus after a bridge was damaged near Leer.
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Old May 6th, 2017, 08:57 AM   #3471
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If I remember well what I read in the press, this bridge will take years to repair. So don't hold your breath just yet...
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Old May 6th, 2017, 03:51 PM   #3472
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They haven't even decided what they're going to do yet, there's no funding, and stakeholders down the river also want a say.
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Old May 6th, 2017, 04:03 PM   #3473
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So is a tunnel an option?
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Old May 8th, 2017, 03:05 PM   #3474
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Anyway, whatever they make, they should make it HSR compatible.
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Old May 9th, 2017, 03:17 AM   #3475
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TGV Paris-Lyon
47€ non exchangeable
97€ exchangeable
102€ flexible


ESUK Paris-London
237€ exchangeable


wonder what could be changed...
__________________
"O País perdeu a inteligência e a consciência moral. Ninguém se respeita nem crê na honestidade dos homens públicos. O povo está na miséria. Os serviços públicos vão abandonados. A mocidade arrasta-se das mesas das secretarias para as mesas dos cafés. A ruína económica cresce o comércio definha, a indústria enfraquece. O salário diminui. O Estado é considerado um ladrão e tratado como um inimigo.
Neste salve-se quem puder a burguesia proprietária de casas explora o aluguel. A agiotagem explora o juro…"”
— Eça
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Old May 9th, 2017, 04:09 AM   #3476
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusiluz View Post
I can not find a Thread on worldwide high speed, so I'll put in this.

From the comparison between the data of Passengers, Passengers-kilometers, and services called high-speed (CRH, Frecce, ICE, KTX, TGV...) of each operator, I conclude that the data provided from operators refer to Premium services, either circulating on HSR or conventional lines.
It can be summarized this way: data from annual report operators match those of the UIC although we know that the services of those trains include sections of conventional network.

In Germany, data from the UIC and DB (Page 19) match, which means that the data are all travelers on ICE trains, either circulating on HSR or conventional lines.



The same is true in Italy, where Trenitalia (FdS) only publishes Frecce train passengers data. The Premium long distance division includes Frecciabianca trains, traveling at up to 200 km/h on high-speed lines, although most of its route is done by conventional lines; Frecciargento trains (250 km/h) alternating both types of lines, and Frecciarossa trains (300 km/h) which usually run on high-speed lines.



Or Korea, where UIC has all travelers although KTX trains running on conventional lines to a maximum of 160 km/h.



If there is any doubt, suffice this fact in France: if we divide the number of Passengers-km of the LGV Atlantique (page 7) between the number of Passengers (page 13) results the medium-haul, over the years it varies between 388 and 404 km while the maximum travel of the line is 228 km; this can only mean that TGV also account travel along conventional lines.


In this commentary (in Spanish) I explain each service and providing maps, data and sources.

Sorry for my bad English.
The only EU country who NEEDED to change gauge was spain ... the others didn't NEED TO BUILD A COMPLETELLY NEW network just to add a couple of trains.
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"O País perdeu a inteligência e a consciência moral. Ninguém se respeita nem crê na honestidade dos homens públicos. O povo está na miséria. Os serviços públicos vão abandonados. A mocidade arrasta-se das mesas das secretarias para as mesas dos cafés. A ruína económica cresce o comércio definha, a indústria enfraquece. O salário diminui. O Estado é considerado um ladrão e tratado como um inimigo.
Neste salve-se quem puder a burguesia proprietária de casas explora o aluguel. A agiotagem explora o juro…"”
— Eça
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Old May 9th, 2017, 09:05 AM   #3477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotavento View Post
TGV Paris-Lyon
47€ non exchangeable
97€ exchangeable
102€ flexible


ESUK Paris-London
237€ exchangeable


wonder what could be changed...
Eurostar also has cheaper fares, starting from € 39 one way. Those tickets do tend to run out rather quickly though!
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Old May 9th, 2017, 11:44 AM   #3478
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Its been 20 years since I was able to actually get a ticket at that price, despite the Eurostar sales that have been advertised over the years.

Perhaps they are so expensive because they throw away perfectly good trains after 20 years?


Last edited by 33Hz; May 9th, 2017 at 11:51 AM.
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Old May 9th, 2017, 06:58 PM   #3479
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"perfectly good trains" that have run millions of miles, that were made for a very specific use, and that have been replaced by better* trains.

* Better to Eurostar at least, as the daily running costs of the e320 fleet will most likely be lower than that of the TMST fleet, while the e320's allow them to serve new destinations.
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Old May 9th, 2017, 07:24 PM   #3480
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If the trainset had residual value, they would be sold to SNCF to become part of OuiGo fleeet.
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