daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old September 18th, 2012, 04:58 AM   #4421
foxmulder
Registered User
 
foxmulder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,135
Likes (Received): 381

Quote:
Originally Posted by saiho View Post
Maybe it includes the office space built on top. Last time I checked there was plans for that. That's something China should pick up all that space at the tops of those massive railway stations is a huge waste.
That makes sense, thanks. Although, I am not aware of any plans for a building on top of the station, that area cannot be "only" the train station itself.
foxmulder no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old September 18th, 2012, 05:02 AM   #4422
phoenixboi08
Registered User
 
phoenixboi08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,550
Likes (Received): 798

Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
Well hotels in airports make sense because the majority of the guests are there to catch the flight early in the next morning to avoid traffic delays. Railway stations are set up in a way that such need is minimum, because you don't have to arrive super early, and if you miss the train due to traffic there is always another one 15 minutes later.
True. I was just thinking in cases where you can't get a train for whatever reason (not the seat you'd like, or no seats at all). But I guess that's pretty much relegated to specific periods of the year.
phoenixboi08 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2012, 05:13 AM   #4423
James474
BANNED
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 7
Likes (Received): 0

Sounds good to me!
James474 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2012, 05:50 AM   #4424
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,926
Likes (Received): 18188

Quote:
Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
one must remember the regional connections a HSR customer would need apon arrival at his destination. any city with a stop on a HSR line must have strong transit connections to the stop, or else the travellers would have no way to get to their final destination. and the US fails miserably on the local transit service. (generally)
Yes, while China's new HSR train stations are far from the city centre, they're connected by subway. Here are a few far ones off the top of my head with subway connections :

Shanghai Hongqiao - on 2 subway lines
Xian North
Beijing South
Guangzhou South
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2012, 06:00 AM   #4425
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,926
Likes (Received): 18188

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
In other words, about 4:50 for 978 km Wuhan-Xian?

2160 km on low speed railway. On high speed railway... 2050 km?

Since it is 9 hours, shall any high speed sleeper trains operate on the line?


Is Shenzhen East Railway Station then not on Shenzhen North-Xiamen high speed railway in Pingshan new area?
The Shenzhen - Wuhan line will align with the current Guangzhou service. Guangzhou - Wuhan is currently 4 hours or so on the G trains. Guangzhou - Shenzhen is slated to be under 1 hour. Wuhan to Xian is over 700 km or but I believe the rail trip may be longer if it has to route through Zhengzhou.

Wuhan - Zhengzhou : 500 km
Zhengzhou - Xian : 470 km

I don't see the schedules on CTrip yet. Once they're out, I can compute the actual distance and alignment, as the Shenzhen - Guangzhou stretch is on a new set of tracks that just opened this year.

I'm not aware of sleeper G trains yet. Perhaps the Chinese forumers can help on this one?
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2012, 08:30 PM   #4426
hmmwv
Registered User
 
hmmwv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,391
Likes (Received): 420

Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
Yes, while China's new HSR train stations are far from the city centre, they're connected by subway. Here are a few far ones off the top of my head with subway connections :

Shanghai Hongqiao - on 2 subway lines
Xian North
Beijing South
Guangzhou South
And Nanjing South, currently connected by 1 line and another line is under construction.
__________________
The building under construction next to Shanghai Tower is Oriental Financial Center. The "plot" next to Jinmao is reserved green belt and no skyscraper will be built there.
hmmwv no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 01:37 AM   #4427
bearb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 810
Likes (Received): 617

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
In other words, about 4:50 for 978 km Wuhan-Xian?

Is Shenzhen East Railway Station then not on Shenzhen North-Xiamen high speed railway in Pingshan new area?
unfortunately not

someone decided to name the old Buji station as Shenzhen East

in my opinion, simply add 'Shenzhen' in the front then 'Shenzhen Buji station' will work clearly and easily for the people who want to travel to Shenzhen
but some stupid decided to change the whole city around

then the old 'Shenzhen East station' will be named something different

probably the metro station next to it will not be called Buji Station anymore
bearb no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 04:07 PM   #4428
phoenixboi08
Registered User
 
phoenixboi08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,550
Likes (Received): 798

What's a good site I can use to look up schedules/fares?
Most of the ones I've found (and have been using) are either grossly out of date, or in Chinese.

