daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old May 29th, 2005, 11:06 PM   #21
Nephasto
Enlightened user
 
Nephasto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Porto
Posts: 5,802
Likes (Received): 71

^

It could be done in that time if it was all newly build high speed line.
But it isn't in germany...
__________________
Long live rail freight!!
Nephasto no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old May 30th, 2005, 07:14 PM   #22
Bitxofo
¡Viva el metro!
 
Bitxofo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Alderaan BCN BKK ATH PAR LON SYD SFO CPT TYO SCL CHC BUE SCG SVQ AGP BDN
Posts: 37,533
Likes (Received): 3681

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodder
The ICE and TGV will run rotationally on the track. It is also said that the trains will take just under 4h.
4 hours for 575 km. ??

It is a bit slow...


In 2007, Spanish AVE will make Barcelona-Madrid in 2,50 hours, for 650 km.

Barcelona-Paris 5 hours in 2009, 1200 km.!!
__________________
www.urbanrail.net
Εγώ είμαι ο Νταβόρ!!
David (DavoR for my friends)
川添 Kawazoe (riverside) 海斗 Kaito (big dipper of the ocean), in Japanese.
Yo si la ciudad no tiene metro, como que no es gran ciudad y entonces ya paso de vivir allí. Norreport+12000

Last edited by Bitxofo; May 30th, 2005 at 07:20 PM.
Bitxofo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 30th, 2005, 07:28 PM   #23
rocky
Registered User
 
rocky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: London/Paris east suburbs
Posts: 1,305
Likes (Received): 5

not to forget that you can work in the train, and you have a better comfort
rocky no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 30th, 2005, 08:40 PM   #24
goschio
proud Kuffar
 
goschio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ujerumani
Posts: 6,062
Likes (Received): 4270

Those super high speed trains over long distances don't make realy sense. Its much cheaper to fly. Just take all the tax money, which is spent for the tracks ,into account. The national economy will never make a profit out of it.
goschio no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 30th, 2005, 09:37 PM   #25
Justme
Gotta lite?
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester (Forecast: Rain)
Posts: 4,953
Likes (Received): 781

Quote:
Originally Posted by goschio
Those super high speed trains over long distances don't make realy sense. Its much cheaper to fly. Just take all the tax money, which is spent for the tracks ,into account. The national economy will never make a profit out of it.
They do make sense if they are comparable in time to flying - which I believe is 3 to 3.5 hours as mentioned above.

Why? Because not everyone only looks for the cheapest deal. When you go to a resturant, is your main criteria price? Or do you also look for a comfortable place with excellent food? I know I'll pay extra for brilliant food in a good environment.

It's the same with rail travel. I'd easily spend more to travel by train which is far more comfortable than plane, even if it costs more - as long as it's not too much more.

By the way, our taxes also goes into building airports, Terminal 5 in Heathrow ain't that cheap.
__________________
I'm doing my bit to save bandwidth by deleting my signature
Justme no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 31st, 2005, 12:50 AM   #26
Nephasto
Enlightened user
 
Nephasto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Porto
Posts: 5,802
Likes (Received): 71

Quote:
Originally Posted by goschio
Those super high speed trains over long distances don't make realy sense. Its much cheaper to fly. Just take all the tax money, which is spent for the tracks ,into account. The national economy will never make a profit out of it.
I mind you that the example cited above of Barcelona-Paris (1200km/5 hours) isn't a new line being build! It's just the connection between the french TGV network and spanish AVE network, that will allow trains to go from Barcelona to Paris.
No one is building a Barcelona-Paris line, because that would be nonsense, since the distance is huge.

But Madrid-Barcelona for example, is a great distance for a fast high speed rail. 2,5 hours is much competitive with the plane, and much more confortable.

3 hours is the limit, for long distances, when the plane starts to be in advantage.
__________________
Long live rail freight!!
Nephasto no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 8th, 2005, 07:46 PM   #27
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,962
Likes (Received): 18239

Saving Eurotunnel

Eurotunnel to cut 10% of jobs as part of rescue plan
By PEGGY HOLLINGER
8 June 2005
Financial Times

Eurotunnel is close to announcing plans to shed about 10 per cent of its workforce as part of the restructuring programme aimed at rescuing the debt-laden Channel Tunnel operator.

It is understood the group, which employs 3,205 people in the UK and France, is hoping in the coming days to conclude negotiations with unions over a voluntary redundancy programme that could see about 250 jobs being shed in the UK. A further 100 staff are likely to opt for redundancy in France, where labour laws are far tougher.

The news comes as Eurotunnel yesterday launched its new pricing strategy, based on the model used by low-cost airlines, which varies prices according to how early passengers book and at what time they travel.

The initiative is a key part of Project Dare, the restructuring programme launched last year to cut costs and boost revenues.

