daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old June 13th, 2011, 09:35 PM   #2361
NCT
Not Cwite There
 
NCT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Shanghai, London, Nottingham
Posts: 6,211
Likes (Received): 1779

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
I understand that a major reason hampering high speed traffic Nanjing-Beijing is that there are just 2 tracks, full of 250 km/h trains.

How about Nanjing-Shanghai? There are 4 high speed tracks. Is it feasible for 250 km/h trains to get through Nanjing to Nanjing-Shanghai high speed railway?
Quote:
Originally Posted by fragel View Post
sure. for instance D trains from Wuhan to Shanghai travel on Nanjing-Shanghai ICL after they reach Nanjing.
Actually it's not possible - there are no tracks connecting Beijing-Shanghai to Nanjing-Shanghai at Nanjing South. If you look at this thread you will find a track layout of Nanjing South, which clearly shows there are no tracks connecting the two lines. A bit stupid if you ask me.

It seems that the main reason for the reduction in top running speed is making the death of airlines slower. There's an article in FT Chinese which seems quite reasonable. Operational cost of the railway is a small percentage of the total cost most of which being construction and rolling stock investment, and higher revenue from faster hence more trains offsets the higher running cost anyway as fixed cost per train lowers, so higher efficiency is actually achieved by running uniformly fast trains and not uniformly slow ones.

The airline industry along the Wuhan-Shanghai and Wuhan-Guangzhou corridor has pretty much collapsed, and this is what would happen if Beijing-Shanghai trains could run in under 4 hours at current prices. Given there are 3 planes an hour between Beijing and Shanghai, the 8 direct G-trains per day between Shanghai and Beijing in the current schedule will prove insufficient, by which time the need to run more trains will push up speeds of the slower trains. So let's hope that the 'soft-landing-for-airlines' theory is correct, and the MOR will think more economically and less bureaucratically in the long run.
__________________
My Shanghai photos - Nanjing Road, People's Square, The Bund, Xintiandi and more!
NCT no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old June 13th, 2011, 09:39 PM   #2362
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,978
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by laojang View Post
D trains 7h56min.
7:56 is somewhat inconveniently long for day train.

And not too long for overnight!

Are there any 250 km/h sleeper trains for Beijing-Shanghai, Beijing-Hangzhou, Beijing-Fuzhou and Beijing-Xiamen overnight trains?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 09:43 PM   #2363
Silly_Walks
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,978
Likes (Received): 836

Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
While under 4 hours would be superbe, 4h48m for the entire trip is still impressive. Compare to HSR, commercial airline trip rarely takes less than 4 and half hours, including 2.5hr flight, and 1 hr each to the airports as well as clearing security.
Plus you can keep working and stay connected while on HSR. It's a lot more difficult to keep working and stay connected on an airplane.
Silly_Walks no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 10:03 PM   #2364
NCT
Not Cwite There
 
NCT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Shanghai, London, Nottingham
Posts: 6,211
Likes (Received): 1779

Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
While under 4 hours would be superbe, 4h48m for the entire trip is still impressive. Compare to HSR, commercial airline trip rarely takes less than 4 and half hours, including 2.5hr flight, and 1 hr each to the airports as well as clearing security.
To be honest, the HSR isn't that much more competitive than airlines at the moment.

1. Cost. The cheapest advance purchase fares on airlines are around the ¥530 mark, including taxes. Adding in the extra ¥25 for the Beijing airport express total cost is about the same as the 2nd class train fare.

2. Journey time. In terms of raw travel time, planes rarely use more than 2 hours, so HSR suffers by about 3 hours. It is true that Beijing South Station is much better located than Beijing Capital airport, so taking the train saves about 30 minutes (journey time taken by the airport express). At the Shanghai end though, the station and airport are at the same place, so there's no time saving there. The boarding process on Chinese railways is almost as cumbersome as on airlines so time saving wouldn't exceed 15 minutes. There's no baggage reclaim upon arrival though, so that's another 15 minutes or so saved. You are still looking at HSR being 2 hours slower, but airline punctuality is a bit of a joke, so there's still hope.

3. Flexibility, comfort and convenience. Railway tickets are amendable and refundable, which isn't the case for the cheapest air tickets, but the process is still cumbersome. Comfort-wise, railways seats are much more comfortable than economy-class plane seats, and business travellers can work with access to wifi and mobile signals.