For example, I tried looking up the fare for Yancheng - Shanghai, and it showed me a route to Nanjing. So, I looked up Yanchengn - Nantong then Nantong - Shanghai and it had a 高铁 listed >.<

These sites are all piece meal. If only I knew how to code, I would make a mobile app.
phoenixboi08 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 06:22 PM   #4429
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,926
Likes (Received): 18188

Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixboi08 View Post
What's a good site I can use to look up schedules/fares?
Most of the ones I've found (and have been using) are either grossly out of date, or in Chinese.

For example, I tried looking up the fare for Yancheng - Shanghai, and it showed me a route to Nanjing. So, I looked up Yanchengn - Nantong then Nantong - Shanghai and it had a 高铁 listed >.<

These sites are all piece meal. If only I knew how to code, I would make a mobile app.
Do you read Chinese? CTrip has both schedules and prices. Don't think there's an English booking engine.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 08:37 PM   #4430
China Hand
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 705
Likes (Received): 161

Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixboi08 View Post
What's a good site I can use to look up schedules/fares?
Most of the ones I've found (and have been using) are either grossly out of date, or in Chinese.

For example, I tried looking up the fare for Yancheng - Shanghai, and it showed me a route to Nanjing. So, I looked up Yanchengn - Nantong then Nantong - Shanghai and it had a 高铁 listed >.<

These sites are all piece meal. If only I knew how to code, I would make a mobile app.
There are several I use for fares and when a friend checks the ones in Chinese, they comport and are accurate.

http://www.chinatrainguide.com/

www.travelchinaguide.com/china-trains/

www.chinatraintickets.net/

www.chinahighlights.com/china-trains
China Hand no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 08:45 PM   #4431
China Hand
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 705
Likes (Received): 161

Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixboi08 View Post
True. I was just thinking in cases where you can't get a train for whatever reason (not the seat you'd like, or no seats at all). But I guess that's pretty much relegated to specific periods of the year.
This is already the case in China for NNNN and KNNN trains as the stations are usually adjacent to a bus terminal and surrounded by hotels of all price points.

The newer CRH stations are very large, in new town areas, and sometimes, but usually not, have hotels nearby. If the next train is booked, the following won't be.

Normally they are out of the way, a taxi ride of many kms to any business or hotel district.

This is one of the few flaws in the China CRH system - you must make certain that you arrive at your destination early evening so that you can take a bus or subway or CRH to your final destination (or have a friend with auto pick you up). Arriving at Guangzhou South at 11:30pm and having few choices for ongoing transport is not enjoyable.

Taking any late day trains will get you to a nice, shiny, new, enormous HSR terminal in the middle of nowhere late at night with no way to continue on.
China Hand no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 10:28 PM   #4432
BarbaricManchurian
来了就是深圳人
 
BarbaricManchurian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Worcester
Posts: 5,505
Likes (Received): 6894

Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
And Nanjing South, currently connected by 1 line and another line is under construction.
Tianjin Station and Tianjin West Station are both serviced by subway. And they are building an extension to Tianjin South Station right now.
BarbaricManchurian no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 10:56 PM   #4433
FM 2258
Registered User
 
FM 2258's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Austin
Posts: 5,438
Likes (Received): 612

Quote:
Originally Posted by China Hand View Post
This is already the case in China for NNNN and KNNN trains as the stations are usually adjacent to a bus terminal and surrounded by hotels of all price points.

The newer CRH stations are very large, in new town areas, and sometimes, but usually not, have hotels nearby. If the next train is booked, the following won't be.

Normally they are out of the way, a taxi ride of many kms to any business or hotel district.

This is one of the few flaws in the China CRH system - you must make certain that you arrive at your destination early evening so that you can take a bus or subway or CRH to your final destination (or have a friend with auto pick you up). Arriving at Guangzhou South at 11:30pm and having few choices for ongoing transport is not enjoyable.