But Eurotunnel's main problem is its Euros 9bn (Pounds 6bn) debt, and yesterday the group's creditors reiterated their warning that the escalating row between shareholders and management risked jeopardising debt negotiations.

Jacques Gounon, the chairman appointed in January, is fighting an attempt to replace him by rebel shareholder Nicolas Miguet, who last year managed to oust the entire board in a dramatic coup.

In his campaign to win support at next week's annual meeting on June 17, where his appointment must be approved by shareholders, Mr Gounon has said the banks will have to forgive some Euros 6bn in debt.

He argues that, based on the group's forecast revenues and earnings, Eurotunnel's balance sheet is capable of bearing just Euros 3bn in debt.

Creditors said both candidates appeared to be using the same "unrealistic" argument.

"If someone wins this election by raising unrealistic expectations, then they are deluding shareholders into thinking they will get something for nothing," one person close to the creditors said.

"If they think creditors will take a haircut on this, well, it just isn't going to happen."

Eurotunnel is facing two crucial deadlines on its debt.

At the end of this year it will no longer be allowed to roll over debt interest payments into debt. And in 2006, the minimum tariff for users of the Channel Tunnel expires, which could mean the group's revenues will fall sharply.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 8th, 2005, 08:46 PM   #28
Vertigo
Fan van de Neudeflat
 
Vertigo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Utrecht
Posts: 2,487
Likes (Received): 130

O well, even if it would go bankrupt, the gov't will probably act to keep it open. No way they would leave this expensive piece of infrastructure unused.
Vertigo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2005, 01:34 AM   #29
Englishman
Urge Desire Rest
 
Englishman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: London
Posts: 2,400
Likes (Received): 96

Quote:
250 jobs being shed in the UK. A further 100 staff are likely to opt for redundancy in France, where labour laws are far tougher.
That sucks. Bloody French labour laws meaning cuts have to be in hte UK. Still it shows how a company might be more inclined to employ people in the UK than France.
Englishman no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2005, 02:23 AM   #30
ssiguy2
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: White Rock BC
Posts: 5,404
Likes (Received): 860

I f France can outwit the British, more power to em. Thats what happens when Britain becomes a little America.
ssiguy2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 10th, 2005, 04:49 AM   #31
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,962
Likes (Received): 18239

Eurostar Expects Passengers to Double After St. Pancras Move

Transport Eurostar expects Paris rush
10 June 2005
The Guardian

Eurostar expects its passenger numbers to double in the next seven years thanks to a new transport hub at St Pancras station, London.

The cross-channel train operator believes the number of people using the service will rise to 14 million a year within five years of the switch to the pounds 60m interchange at St Pancras.

The new station in the north of the capital will open to international services in 2007, making it easier for passengers travelling from the north to catch Eurostar trains.

Paul Charles, director of communications at Eurostar, said the 14 million target was "achievable", though still well off targets set before the service started running.

"Forecasts made in the late 1980s and early 1990s were ridiculous," he said.

"They assumed people would travel from Manchester to Barcelona by train."

Under the original predictions, Eurostar would already have broken through the 14 million barrier.

Mr Charles also said that Eurostar was still looking at proposals to start running direct Eurostar services to Amsterdam and Cologne, though not for a further three years. - PA
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 10th, 2005, 05:38 AM   #32
Bitxofo
¡Viva el metro!
 
Bitxofo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Alderaan BCN BKK ATH PAR LON SYD SFO CPT TYO SCL CHC BUE SCG SVQ AGP BDN
Posts: 37,533
Likes (Received): 3681

They should reduce prices first.
Eurostar is very expensive!!
__________________
www.urbanrail.net
Εγώ είμαι ο Νταβόρ!!
David (DavoR for my friends)
川添 Kawazoe (riverside) 海斗 Kaito (big dipper of the ocean), in Japanese.
Yo si la ciudad no tiene metro, como que no es gran ciudad y entonces ya paso de vivir allí. Norreport+12000
Bitxofo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 10th, 2005, 07:37 PM   #33
samsonyuen
SSLL
 
samsonyuen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Canary Wharf > CityPlace
Posts: 8,350
Likes (Received): 314

I think the price is pretty comparable to airplanes. The terminal's going to be beautiful. Double is pretty crazy though.
samsonyuen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2005, 08:15 AM   #34
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,962
Likes (Received): 18239

UK: Eurotunnel's Raymond reveals split on strategy
By ROBERT WRIGHT
14 June 2005
Financial Times

Eurotunnel's outgoing chief executive yesterday launched an extraordinary attack on the company's recent direction as the board appointed Jacques Gounon to be chief executive in addition to his present post as chairman.

The events appeared to add a clear split on strategy to the existing bitter personality clashes that have caused severe problems for the board of the Channel Tunnel operator ahead of its annual meeting on Friday.

