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Old December 7th, 2007, 03:28 PM   #81
Tcmetro
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The Bay Area should have a zoned fare/transfer system that is good on all bus lines and rail lines. Seattle has interagency transfers, and fares are generally cheap, unlike SF. Some BART trips will cost $8.


For night service there is the All-Nighter Network, which covers most of the Bay Area with a good network.
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Old December 8th, 2007, 01:01 AM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jose_kwan View Post
i do hope that there are more transfer stations between bart and caltrain. like 4th and king, is not connected directly to the bart, but only muni. transferring thru so many different rails is $$$$ ... and bart should offer express trains in rush hour. the furthest i have lived from the bart is berkeley or daly city. i cant imagine how long for those coming from dublin or pittsburg.
That's true, millbrae was planned to be a major transfer station, but passenger turn out is not that high

Mind you, I used to commute (and sometimes still do) from Millbrae to berkeley, and the trip takes ~70 minutes with no delay, I usually wind up going to Daly City and taking BART from there, and the trip is only ~40 minutes, depending on whether there's a train waiting
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Old December 8th, 2007, 04:35 AM   #83
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cal Train is similar to the Miami Tri Rail only differences is that

most of Tri Rail is two tracks now because of the completion of the double track project

and also CSX and Amtrak uses the Route that Tri Rail goes but only before the Metrorail 79th st Station is where Amtrak ends but will contiune when the MIC is completed

Cal Train is similar but different in a way in that it has express and local routes not something that Tri rail has and it could easily convert itself to Electric Trains and such like the NEC and well since it will do that with the California High Speed Railway
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Old December 12th, 2007, 09:44 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcmetro View Post
When will the extension to San Jose open?
BART San Jose/Santa Clara Extension

The extension is being built in two stages. Expansion of the line from Fremont to Warm Springs is underway and will be complete in 2013. The section from Warm Springs to San Jose/Santa Clara is currently under planning review, with a completion target beyond year 2015 at the moment.

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Does anyone ever see the BART ever creating a loop around the bay?
There are no plans to expand the BART network in the south bay beyond the planned extension to San Jose/Santa Clara, as Caltrain is already providing an adequate service for the peninsular corridor. Both BART and Caltrain will co-exist for the foreseeable future and remain the backbone of their respective transit corridors. Upgrades to Caltrain will soon bring its capabilities above and beyond what BART can provide in terms of speed, service, and cost effectiveness.

BART network expansion

These planned extensions to San Jose/Santa Clara, Livermore, and East Contra Costa County shown will be the final outward expansion of the BART network. Additional outward extensions will utilize a different network of high speed express trains to better match the demands of long distance travel. BART's focus will then shift to expansion of its network within the urban core of San Francisco, expanding service along its existing lines with additional staions and express trackage, and limited extensions to better connect its existing network to transit terminals around the bay.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcmetro View Post
Does anyone ever see extensions to Marin County, or Vallejo County ever happening?
Sonoma-Marin Rail Transit (SMaRT)


In Marin County, the new Sonoma-Marin Rail Transit (SMaRT) project is now being finalized. It will provide passenger service between Sonoma and Marin Counties along the Northwestern Pacific rail corridor that lies next to Highway 101, bringing commuters to the existing ferry terminal at Larkspur Landing for a transfer to ferries onwards to San Francisco.

Capitol Corridor


Solono county (Vallejo) is currently served by the Capitol Corridor commuter service. Currently service is limited by the high amount of freight traffic that share the trackage. The construction of a thrid and forth track along the corridor is planned and should be complete before 2015 and allow passenger service to bypass the slower freight trains. A new station on the line at Vacaville is also in the works.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jose_kwan View Post
i do hope that there are more transfer stations between bart and caltrain. like 4th and king, is not connected directly to the bart, but only muni. transferring thru so many different rails is $$$$ ...
Caltrain Downtown Extension


The Caltrain Downtown Extension will extend Caltrain 1.3 miles through an underground tunnel to the new Transbay Terminal in the heart of the San Francisco. The Terminal would connect Caltrain together with BART, AC Transit, Golden Gate Transit, SamTrans, and SF Muni. It will also house the future San Francisco terminal of the California High Speed Rail network.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcmetro View Post
The Bay Area should have a zoned fare/transfer system that is good on all bus lines and rail lines. Seattle has interagency transfers, and fares are generally cheap, unlike SF. Some BART trips will cost $8.
The current system offers some discounts for transferring passengers with a ticket or transfer from one service being accepted on another service, along with payment of a discounted fare. However retaining ticket stubs or remembering to request transfer slips is inconvenient, inconsistent and confusing.

Smart cards systems are now being introduced to automatically apply discounts when used for a trip involving transfers, and could easily be adapted for a inter-agency zone-based fare system in the future as well.

There are currently two smart card systems in use - the inter-agency Translink, and BART's EZ-Rider. Translink is currently in use on AC transit buses in the East Bay and MUNI light rail in San Francisco, and will soon be adopted for use by Caltrain. BART's own in-house EZ-rider smart card works similarly, but does not interchange with any system outside BART at the moment. It is currently undergoing limited trials.



Translink smart card reader at Caltrain station
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Old December 12th, 2007, 04:33 PM   #85
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I know that the Tracy extention will probably be DMU, but it seems like a way smarter decision to go to Stockton rather than Tracy. Why not Stockton?
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Old January 24th, 2008, 02:00 AM   #86
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I love the BART.
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Old January 24th, 2008, 06:55 AM   #87
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That extension from antioch would make better sense going to Stockton and Livermore going to Tracy, that looks rather weird on that future extension map.
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Old January 24th, 2008, 07:53 AM   #88
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How come BART ridership hasn't increased a lot in last few years as traffic in Bay Area gotten worse?
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Old January 24th, 2008, 04:13 PM   #89
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The proposed Tracy extension is an example of building along the path of least resistance - The terrain and distance from Byron to Tracy are more favorable in comparison to transversing the Altamont Pass from Livermore.
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Old January 26th, 2008, 08:23 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by busdriver View Post
The proposed Tracy extension is an example of building along the path of least resistance - The terrain and distance from Byron to Tracy are more favorable in comparison to transversing the Altamont Pass from Livermore.
Oh that's right, I forgot about Altamont Pass. Maybe they could build a tunnel, but that would be too long and too expensive.
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Old January 27th, 2008, 10:41 PM   #91
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Well imo BART is very effective in terms of frequency service, is well known in the bay area and ridership is in the top 10 in the US. what i like about BART is its unique system. although some stations need more improve improvements, especially those outside san francisco stops and 16th and 24th Mission stations, and the cost of some tickets go far up to $8 one ride which is very expensive fare cost. if you use the bart plus ticket it may be used as transfer tickets in muni, including light rail, samtram wheels and other buses but not for caltrain.
The only thing i wish is to see more BART stops in san francisco like chinatown, castro, and other inward san francisco places.

i can't wait to have the new terminal done with its innovative building, and functionality with all modes transportation serving there. i guess it would the largest terminal in california more than Union Station in Los Angeles.
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Old January 28th, 2008, 07:46 PM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parte del mundo View Post
Well imo BART is very effective in terms of frequency service, is well known in the bay area and ridership is in the top 10 in the US. what i like about BART is its unique system. although some stations need more improve improvements, especially those outside san francisco stops and 16th and 24th Mission stations, and the cost of some tickets go far up to $8 one ride which is very expensive fare cost. if you use the bart plus ticket it may be used as transfer tickets in muni, including light rail, samtram wheels and other buses but not for caltrain.
The only thing i wish is to see more BART stops in san francisco like chinatown, castro, and other inward san francisco places.

i can't wait to have the new terminal done with its innovative building, and functionality with all modes transportation serving there. i guess it would the largest terminal in california more than Union Station in Los Angeles.
I have heard of people complaining that BART is too expensive to ride. They say it's often cheaper to commute by car or bus to work than riding BART.
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Old January 30th, 2008, 09:23 AM   #93
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Does anyone know future BART expansion in other areas in San Francisco?
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Old January 31st, 2008, 05:59 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parte del mundo View Post
Does anyone know future BART expansion in other areas in San Francisco?
transit enthusiasts (like me) dream of a bart line down geary blvd

but bart has no expansion plans for sf, just san jose
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Old July 18th, 2008, 12:19 PM   #95
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Frayed strand halts cable car route
Mason line service expected to resume today after repair

15 April 2008
The San Francisco Chronicle

A frayed cable strand brought a portion of the Powell/Mason cable car line in San Francisco to a halt all day Monday, highlighting the fragile nature of running a moving national historic monument.

It was the third time in a week that service stopped while workers replaced a fraying cable.

Such cable troubles happen about 50 times a year and are all part of operating the city's cable cars, which have been part of the San Francisco landscape for 135 years.

"If anyone's going to lose sleep over it, it's going to be me, and I sleep pretty comfortably," said Christopher Hill, cable car maintenance manager for the San Francisco Municipal Transportation Agency.

Hill, who has been working in the cable car shop for 31 years, said he knows of only three times during his tenure that one of the cables snapped outright.

When the cable breaks or frays, the power is shut off automatically and the cars stop.

More common than a snapping of an entire cable, Hill said, is for one of the six strands that make up the cable to break. The weakest points are in the spliced sections, which is where problems occurred Monday and twice last week.

Four steel cables run San Francisco's cable car system, the only operation of its kind still in use on public streets.

The city monitors the cables "24/7," with about 80 high-tech sensors embedded underground every few blocks along the routes, Hill said. The cables also are observed firsthand by maintenance workers for 2 out of every 8 hours the cable cars are in service. They get a more thorough going-over before they pick up their first riders of the day at 5 a.m.

The sensors help pinpoint the problem location for the maintenance crews back at the cable car barn on Nob Hill. Workers can either splice the cable, a job that entails entwining about 100 feet of new cable with old - "no welding, no glue," Hill said - for a quick fix, or replacing the entire cable.

The cable isn't cheap. Manufactured by WireCo WorldGroup's Broderick & Bascom Rope Division in Sedalia, Mo., the cable costs $3.30 a foot. The Powell cable car line, the shortest in the system, is 9,300 feet; the California cable car line, the longest, is 21,700 feet, or more than 4 miles.

On Monday, the decision was made to replace the cable, which was due for replacement anyway. The projected life of a cable runs from 100 days to 250 days; busier lines with more cars mean more wear and tear on the cables.

Replacing a cable takes about five hours and is usually done in the middle of the night when the system isn't carrying passengers.

The Mason line, which runs on a cable 10,700 feet long, is expected to be back in service today, Municipal Transportation Agency spokesman Judson True said.

The line carries 7,574 passengers on an average weekday. The route runs from Market and Powell streets to Fisherman's Wharf.

On Monday, Muni replaced the Mason line cable cars with motor coaches. A portion of the route also is served by the Powell/Hyde line.

Combined, the cable cars generate about $24,000 in fare revenue a day.
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Old July 18th, 2008, 01:24 PM   #96
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wow... 4 miles of cable... and that is in only one piece :O

i'm curious how do they change cables... i suppose they have some special truck with cable and then just spread it along the route...
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Old July 18th, 2008, 03:26 PM   #97
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I remember seeing exhibits about that in the cable car museum. Not too good with remembering the contents now as it has been a while since my visit. It's quite a fascinating piece of infrastructure!
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Old July 18th, 2008, 06:31 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blijdorp
Do they still use trams and/or cable cars as public transport to or is it just touristic?
The Powell-Hyde and Powell-Mason cable cars are used primarily by tourists, although in a car holding 40-50 people, it is typical to have about 10 locals per car who are headed to and from the Nob Hill and Russian Hill areas. These areas don't have great alternative service to and from Union Square, so the cable car does fill in a valuable (albeit small) niche in the transport network. The monthly pass for Muni is accepted on the cable cars without an extra charge, so the high fares are not a problem for residents.

The California cable car is used more often by locals than the Powell lines and offers an alternative to the often-crowded 1-California trolley bus line one block away. It also doesn't carry as many tourists because it doesn't go where tourists want to go.

The F-line historic streetcars on Market Street are used extensively by both tourists and locals alike. Daily ridership is about 20,000 or so, higher during the summer tourist season.

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i'm curious how do they change cables... i suppose they have some special truck with cable and then just spread it along the route...
If I remember correctly, they somehow attach it to the existing cable and just "thread" it through the system.
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Old July 19th, 2008, 07:22 PM   #99
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Shame, one of the world's prime communities clumsily takin' to grimy, stark utility poles...any chance that custom's
gonna be overcome there?
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Old August 29th, 2008, 06:26 AM   #100
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Wi-Fi pilot called a success - talks on systemwide rollout
11 April 2008
The San Francisco Chronicle

More than 8,000 BART riders have been quietly surfing the Internet on trains and stations in downtown San Francisco and along a stretch of track in Hayward as part of a pilot project that could be expanded systemwide.

BART is negotiating with Wi-Fi Rail Inc. to install a high-speed wireless network throughout the 104-mile rail operation, including the Transbay Tube. Once a deal is struck, it could take another year to outfit the entire system.

"The testing has been successful," said Michael Cromar, chief financial officer of Wi-Fi Rail, a startup company from Gold River near Sacramento. The company developed the technology for use on trains.

The program was tested above and below ground, on moving trains and in a handful of subway stations and the tunnels. Anyone who has a laptop or handheld device outfitted for wireless access can tap into the nascent system.

Logging in is easy. All you have to do is launch a Web browser in one of San Francisco's downtown BART stations or when riding through south Hayward, and Wi-Fi Rail's system will find you - if all goes according to plan. Riders also have been allowed to video conference with the system.

Users don't have to pay anything during the test period.

The company has picked up the entire $1 million-plus tab for the demonstration project, which has been in the making for more than a year, Cromar said.

BART has not given the company permission to go systemwide but is negotiating a proposed deal, said agency spokesman Linton Johnson. Among the areas to be worked out are terms of access for other wireless Internet providers that would want to piggyback on Wi-Fi Rail's system.

BART is looking to use as a model the mobile phone service on trains and in stations. Sprint Nextel was awarded the right to install equipment on BART property, but is required to let other companies pay for the right to use it.

As for how much riders will pay for wireless Internet access, Cromar envisions a subscription service where people would pay a set monthly or yearly fee. Such user-based fees usually cost $20 to $30 a month, or around $300 a year, Cromar said, but ultimately the price would be set by market demand.

He said BART patrons who subscribe to another wireless service could be charged roaming fees. Another option is to allow people to sign on for free - at least in the short-term - if they're willing to be subjected to advertisements.

The endeavor may be a moneymaker for BART, if the agency can negotiate a revenue-sharing plan with the company, Johnson said.
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