The current set-up is still giving the airlines some breathing space. Let's just hope that the running speed will eventually become 380 km/h and by some stroke of luck flexible ticketing (like any-time tickets with which you can get on any train), then HSR will truly spell the death of the airlines.
__________________
My Shanghai photos - Nanjing Road, People's Square, The Bund, Xintiandi and more!
NCT no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 11:30 PM   #2365
vincent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,380
Likes (Received): 7

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post

3. Flexibility, comfort and convenience. Railway tickets are amendable and refundable, which isn't the case for the cheapest air tickets, but the process is still cumbersome. Comfort-wise, railways seats are much more comfortable than economy-class plane seats, and business travellers can work with access to wifi and mobile signals.
I remember when the Wuhan-Guangzhou high speed rail first opened in 2009. There were some technical difficulties for using mobile phone because the train passes the cell-phone signal too quickly or not enough signal tower etc. I am not sure about the wi-fi internet.

Has these technical issues been resolved yet?
vincent no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 11:36 PM   #2366
vincent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,380
Likes (Received): 7

Quote:
Originally Posted by laojang View Post
Yes. It is 4h48 min for one stop G trains from BJ to SH, the second fastest G trains take 4h55 min, and the D trains 7h56min.

IMHO, 555Yuan for 1318km in 4h48 min is not bad.

Laojang
So what's time needed for the 250 km/h service (with one stop at Nanjing South)? i would think it would be more like 5 hours and 30 mins.

what service exactly are you talking for the time to be 4h55m? 300km/h service with Nanjing South and another stop?
vincent no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 11:43 PM   #2367
vincent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,380
Likes (Received): 7

Quote:
Originally Posted by fragel View Post
seats will be installed soon, and that won't take much time.
the main waiting hall(58 thousand m^2) of Nanjing South should be much larger than that of Hongqiao(11 thousand m^2), not sure about Guangzhou South though(I am not sure if its 77 thousand m^2 is for its main waiting hall).



a full priced economy class seat on most flights costs about RMB 1100 for single trip or RMB 2000 for round trip, but you can get discounted ticket as low as RMB 500(single trip) or 1000(round trip) during low season. extra RMB 160 for tax and fees. Now airline companies even offer some RMB 400 economy class seat to compete with the HSR.

For single trip flight, it takes about 2.5 hours. But only 72.6% of the flights between Beijing and Shanghai this year were on time(after sacrificing on-time rates on other air routes), and that is already a huge improvement from last year's 45%(could be as low as 32% in last July). During summer time the rate significantly drops due to thunderstorms and typhoons.

If the original plan of high speed trains running at 380km/h was carried out, then it would be disastrous for the airline companies.
thanks a lot for the info.

As for the area of the waiting hall, purely by just looking at the photo, i think the Nanjing South looks bigger than the Shanghai one. But it definitely doesn't look 6 times bigger. Maybe the 58000 m^2 figure includes area other than the waiting hall.

As a side topic though, i always wonder why the on-time rate is so low. Is it because the Beijing airport runway capacity being too low to meet the demand? or simply just bad air traffic management?
vincent no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 11:52 PM   #2368
NCT
Not Cwite There
 
NCT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Shanghai, London, Nottingham
Posts: 6,211
Likes (Received): 1779

Quote:
Originally Posted by vincent View Post
So what's time needed for the 250 km/h service (with one stop at Nanjing South)? i would think it would be more like 5 hours and 30 mins.

what service exactly are you talking for the time to be 4h55m? 300km/h service with Nanjing South and another stop?
There are no direct D-trains (250km/h). The fastest one is that takes 7h56mins with quite a lot of stops. Those trains are not really intended for Shanghai - Beijing passengers but ones in between.

The 4h55m services are likely to be ones that stop at Nanjing South and Jinan West.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vincent View Post
thanks a lot for the info.

As a side topic though, i always wonder why the on-time rate is so low. Is it because the Beijing airport runway capacity being too low to meet the demand? or simply just bad air traffic management?
Runways are running close to capacity, but rather a lot of the delays occur in the Typhoon season.
__________________
My Shanghai photos - Nanjing Road, People's Square, The Bund, Xintiandi and more!
NCT no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 11:57 PM   #2369
vincent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,380
Likes (Received): 7

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-0...5-yuan-1-.html


Beijing-Shanghai Bullet-Train Tickets to Cost From $86, Less Than Expected
By Bloomberg News - Jun 13, 2011 1:31 AM PT


The Beijing-Shanghai bullet train, opening later this month, will offer coach-class tickets for a less-than-expected 555 yuan ($86), boosting the threat to local airlines on their busiest route.