Jean Louis Raymond told a press conference yesterday, at which he was joined by Herve Huas, formerly deputy chief executive and now a non-executive director, that he would stand for chairman against Mr Gounon at Friday's meeting and put up a list of alternative directors should Mr Gounon be defeated.

Mr Raymond will have the support of Nicolas Miguet, the maverick financier and would-be politician who ran the campaign to unseat Eurotunnel's then Franco-British board at last year's annual meeting, replacing them with an entirely French board of largely inexperienced businessmen.

Mr Miguet had already for some months been running a campaign against confirming Mr Gounon's reappointment as chairman at the AGM.

Mr Raymond went on to call for coming renegotiations with creditors over the company's Pounds 6.4bn debt to be consensual. The present board's aggressive strategy towards creditors could only lead either to the company's bankruptcy or to creditors using their right to substitute their management for the company's in the tunnel's operation, he said.

"In that case, the big losers will be the shareholders and employees," he said.

Eurotunnel needs to renegotiate its debts before a cash crunch that is looming next year.

The new position is a significant reversal of the line Mr Miguet and his supporters took in the run-up to last year's AGM. Then, he told shareholders it was necessary to take a far harder line against creditors than the then board.

However, the latest stance is likely to be welcomed by creditors, who have been concerned by the extreme language Mr Gounon has been using in the run-up to the AGM. He has regularly called on creditors to forgive a majority of the company's debt for nothing in return.

Mr Miguet's appointees have gradually fallen out, since last year's AGM, with board members close to Adacte, a small French Eurotunnel shareholders' action group, whose appointees have made up the bulk of the board since last year's coup.

Mr Gounon is seen as being close to the Adacte-supporting members of the board, who continue to insist that a debt renegotiation can be carried out without diluting the company's existing shareholders' stakes. Most financial observers think that very unlikely.

As Mr Raymond and Mr Huas addressed yesterday's press conference, Eurotunnel announced that Mr Gounon was to take over as chief executive. Mr Raymond's resignation, announced on Friday, took effect from today's meeting.

It is not clear which side on the divided board will have more support at Friday's meeting - or whether the 25 per cent of shareholders needed for the meeting to be valid will vote.

Eurotunnel nevertheless welcomed yesterday statements from PIRC, ABI and ISS, corporate governance analysts, recommending that shareholders support the existing board at the meeting.

The recommendations look unlikely to make much difference to the voting intentions of Eurotunnel's shareholders, who are mostly French private shareholders.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2005, 05:54 PM   #35
Justme
Gotta lite?
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester (Forecast: Rain)
Posts: 4,953
Likes (Received): 781

Let's be honest, do they really need 3205 people to run the tunnel? It is just a tunnel isn't it?

I wonder if that includes Eurostar?
__________________
I'm doing my bit to save bandwidth by deleting my signature
Justme no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2005, 09:28 PM   #36
Rational Plan
Registered User
 
Rational Plan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Slough
Posts: 3,672
Likes (Received): 678

No but it does include the vehicle shuttle service.
Rational Plan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2005, 11:50 PM   #37
Justme
Gotta lite?
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester (Forecast: Rain)
Posts: 4,953
Likes (Received): 781

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rational Plan
No but it does include the vehicle shuttle service.
ok, that's pretty fair, but it still seems a little bloated to me, 3200 makes it a very large company, and considering it's a single tunnel with a single purpose, I just find it odd that so many people need to be on the payrole.

Sometimes downsizing is good.
__________________
I'm doing my bit to save bandwidth by deleting my signature
Justme no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2005, 11:55 PM   #38
Ning
Registered User
 
Ning's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 645
Likes (Received): 7

I think the EuroTunnel company includes more than only the tunnel. There are the trains, the customer service, the 500 km railway outside the tunnel, etc.
__________________
I only visit this forum when drunk
Ning no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 15th, 2005, 12:05 AM   #39
Englishman
Urge Desire Rest
 
Englishman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: London
Posts: 2,400
Likes (Received): 96

Quote:
Originally Posted by ssiguy2
I f France can outwit the British, more power to em. Thats what happens when Britain becomes a little America.
Nah, it works in our favour. Where are you gonna risk employing an extra person. The UK, if business goes downhill you can cut costs. In france you can't. They've twice the UK unemployment rate.


Anyone with BBC2 can watch a programme on this right now!
Englishman no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 15th, 2005, 01:57 AM   #40
Nephasto
Enlightened user
 
Nephasto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Porto
Posts: 5,802
Likes (Received): 71

^When is the second part of the CTRL (tunnel all the way to st. pancras) going to be completed? I think it is supposed to be in 2007.

Do you know how much time does the fastest eurostar take from London to Paris now?

And when the 2nd part ot the CTRL is finished? I've heard it will take about 2h15min.
__________________
Long live rail freight!!
Nephasto no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 02:52 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium