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Old August 7th, 2011, 02:53 AM   #2981
hmmwv
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HunanChina View Post
Beijing South Railway Station is too small.

http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMjkxNTgzMDg0.html
That's crazy man, I've been to Beijing South when it's just opened and thought it will never be filled. A friend of mine just returned from a trip to Shanghai yesterday and also mentioned similar situation at Hongqiao Station where people can barely find empty seats. Just imagine 10 years down the road they may have to think about increase capacities in these already enormous stations.
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Old August 7th, 2011, 03:59 AM   #2982
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
That's crazy man, I've been to Beijing South when it's just opened and thought it will never be filled. A friend of mine just returned from a trip to Shanghai yesterday and also mentioned similar situation at Hongqiao Station where people can barely find empty seats. Just imagine 10 years down the road they may have to think about increase capacities in these already enormous stations.
And you still have foreign reporters trying to convince the public that China is over-investing in infrastructure that it doesn't need, and so creating an economic train-wreck about to happen... how these massive shiny train stations are empty at peak hours, etc... what a joke
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Old August 7th, 2011, 04:56 AM   #2983
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Human error discovered at root of Wenzhou train crash


Sheng Guanzu, chief of China's Ministry of Railways, admitted that the train collision in Wenzhou was not caused by natural disaster. (Photo/Xinhua)

China's national work-safety watchdog confirmed on Aug. 4 that the July 23 high-speed train crash in Wenzhou City, which claimed 40 lives, was in fact due to equipment failure and could not be deemed an 'act of god'. The final results of investigations into the accident will be announced a few days later.

After the train crash, at a meeting on Aug. 3, the Minister of Railways Sheng Guangzu ordered strict adherence to construction schedules and improved safety-checks for new railways.

In addition, according to the Beijing Times, China's State Administration of Work Safety (SAWS) also convened a meeting, Aug. 3, on work safety in the first half of this year.

Luo Lin, head of SAWS, said during the meeting that an accident investigation panel is looking thoroughly into the deadly train crash, and will decide who should be held accountable for it.

Subsequently, asked about the cause of the accident, Huang Yi, SAWS spokesman and chief engineer, said in an interview with the People's Daily Online, on Aug. 4, "we can now say with certainty that the accident was not caused by a natural disaster, but was indeed a huge rail-transport accident. What's more, the railways ministry has also indicated loopholes and problems in safety management that have been exposed due to the accident."

In response to rumors of a "red line," referring to an upper limit of 35 that would be acknowledged by the government as death toll in any disaster, with further fatalities classified as "missing," Huang said, "As far as I am aware, there is no so-called mysterious red line."

According to Huang, the severity of accidents is classified based on their death tolls.
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Old August 7th, 2011, 05:47 AM   #2984
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I think it's pretty obvious from the beginning that serious management issues is the root cause of this incident. The beauty of Root Cause Analysis is that you have to ask at least five whys, until there could be no other explanation. For example here the direct cause may be the lighting strike, but the root cause may be management's disregard of procedures. The system is only as good as the human who operate it, D trains have been running in eastern and southeastern China for four years and survived many thunderstorms, including a few Typhoons, so it's definitely designed for such environment. I suspect that there was a drive inside MOR to push local railway bureaus to keep their timetable amid recent high profile delays, which caused major embarrassment in the media. Yes there have been delays caused by severe weather in the past, but no accidents at all, I bet passengers rather have delayed trains than crashed ones.

It's good that State Administration of Work Safety is in charge of the investigation, taking over from MOR. SAWS is headed by a Communist Youth League faction guy who mainly worked in northern China, his deputy is a former airline pilot, so the conflict of interest and factions infighting may act as a crude check and balance in this investigation. I see dark days coming to the current MOR, but not necessarily for China railway in general.

Last edited by hmmwv; August 7th, 2011 at 06:00 AM.
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Old August 7th, 2011, 07:48 AM   #2985
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不管你相不相信,反正我是信了
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Old August 7th, 2011, 08:00 AM   #2986
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
That's crazy man, I've been to Beijing South when it's just opened and thought it will never be filled. A friend of mine just returned from a trip to Shanghai yesterday and also mentioned similar situation at Hongqiao Station where people can barely find empty seats. Just imagine 10 years down the road they may have to think about increase capacities in these already enormous stations.
What is the load percentage for all the scheduled trains?
They need to take more pictures of these busy stations, and then refute the false claims made by those foreign reporters.
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Old August 7th, 2011, 10:41 AM   #2987
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Originally Posted by urbanfan89 View Post
不管你相不相信,反正我是信了
It's a miracle
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Old August 7th, 2011, 10:42 AM   #2988
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
That's crazy man, I've been to Beijing South when it's just opened and thought it will never be filled. A friend of mine just returned from a trip to Shanghai yesterday and also mentioned similar situation at Hongqiao Station where people can barely find empty seats. Just imagine 10 years down the road they may have to think about increase capacities in these already enormous stations.
i think it's more likely that they will build more endpoints and shift the trains periodically
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Old August 7th, 2011, 10:07 PM   #2989
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 7freedom7 View Post
China's national work-safety watchdog confirmed on Aug. 4 that the July 23 high-speed train crash in Wenzhou City (...) The final results of investigations into the accident will be announced a few days later.
To me, this seems to be a bit quick. When a rail incident happens in the Netherlands (my home country), research takes over a year before final results are published. In China, this only takes a few weeks? Is the investigation thorough enough then?
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Old August 8th, 2011, 02:06 AM   #2990
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To me, this seems to be a bit quick. When a rail incident happens in the Netherlands (my home country), research takes over a year before final results are published. In China, this only takes a few weeks? Is the investigation thorough enough then?
Well do you actually expecting a independent investigation done like in Western countries? The final cause will be pretty easy to identify if it's indeed human error, but the issue is the political aspect. MOR and state council will have to release a result that will politically "harmonize" the society. I can almost bet that the final verdict will include all three causes, lighting strike, procedure violation by Wenzhou South dispatch, and CRSCD. That way everyone gets a slap on the wrist but no one will take the full blame.
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Old August 8th, 2011, 11:17 AM   #2991
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Originally Posted by gramercy View Post
i think it's more likely that they will build more endpoints and shift the trains periodically
The current Shanghai Station is quite some years old, and as D trains slowly replacing T and K trains the building is due for a major renovation to be optimized for HSR travel. If its capacity can be increased, Shanghai Station can absorb all trains on the Shanghai-Nanjing PDL (currently divided to Shanghai Station and Hongqiao). That way capacity at Hongqiao will be freed up, and the station will become a dedicated stop for the Shanghai-Beijing HSR. I don't think Shanghai South is anywhere near its capacity yet, it's exclusively for trains on the Southern route (i.e. Hangzhou direction). Another station, Shanghai East is in the planning phase, and when completed it will be dedicated for northern route trains (i.e. Nantong direction), and serving as the Disney terminal.

Right now if there is a need to relief congestion at Hongqiao the easiest and quickest way is to shift all Shanghai-Nanjing PDL traffic to Shanghai and Shanghai West.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 05:21 PM   #2992
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广深港高铁2011年8月底通车 GZ-SZ-HK High Speed Rail Opens End of 2011/08
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Old August 10th, 2011, 08:30 PM   #2993
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China's State Council orders safety checks on high-speed rails, slower running speeds
2011-08-10 19:21:44
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english201..._131041406.htm



BEIJING, Aug. 10 (Xinhua) -- The State Council, or the Cabinet, on Wednesday ordered safety checks on high-speed railways and slower running speeds.

The decision was made at an executive meeting of the State Council, which was presided over by Premier Wen Jiabao, in the wake of a deadly bullet train crash that killed 40 people.

The safety checks cover high-speed railways that are both in operation and under construction, said a statement released after the meeting.

The State Administration of Work Safety will lead the inspection on equipment quality, operation safety, and design and quality of rails under construction, the statement said.

The statement also ordered newly-built high-speed rails to run at slower speeds during the initial stages for safety and improvement in techniques and management.

The government will reevaluate the system safety on rail projects that have received government approval but have not commenced construction, the statement said, requiring a halt of approval of new railway projects.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 11:21 PM   #2994
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Can anyone tell me when was the line built where the recent crash happened?
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Old August 11th, 2011, 03:05 AM   #2995
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China train maker halts production
http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/10_17.html

Quote:
A major Chinese manufacturer of train cars used for a new high-speed service between Shanghai and Beijing has suspended production.

The 21st Century Business Herald, a Chinese financial newspaper, reported the news in its Tuesday's edition, citing a string of technological problems.

The paper said the Shanghai-Beijing service, which opened on June 30th, uses 2 different train cars: Type A based on Japanese technology and the German-based Type B.

The newspaper said 38 cases of problems in the cars have been reported in the first month after the start of the train service, 37 of them involving Type B.

Type B cars were made by 2 manufacturers, but most of the problems reportedly occurred on those made by Changchun Railway Vehicles.

The newspaper quoted a railway official as saying that the company has suspended production.

Chinese railway authorities had boasted that the high-speed train was developed solely by China, and that the nation achieved the world's highest level of technology.

However, the train service connecting the 2 cities has been plagued with problems. The collision of 2 trains in Zhejiang Province last month killed 40 people, undermining public trust in the safety of the service.
Don't know the validity of the story anyone else care to verify?
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Old August 11th, 2011, 08:00 AM   #2996
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
China's State Council orders safety checks on high-speed rails, slower running speeds
2011-08-10 19:21:44
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english201..._131041406.htm
BEIJING, Aug. 10 (Xinhua) -- The State Council, or the Cabinet, on Wednesday ordered safety checks on high-speed railways and slower running speeds.

The decision was made at an executive meeting of the State Council, which was presided over by Premier Wen Jiabao, in the wake of a deadly bullet train crash that killed 40 people.

The safety checks cover high-speed railways that are both in operation and under construction, said a statement released after the meeting.

The State Administration of Work Safety will lead the inspection on equipment quality, operation safety, and design and quality of rails under construction, the statement said.

The statement also ordered newly-built high-speed rails to run at slower speeds during the initial stages for safety and improvement in techniques and management.
What shall be the speed of Guangzhou-Longhua high speed railway eventually, and what shall be the speed on opening this month?
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Old August 11th, 2011, 08:28 AM   #2997
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Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
What shall be the speed of Guangzhou-Longhua high speed railway eventually, and what shall be the speed on opening this month?
Current 350kph route will decrease to 300kph so Wuhan Guangzou Shenzhen will run 300kph. Other 250kph routes will now run 200kph. 200kph routes will now run 160kph.
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Old August 11th, 2011, 12:40 PM   #2998
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Wenzhou crash: China freezes new rail projects
11 August 2011 Last updated at 07:05 GMT

The BBC's Martin Patience says there was "huge public anger" after a recent crash that killed 40 people

Chinese officials have ordered a temporary halt on new high-speed rail projects, as the fallout continues from last month's fatal crash near Wenzhou.

The State Council said the safety of new projects would be re-evaluated before approval could be given.

Safety checks would also be carried out on existing lines, and speed limits would be put in place.

The government's handling of the Wenzhou crash, which killed 40 people, caused widespread anger.

An official diktat ordering journalists in state-run media groups not to investigate the causes of the crash was leaked on the internet, leading to allegations of a cover-up.

And a government order was leaked advising local lawyers that they needed authorisation to take on compensation cases of victims.

The high-speed rail network is one of the country's flagship projects.

But critics have accused the government of ignoring safety warnings in its rush to complete the construction.

The State Council announced its review of safety after a meeting chaired by Premier Wen Jiabao on Wednesday.

"We will suspend for the time being the examination and approval of new railway construction projects," the council said in a statement.

But the council added: "China will unswervingly continue its development of high-speed railways."

On Thursday the country's biggest rail construction firm, China Railway Group, announced it had dropped a plan to raise about 6.2bn yuan ($970m; £600m) through a share placement.

"Given changes in the country's macro policy, there have been uncertainties in regulatory approvals," the firm said in a statement.

The Railways Ministry is still investigating the cause of the crash, but regional rail officials have said a signalling failure was responsible.
Source: BBC
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Old August 11th, 2011, 01:22 PM   #2999
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Originally Posted by sasalove View Post
Current 350kph route will decrease to 300kph so Wuhan Guangzou Shenzhen will run 300kph.
Wuhan-Guangzhou was 350 km/h, but already was slowed to 300 km/h as of 1st of July.

Shall it be slowed further, or continue at 300 km/h?
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Old August 11th, 2011, 02:44 PM   #3000
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Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Wuhan-Guangzhou was 350 km/h, but already was slowed to 300 km/h as of 1st of July.

Shall it be slowed further, or continue at 300 km/h?
According to be news 300kph is maintained
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