One-way trips in the two different premium classes will cost from 935 yuan and 1,750 yuan on 300 kilometers-per-hour (186 miles per hour) services, Vice Rail Minister Hu Yadong told reporters today in Beijing. The line will move about 180,000 passengers a day initially, he said.

Fares on three existing bullet-train lines will also be reduced by 5 percent as the ministry slows trains to 300 kph to pare operating costs and boost passenger numbers, Hu said. Beijing Capital International Airport Co. fell in Hong Kong trading and Air China Ltd. (753) and China Eastern Airlines Corp. dropped in Shanghai on concern the 1,318-kilometer Beijing- Shanghai high-speed line will lure travelers from planes.

“The ticket price is competitive and it will attract some passengers from airlines,” said Li Lei, an analyst with China Securities Co. in Beijing. “Whether the train can retain travelers will depend on the service levels.”

The line will run 90 services a day each way, including cheaper ones traveling at 250 kph. Operations will begin by the end of the month, Hu said without specifying a date. Ticket sales will start a week before the services. The 221 billion- yuan high-speed rail link is designed to carry 80 million passengers a year.

Price Pressure
“The lower-than-expected ticket price is a bit of a positive,” said Gary Wong, an analyst at Guotai Junan Securities Co. “But the operators are facing big pressure to cut prices further.”

Trains will be slowed on the Wuhan-Guangzhou, Zhengzhou- Xian and Shanghai-Nanjing lines from July 1 to pare costs, Hu said.

Zhao Jian, a professor at Beijing Jiaotong University, which specializes in railways, said this month that standard tickets on the Beijing-Shanghai line would likely cost more than 600 yuan.

The 300 kph trains will travel from Beijing to Shanghai in less than five hours. A flight takes about two hours, excluding travel time to airports and waits for check-in. About 25 percent of Chinese flights also suffer delays.

Air China, the biggest carrier in Beijing, is advertising June 19 flights to Shanghai from 410 yuan on its website. Carriers will offer an average of more than 20,000 seats a day on the route this month, the seventh-highest tally worldwide, based on data from OAG Aviation Solutions.

Beijing Airport Shares
Beijing Airport dropped 0.6 percent to HK$3.53 in Hong Kong, after earlier declining as much as 12 percent. In Shanghai, Air China declined 2.1 percent to 8.97 yuan and China Eastern, the biggest airline in the city, fell 1.8 percent to 5.04 yuan. Both carriers closed little changed in Hong Kong.

To ensure safety on the new Beijing-Shanghai line, the operator will undertake at least four hours of inspections every night, Hu said. A train with no passengers onboard will also be run along the line first thing every morning as well, he said.

The new line will contribute to a 9.6 percent increase in China’s railway passenger capacity from July 1, Hu said. Cargo capacity will rise by 6 percent, he said.

The ministry also reiterated plans to spend 2.8 trillion yuan on railways in the five years ending 2015. That will boost the total network to about 120,000 kilometers, said Hu.

“Investments won’t be reduced,” he said. “The pace of development won’t be slowed.”

--Tian Ying. Editors: Vipin V. Nair, Dave McCombs
vincent no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 12:06 AM   #2370
vincent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,380
Likes (Received): 7

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english201...c_13925965.htm

China sets trial prices for Beijing-Shanghai high-speed rail

BEIJING, June 13 (Xinhua) -- China's railway ministry announced Monday speed-based trial prices for the Beijing-Shanghai high-speed railway.

Tickets for trips on trains running at 300 kph will be priced between 555 yuan (85.6 U.S. dollars) for second-class seats and 1,750 yuan for business class. Prices for journeys on 250-kph trains will range from 410 yuan for second-class seats to 650 yuan for first-class.

Prices will float according to the market and for the good of passengers, said Vice Minister of Railways Hu Yadong at a press conference.

There will be 63 pairs of trains with the speed of 300 kph every day, cutting travel time to 4 hours and 48 minutes. The additional 27 pairs of trains running 250 kph will complete the trip in about 8 hours, 2 hours shorter than the current high-speed trains.

The 1,318-kilometer rail will go into commercial service at the end of this month, after trial operations that began May 11.

The 136 ordinary trains currently in use between the two metropolises will continue providing service after the bullet trains commence service, according to the ministry.

The ministry decided to slow the speed to 300 kph instead of the previously planned 350 kph for cost and safety concerns, Railways Minister Sheng Guangzu said in April.

Hu said running safety is guaranteed as the track has passed a preliminary check and met standards for running at such fast speeds. Further, the ministry has made specific measures and preparatory plans to ensure security, he said.

Last week, an inspection team consisting of 30 engineering academicians and experts gave the green light for the Beijing-Shanghai high-speed rail line to open after examining the systems communication signal, tractive power supply, operation control and energy-saving and environmental protection measures.

Hu said the new line will significantly ease the transportation strain between the two cities and promote development and coordination between regional economies.

In the initial phase, the new rail will increase cargo transportation capacity by 140,000 tonnes per day and 50 million tonnes per year, he said.

The introduction of bullet trains provides passengers one more option for fast travel between the two cities but threatens to lure away airlines' customers.

A full-price flight is about 1,130 yuan for second-class seats on trips between Beijing and Shanghai, which takes about one hour and 40 minutes. Passengers also pay 50 yuan for an airport construction fee and 140 yuan for a fuel surcharge.

Air China fell 2.07 percent to 8.97 yuan at market close

Monday and China Eastern Airlines dropped 1.75 percent to 5.04 yuan. Train maker China CNR Corp. rose 1.05 percent to 6.72 yuan.

GF Securities said the operation of Beijing-Shanghai high-speed railway will win passengers over from planes, resulting in uncertainties to the future profitability of airlines.

Airlines have felt the challenge and cited the expansion of high-speed rails as one of the uncertainties to their future profitability in their first-quarter reports.

Ministry spokesman Wang Yongping said the introduction of the new rail will definitely bring changes to the current transportation structure between the two cities, but it still takes time to evaluate the impact, he said, adding "we should view the change in a positive light."

Hu also said the ministry will implement a new rail operation plan on July 1 that will add 195 pairs of passenger trains to bring the total to 2,128.5 pairs per day nationwide, which will carry 4.01 million people per day, an increase of 9.6 percent from the current capacity.

The ministry reiterated plans to spend 2.8 trillion yuan on railways in the five years to 2015, which will boost the total network to 120,000 kilometers, Hu said.

"The pace of development won't be slowed and investments won't be reduced," he said.
vincent no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 12:12 AM   #2371
fragel
Registered User
 
fragel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Fragel Town, Michigan
Posts: 1,452
Likes (Received): 55

Quote:
Originally Posted by laojang View Post
Yes. It is 4h48 min for one stop G trains from BJ to SH, the second fastest G trains take 4h55 min, and the D trains 7h56min.

IMHO, 555Yuan for 1318km in 4h48 min is not bad.

Laojang
I thought chornedsnorkack was asking about the exact schedule time. sorry
__________________
女口果人尔能句多王里解这句言舌,京尤言兑日月人尔有匕匕车交严重白勺斗又鸟目艮。
fragel no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 12:44 AM   #2372
fragel
Registered User
 
fragel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Fragel Town, Michigan
Posts: 1,452
Likes (Received): 55

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post

It seems that the main reason for the reduction in top running speed is making the death of airlines slower. There's an article in FT Chinese which seems quite reasonable. Operational cost of the railway is a small percentage of the total cost most of which being construction and rolling stock investment, and higher revenue from faster hence more trains offsets the higher running cost anyway as fixed cost per train lowers, so higher efficiency is actually achieved by running uniformly fast trains and not uniformly slow ones.

The airline industry along the Wuhan-Shanghai and Wuhan-Guangzhou corridor has pretty much collapsed, and this is what would happen if Beijing-Shanghai trains could run in under 4 hours at current prices. Given there are 3 planes an hour between Beijing and Shanghai, the 8 direct G-trains per day between Shanghai and Beijing in the current schedule will prove insufficient, by which time the need to run more trains will push up speeds of the slower trains. So let's hope that the 'soft-landing-for-airlines' theory is correct, and the MOR will think more economically and less bureaucratically in the long run.
the air traffic between Wuhan-Guangzhou isn't as important as that between Beijing-Shanghai. Wuhan-Guangzhou airline has more disadvantages, there used to be much fewer daily flights, airports are far away, plus the travel distance is shorter. The Beijing-Shanghai line is the busiest and thus the most profitable line, it has the highest priority of taking-off, you can change flights between the three big companies, there are 40+ flights daily, and Hongqiao Airport and railway station are together. It won't be completely wiped out even if the trains are running at 380km/h. But if 50% of passengers decide to switch from airplanes to trains, that is unacceptable to airlines.