Taking any late day trains will get you to a nice, shiny, new, enormous HSR terminal in the middle of nowhere late at night with no way to continue on.
Again, why are CRH train stations located in the middle of nowhere, far from the city center? I know this has been asked several times in the thread already, don't remember the answer.
FM 2258 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2012, 11:16 PM   #4434
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,975
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by FM 2258 View Post
Again, why are CRH train stations located in the middle of nowhere, far from the city center? I know this has been asked several times in the thread already, don't remember the answer.
The reason is that relatively available land for huge stations and low curvature rail lines is found in suburbs. Even China is hesitant about demolishing huge chunks of central cities.
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2012, 12:42 AM   #4435
saiho
Registered User
 
saiho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 多伦多/多倫多
Posts: 1,360
Likes (Received): 1292

also the fact that they can develop another CBD around it
saiho está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2012, 01:20 AM   #4436
hmmwv
Registered User
 
hmmwv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,391
Likes (Received): 420

Fortunately for popular intercity HSR services such as Nanjing-Shanghai there are still plenty of CRH trains arrive at the city center stations. It's so nice to be able to take a ten minute subway ride to Nanjing Station and get to downtown Shanghai in a little bit over an hour. Hongqiao to Nanjing South, not so much.
__________________
The building under construction next to Shanghai Tower is Oriental Financial Center. The "plot" next to Jinmao is reserved green belt and no skyscraper will be built there.
hmmwv no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2012, 02:36 AM   #4437
FM 2258
Registered User
 
FM 2258's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Austin
Posts: 5,438
Likes (Received): 612

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
The reason is that relatively available land for huge stations and low curvature rail lines is found in suburbs. Even China is hesitant about demolishing huge chunks of central cities.
Hence they could get the network built faster.....and...

Quote:
Originally Posted by saiho View Post
also the fact that they can develop another CBD around it
.........fill in the area around the station.



Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
Fortunately for popular intercity HSR services such as Nanjing-Shanghai there are still plenty of CRH trains arrive at the city center stations. It's so nice to be able to take a ten minute subway ride to Nanjing Station and get to downtown Shanghai in a little bit over an hour. Hongqiao to Nanjing South, not so much.
Still it would be nice to have express branches into the city from the remote railway station. Get a few branch lines with CRH6 trains from the main station to points in the city.
FM 2258 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2012, 09:31 AM   #4438
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,975
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by FM 2258 View Post
Still it would be nice to have express branches into the city from the remote railway station. Get a few branch lines with CRH6 trains from the main station to points in the city.
True. Hongqiao-Nanjing, nearly 300 km is available direct, under 80 minutes, Hongqiao-Pudong, 62 km along line 2 of Shanghai Metro, requires a connection (sic!) and takes 100 minutes.

A city that does have its centre dug up to build a HSR station is Shenzhen.

In which year are Futian Station and Longhua-Futian High Speed Railway currently due to open?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2012, 03:27 PM   #4439
BarbaricManchurian
来了就是深圳人
 
BarbaricManchurian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Worcester
Posts: 5,505
Likes (Received): 6894

Well this is what I know about locations of Tianjin CRH stations:

Tianjin station: existing, fully renovated for CRH, in city center

Tianjin West station: brand new, somewhat close to city center, tons of low quality housing demolished around to build new CBD and station buildings/infrastructure

Tianjin South station: brand new, suburban, plans to build subway extension and small CBD around

And Yujiapu and Binhai stations that are not finished yet.

Tianjin West station rebuilding seriously transformed a massive chunk of central Tianjin, so CRH stations aren't always or even usually suburban. But sometimes they use the CRH station to help build a new downtown and in China there is the demand no doubt.
BarbaricManchurian no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2012, 04:24 PM   #4440
Qtya
sensational
 
Qtya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Budapest - Brussels
Posts: 15,237
Likes (Received): 9407

Sorry guys, but I sadly don't follow this thread that much... Could someone please update me on the state of the Shanghai - Hong Kong HSR line?
__________________
„A nemzet csak akkor remélhet egy jobb jövőben, ha polgárai képesek közös erőfeszítéssel felelősséget vállalni a közjóért.”

II. János Pál pápa
Qtya no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
china, high speed rail

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:49 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium