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Old March 7th, 2012, 06:32 PM   #3621
joseph1951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
That is, lines which start construction.
Which is the list of these 9?

How many high speed railways shall, under the 12th Five Year Plan, start construction within 2013? Over 2014...2015?

In other words, China shall complete 5000 km high speed railways within 2013...2015, and 35000 km low speed railways in these 3 years.


May? Or may not. What shall the considerations be besides number of trains?

I cannot see some existing high speed railways on the 4+4 map. Like Hainan East Ring.
Shall any other railways besides 4+4 be opened before 2020?
Which is the last of 4+4 to open?
These comparisons are useless and meanigess if they are not taken in relation to the Country surface and/or population.

Frr example: China has a surface of about 9.640 821 sqkm, Spain has a surface of about 504.000 sqkm.
China has about 1,3 billion people and Spain has only 46 million..
Therefoe whern comparing population with kms o HSLs Spain has a bout 28 times HSLs/per person.
Therefore to be at par with Spain, China should have at least 170,000/180,000 kms of HSLs.....
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Old March 7th, 2012, 06:46 PM   #3622
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joseph1951 View Post
These comparisons are useless and meanigess if they are not taken in relation to the Country surface and/or population.

Frr example: China has a surface of about 9.640 821 sqkm, Spain has a surface of about 504.000 sqkm.
China has about 1,3 billion people and Spain has only 46 million..
Therefoe whern comparing population with kms o HSLs Spain has a bout 28 times HSLs/per person.
Therefore to be at par with Spain, China should have at least 170,000/180,000 kms of HSLs.....
You are kind of right but also kind of wrong. It is not that dry cut. Your are over simplifying it. Same length of high speed rail may exist but capacity and usage can be quite different. Also, absolute values are significant in many cases, too. China has the longest high speed railroad. It's high speed rail roads are carrying more people than anywhere but Japan. Soon this will change, too. However, as you wrote, when you divide the number to people who live, per person number will look small and realistically it will probably never reach those per person numbers in Spain. This is why high speed rail in China is more efficient, cheaper and required. That huge population density makes high speed rail a must. For me, this is why China cannot over-invest on high speed rail. there is simply no other way to transport that many people.

Surface area comparison is completely meaningless because of huge discrepancies in population density. Half of China is wilderness with almost no people.
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Old March 7th, 2012, 10:13 PM   #3623
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joseph1951 View Post
Frr example: China has a surface of about 9.640 821 sqkm, Spain has a surface of about 504.000 sqkm.
China has about 1,3 billion people and Spain has only 46 million..
Therefoe whern comparing population with kms o HSLs Spain has a bout 28 times HSLs/per person.
Therefore to be at par with Spain, China should have at least 170,000/180,000 kms of HSLs.....
China has 10 provinces and 1 autonomous region each with population over 46 millions, but none of these has more than 485 000 sq km (Sichuan). 3 autonomous regions and 1 province have combined area of 4 793 000 sq km, about half of China, but none of these have population over 24,7 millions (Inner Mongolia), and the four together have population of about 55 millions.
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Old March 8th, 2012, 12:00 PM   #3624
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Out of that list, I think Xuzhou-Lanzhou is probably the last one built, if it indeed gets finished before 2020.
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Old March 8th, 2012, 02:09 PM   #3625
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Out of that list, I think Xuzhou-Lanzhou is probably the last one built, if it indeed gets finished before 2020.
Which is the last part of Xuzhou-Lanzhou to get finished - Xuzhou-Zhengzhou, or Baoji-Lanzhou?
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Old March 8th, 2012, 05:36 PM   #3626
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Train maker enmeshed in luxury fitting controversy

BEIJING, March 8 (Xinhua) -- China's major bullet train maker remains mired in controversy despite refuting a damaging media report.

The China South Locomotive & Rolling Stock Corporation (CSR), the country's largest train manufacturer, on Tuesday refuted a media report claiming that it had spent lavishly on luxury fixtures. The report accuses the company of purchasing internal fixtures such as toilet fittings at prices far exceeding market averages from companies with "high-level connections" to the Ministry of Railways.

The statement, which runs to less than 200 words and came upon Railway Minister Sheng Guangzu's request, did not give any details apart from the denial, and was followed by the media's counter-statement.

Century Weekly, the magazine which ran a cover story about the CSR's alleged extravagant procurement, said the article was based on purchase documents it had obtained, and it would release those papers if necessary.

Last month, the magazine reported that the CSR had been paying up to 10 times more than market rates for toilet and other fittings supplied by new and unknown companies with government connections.

The report gave out a string of overpriced items including sink tops, water valves and chairs in the first class carriage.

For instance, sink tops were typically priced at 3,000 yuan (474.9 U.S.dollars) per linear meter in Beijing's retail market, but the CSR bought a two-linear-meter one for 26,096 yuan, more than four times the market price, the magazine reported.

Much attention has been paid to bullet trains and their makers after a deadly rail accident last summer.

On July 23, a high-speed train rammed into a stalled train near the city of Wenzhou in the eastern province of Zhejiang, leaving 40 dead and 172 injured.
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Old March 9th, 2012, 11:22 AM   #3627
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Which is the last part of Xuzhou-Lanzhou to get finished - Xuzhou-Zhengzhou, or Baoji-Lanzhou?
I'd assume Baoji-Lanzhou, since there will be enough demand between Xuzhou and Zhengzhou.
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Old March 9th, 2012, 06:02 PM   #3628
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Official denies mass suspension of China's high-speed railway construction

BEIJING, March 9 (Xinhua) -- The construction of China's high-speed railway was not suspended en masse and the country's achievements in train transportation should not be overlooked despite some high-profile mistakes, a senior railway official said Friday.

Development of key rail projects will be guaranteed and continued, said Wu Qiang, director of the transportation unit of the Ministry of Railways.

"Investment in railways will total 500 billion yuan (79.37 billion U.S. dollars) this year, and the money used for railways under construction is assured," Wu, a deputy to the National People's Congress, the country's top legislature, said while participating in this year's parliamentary session.

Wu said China's high-speed railway has a promising outlook.

In 2011, a total of 440 million passengers were transported through the country's 18 high-speed lines, almost double the figure in 2010, according to the official.

The average occupancy rate of high-speed trains was 60 percent, rising to 80 percent during the peak time of holidays, claimed Wu.

"Generally speaking, high-speed railways are worth developing as a more environmentally-friendly and more efficient industry," he said.

"However, we need to continuously adjust and improve their development to make them more scientific and sustainable, because China's high-speed network is growing very fast."

The country's construction of high-speed lines suffered a major setback last year when two bullet trains collided in east China's Zhejiang province, leaving 40 passengers dead and 172 others injured.

Sporadic breakdowns following the incident compounded widespread worries over the safety of the network.

Wu said China's high-speed rail technology is maturing after six speed hikes, during which a lot of expertise was accumulated in regard to lines, traction and power supply.

"The overall development of China's high-speed railways should not be denied because of some mistakes," Wu said.

NEW ONLINE TICKET SYSTEM

Wu also said the ministry is developing a new online ticketing system, which is expected to be operational by the Spring Festival in February next year.

During this year's Spring Festival holiday, the online ticket system frequently crashed or was inaccessible as it failed to cope with demand, but Wu said its replacement is more efficient, reliable and user-friendly.

Notably, it will allow more payment methods.

Wu said the new ticket system is under development and the Ministry of Railways will solicit opinions on it from the public via the Internet.

Train tickets sold online and via telephone account for about one fifth of total sales, according to Wu.
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Old March 9th, 2012, 06:53 PM   #3629
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
I'd assume Baoji-Lanzhou, since there will be enough demand between Xuzhou and Zhengzhou.
Interesting choice.

Xuzhou is already between Beijing and Shanghai, well connected to both. Only Xuzhou-Guangzhou is currently indirect and slow via Nanjing-Wuhan.

Zhengzhou is now connected to Xian. If Zhengzhou-Wuhan were to open, Zhengzhou and Xian would have a direct connection to Guangzhou. If Zhengzhou-Shijiazhuang-Beijing were to open, Zhengzhou would have a direct connection to Beijing. Only Zhengzhou-Shanghai would be indirect and slow via Wuhan-Nanjing.

Whereas, unless Lanzhou-Baoji were built, Lanzhou would have no connection at all.
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Old March 10th, 2012, 02:53 PM   #3630
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Okay, been doing some research and apparently I'm slightly off base here.

Lanzhou-Urumqi HSR:
Also called Lanzhou-Xinjiang Second Double Line, will finish on April 2013. Design speed 300km/h with potential to upgrade to 350km/h, initial operating speed set at 250km/h.

Xuzhou-Lanzhou PDL:
1. Baoji-Lanzhou section, scheduled to break ground in July 2012, finish in 2017. Design speed reduced to 250km/h with potential to upgrade to 350km/h.
2. Xi'an-Baoji section, construction started on Feb 28, 2012, scheduled to finish in late 2013 and trial runs start early 2014. Design speed 350km/h.
3. Zhengzhou-Xi'an section, operating since 2010, design speed 350km/h.
4. Zhengzhou-Xuzhou section will start construction in second half of 2012, complete in 2015, design speed 250km/h with 350km/h upgrade option.
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Old March 10th, 2012, 02:57 PM   #3631
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Whereas, unless Lanzhou-Baoji were built, Lanzhou would have no connection at all.
Well they electrified Longhai Railway in 2006 so it's still fairly quick to get from Lanzhou to Xuzhou right now (passenger trains can go up to 140km/h).
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Old March 12th, 2012, 10:37 AM   #3632
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High speed rail section collapses

Fortunately, the line is not yet open for revenue service:

Quote:
China High-Speed Rail Section Collapses After Rains, Renewing Safety Fears
A section of an unopened high-speed railway collapsed in central China’s Hubei province following heavy rains, renewing safety concerns prompted by a fatal crash last year.

Hundreds of workers have been sent to make repairs to the 300-meter (984-foot) roadbed after the March 9 failure in Qianjiang city, the official Xinhua News Agency said today, citing local authorities. The stretch, which had undergone test runs, is part of a line due to open in May.

China Railway Construction Corp. (1186), which built the section, according to Xinhua, and China Railway Group Ltd. (390) both plunged the most this year in Hong Kong on speculation the incident may deter the government from pushing ahead with a 2.8 trillion yuan ($443 billion) building plan. Construction was slowed last year after 40 people were killed in a high-speed crash in July.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...nhua-says.html
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Old March 12th, 2012, 01:01 PM   #3633
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Originally Posted by Captain Obvious
^That's not good at all.
While I support China's attempt to build big, this kind of stuff is unacceptable. Indeed, thank goodness the line wasn't open yet. I wonder why this wasn't addressed immediately after the whistleblower... after they pledged to fix problems after Wenzhou, the fact that this has been allowed to happen again is unthinkable. First time's a gamble, second time's a charm.
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Old March 12th, 2012, 05:48 PM   #3634
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Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
Well they electrified Longhai Railway in 2006 so it's still fairly quick to get from Lanzhou to Xuzhou right now (passenger trains can go up to 140km/h).
Baoji to Lanzhou is relatively new, but Lanzhou to Baoji is too slow, it must be upgraded.
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Old March 12th, 2012, 06:49 PM   #3635
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Hong Kong news reports note the incident was first raised in online discussion forums inside China, and then the media picked it up and went to the site for a look.
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Old March 12th, 2012, 10:01 PM   #3636
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Has Wuhan-Xianning Metropolis Intercity Railway also collapsed, or is that one still on schedule to open this May?

If Hankou-Yichang high speed railway had been built on Moon, it might not have been damaged by heavy rain.
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Old March 13th, 2012, 06:46 AM   #3637
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Zhengzhou new east station to be ready in June



Main structure of Zhengzhou new east railway station is completed. The largest railway station of China, when completed, is scheduled to open in June.

Zhengzhou new east station is located at the crossing point of Beijing-guangzhou (north-south) and Xuzhou-Lanzhou (east-west) HSR, in Zhengzhou, Henan province.

Size: 392,000 sqms, 30 platforms
Cost: 7.2 bln yuan, 30 months
It has taxi and bus stations built in and will be connecting subway line 1 and line 5.









source
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Old March 14th, 2012, 03:14 AM   #3638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Has Wuhan-Xianning Metropolis Intercity Railway also collapsed, or is that one still on schedule to open this May?

If Hankou-Yichang high speed railway had been built on Moon, it might not have been damaged by heavy rain.
Wuhan Intercity line is not related to Hanyi Railway.
Although you are right it should be immune to heavy rain, I'd argue the moon section of Hanyi line will be prone to meteor shower and extreme temperature variation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Swordsman View Post
While I support China's attempt to build big, this kind of stuff is unacceptable. Indeed, thank goodness the line wasn't open yet. I wonder why this wasn't addressed immediately after the whistleblower... after they pledged to fix problems after Wenzhou, the fact that this has been allowed to happen again is unthinkable. First time's a gamble, second time's a charm.
Absolutely agree, sloppy construction oversight is pretty common in China but there is no excuse for that to happen in key projects such as the Hanyi Railway.

BTW the earlier reports have certain degree of exaggeration, apparently there was no "collapse" because the section is not elevated, rather it's foundation sinking over tolerance. The sink tolerance is 3mm and during their inspection in February they discovered that the actual sinking rate is between 3 and 4mm. Therefore they have ordered rework for that stretch of railway, all laid tracks have been removed. Inspector indicated it's a random inspection which found the problem, but insisted the problem will be discovered even after commercial service has started because test train will run regularly to take measurement.
http://news.sina.com.cn/c/2012-03-12/233724102632.shtml
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Old March 14th, 2012, 06:40 AM   #3639
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I imagined a section of rail roadbed collapsing a few feet as if someone kicked down a sand castle.
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Old March 14th, 2012, 06:46 AM   #3640
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China ups bullet train brake test record


Quote:
Updated: 2012-03-11 19:43

(Xinhua)

BEIJING - China has completed the construction of a powerful test bench for a train braking system, setting a world record by allowing a maximum test speed of up to 530 kilometers per hour, a railway researcher said Sunday.

Li Heping, a political adviser and researcher with the China Academy of Railway Sciences (CARS), said that as a key technology for high-speed trains, the test bench has been put into operation at a state key laboratory for the high-speed railway system at CARS.

The test bench can simulate the high-speed train braking process in different conditions like dry or humid environments, as well as airstream, low temperature and snowfall, Li told Xinhua on the sidelines of China's annual legislative session.

The CARS-developed high-speed train brake disc and brake lining have both passed tests at the new bench under maximum-speed conditions, said Li.
source
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