airline companies must be behind the back trying to slow the high speed trains, however, I think the main cause is that the party bosses want to make the train rides cheaper. I have no doubt that HSRs would be profitable without reducing operational speed, there are enough people who could afford the fastest high speed trains. But those who cannot afford or not willing to pay high fares have made significant influence. after all railways in China are public transportation unlike airlines. So the additional 250km/h trains are used to alleviate the public's concern, and to make the mixed running work most efficiently they chose the 300km/h+250km/h mode. when it is politically motivated, it is impossible to achieve the optimal economic scheme.

But the current D-train pricing isn't very good for long trips. it takes much longer time, and it isn't much cheaper than G-train. (410 vs. 555, D 2nd class is only RMB145RMB cheaper than G 2nd class from Beijing to Shanghai.) plus the first class on D-trains are much much more expensive than before. they could be popular on short routes still. When more CRH380 are available in the future, they might cut some of the D-trains and eventually speed up.
__________________
女口果人尔能句多王里解这句言舌,京尤言兑日月人尔有匕匕车交严重白勺斗又鸟目艮。

Last edited by fragel; June 14th, 2011 at 12:58 AM.
fragel no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 01:18 AM   #2373
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,978
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by fragel View Post
But the current D-train pricing isn't very good for long trips. it takes much longer time, and it isn't much cheaper than G-train. (410 vs. 555, D 2nd class is only RMB145RMB cheaper than G 2nd class from Beijing to Shanghai.) plus the first class on D-trains are much much more expensive than before. they could be popular on short routes still. When more CRH380 are available in the future, they might cut some of the D-trains and eventually speed up.
So:
old line D train
9:49
2nd class RMB 327
1st class RMB 409

new line D train
7:56
2nd class RMB 410
1st class RMB 650.

Will a lot of people stay on the old line D trains?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 01:34 AM   #2374
vincent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,380
Likes (Received): 7

Quote:
Originally Posted by fragel View Post
the air traffic between Wuhan-Guangzhou isn't as important as that between Beijing-Shanghai. Wuhan-Guangzhou airline has more disadvantages, there used to be much fewer daily flights, airports are far away, plus the travel distance is shorter. The Beijing-Shanghai line is the busiest and thus the most profitable line, it has the highest priority of taking-off, you can change flights between the three big companies, there are 40+ flights daily, and Hongqiao Airport and railway station are together. It won't be completely wiped out even if the trains are running at 380km/h. But if 50% of passengers decide to switch from airplanes to trains, that is unacceptable to airlines.

airline companies must be behind the back trying to slow the high speed trains, however, I think the main cause is that the party bosses want to make the train rides cheaper. I have no doubt that HSRs would be profitable without reducing operational speed, there are enough people who could afford the fastest high speed trains. But those who cannot afford or not willing to pay high fares have made significant influence. after all railways in China are public transportation unlike airlines. So the additional 250km/h trains are used to alleviate the public's concern, and to make the mixed running work most efficiently they chose the 300km/h+250km/h mode. when it is politically motivated, it is impossible to achieve the optimal economic scheme.

But the current D-train pricing isn't very good for long trips. it takes much longer time, and it isn't much cheaper than G-train. (410 vs. 555, D 2nd class is only RMB145RMB cheaper than G 2nd class from Beijing to Shanghai.) plus the first class on D-trains are much much more expensive than before. they could be popular on short routes still. When more CRH380 are available in the future, they might cut some of the D-trains and eventually speed up.
I don't think a 5% ticket price reduction change much to help the poor people buy high-speed rail tickets. It is causing other major lines like Wuhan-Guangzhou to run at 300km/h to save that tiny 5% price reduction after July 1st. I don't think it is worth it.




Here is another question that i have. From the news that i have posted above, I think these statements are in contradiction (quoted below). If they are keeping those 136 ordinary trains, that means the old rail lines capacity isn't being free up, how can they increase the cargo capacity?
unless those 136 trains are in a much shorter configuration? or somehow there is some train signal system improvement to reduce the train spacing?

"The 136 ordinary trains currently in use between the two metropolises will continue providing service after the bullet trains commence service, according to the ministry.


...Hu said the new line will significantly ease the transportation strain between the two cities and promote development and coordination between regional economies.

In the initial phase, the new rail will increase cargo transportation capacity by 140,000 tonnes per day and 50 million tonnes per year, he said."



• 胡亚东:
京沪高铁开通后,我们在既有京沪线仍然保留136对普速客车。京沪高铁开通初期,既有京沪线释放的运输能力每天可增运货物14万吨,年增加货运能力约5000万吨。

Last edited by vincent; June 14th, 2011 at 02:31 AM.
vincent no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 02:33 AM   #2375
fragel
Registered User
 
fragel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Fragel Town, Michigan
Posts: 1,452
Likes (Received): 55

when the minister said the trains would be more affordable, he did not mean the 300km/h or 350km/h trains. 5% price reduction for 300km/h is merely a gesture(in fact it is kinda price increase if you consider the 14% reduction in speed). What he really meant is that MoR would put more 250km/h trains in operation, then those who complain about the ticket prices for 300km/h trains can take the cheaper 250 km/h trains. You see it is not real price reduction, it is just service downgrading, but it could shut a lot of complainers up.

as for trains on the Beijing-Shanghai conventional line, there are currently more than 136 trains each way everyday. all D-trains will be moved to the HSR, and D-sleeper trains will be canceled, so there is some capacity freed up for cargo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
So:
old line D train
9:49
2nd class RMB 327
1st class RMB 409

new line D train
7:56
2nd class RMB 410
1st class RMB 650.

Will a lot of people stay on the old line D trains?
__________________
女口果人尔能句多王里解这句言舌,京尤言兑日月人尔有匕匕车交严重白勺斗又鸟目艮。

Last edited by fragel; June 14th, 2011 at 04:54 AM.
fragel no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 02:39 AM   #2376
vincent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,380
Likes (Received): 7

looks like this may answer my own question:

• 胡亚东:
二是全面实施混合运行的列车开行新模式。在新的运行图中全面实施了“三种混合运行”的列车开行新模式,即:在时速300公里的高速铁路上,同时开行时速300公里和时速200~250公里两种动车组列车;在时速200~250公里的线路上,同时开行时速200~250公里动车组列车和时速120~160公里普通客车;在时速200公里及以下线路上,开行普通客车和货物列车。这一模式充分体现了结构合理、速度匹配的原则,满足了旅客对不同速度等级、不同票价的选择,是铁路便民利民的重大举措。
vincent no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 08:21 AM   #2377
laojang
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 125
Likes (Received): 43

Quote:
Originally Posted by fragel View Post
I thought chornedsnorkack was asking about the exact schedule time. sorry
There are many versions on line but no official time table yet.
It is also reported that all overnight sleeper D trains between BJ and Sh will be canceled July 1st. One can guess that they will be refurbished for the 2000km+ BJ Guanzhou/Shenzhen HSL, which will be open by the end of the year?

Laojang
laojang no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 08:46 AM   #2378
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,978
Likes (Received): 388

So, as of now, the ticket prices, trip times and number of trains have been disclosed, but not actual departure times.

On which day is actual sale of tickets for trains of 28th June due to start?

Also, shall any trains travel Beijing-Shanghai high speed line and continue beyond, such as Beijing-Hangzhou?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 09:47 AM   #2379
laojang
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 125
Likes (Received): 43

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
So, as of now, the ticket prices, trip times and number of trains have been disclosed, but not actual departure times.

On which day is actual sale of tickets for trains of 28th June due to start?

Also, shall any trains travel Beijing-Shanghai high speed line and continue beyond, such as Beijing-Hangzhou?
MOR only says " open by the end of June". Assuming the usual practice,
tickets should be on sale next week (about 10 days in advance).
According to unofficial time table, there will be trains from BJ to Hangzhou.


Laojang
laojang no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 14th, 2011, 10:41 AM   #2380
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,978
Likes (Received): 388

Have the ticket prices and trip times on Wuhan-Guangzhou high speed railway 250 km/h and 300 km/h trains after 1st of July been disclosed yet?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
china, high speed rail

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 08:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium