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Old March 7th, 2013, 03:29 PM   #5541
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Right, but how about average incomes in Hong Kong versus Shanghai or Beijing (including migrant workers)? Never been to Hong Kong, but my understanding was that the percentage of middle class is significantly higher there.
PPP GDP Per Capita Per Year
HK 50 to 55k USD
Shanghai ~30k USD
Beijing ~20k USD

Shanghai is trying to be HK v2.0, Shenzhen-Guangzhou and most of Guangdong are close behind, and various other large cities and provincial capitals are ~10 to ~15k USD.
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Old March 7th, 2013, 03:51 PM   #5542
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Quote:
Originally Posted by China Hand View Post
PPP GDP Per Capita Per Year
HK 50 to 55k USD
Shanghai ~30k USD
Beijing ~20k USD

Shanghai is trying to be HK v2.0, Shenzhen-Guangzhou and most of Guangdong are close behind, and various other large cities and provincial capitals are ~10 to ~15k USD.
Nominal data have a bit different values, and a bit different order:

Hong Kong - 37 352 in 2011

Shenzhen - 19 806
Guangzhou - 16 840
Foshan - 14 773
but
Dongguan - 9655
Guangdong average - 8580

Wuxi - 18 814
Suzhou - 18 181
Hangzhou - 14 209
Nanjing - 14 074
Ningbo - 13 590
and only then
Shanghai - 13 306

Tianjin - 14 445
Beijing - 13 628
Tangshan - 12 021

Other large cities and provincial capitals:
Dalian - 15 863
Changsha - 14 393
Qingdao - 13 273
Shenyang - 13 094
Wuhan - 12 957
Jinan - 11 189
Zhengzhou - 10 186
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Old March 7th, 2013, 06:10 PM   #5543
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Quote:
Originally Posted by big-dog View Post
This is part of the Nanchang-Ji'an-Ganzhou-Shenzhen HSR line. Per initial plan Nanchang-Ganzhou HSR is 398km, the first survey adjusted it to 421km, it doesn't follow the existing rail and passes Wan'an on its route. However this is only the first survey so the route/length is subject to change.



This line is designed to ease the traffic of Beijing-Kowloon(Hong Kong) railway so it should be part of Beijing-Kowloon rail.
Interesting...looking at a map do we expect this line to go north to Hefei-Xuzhou-Jinan to Beijing? It's interesting to see 350km/h lines that aren't part of the High Speed 4+4 plan.
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Old March 7th, 2013, 08:36 PM   #5544
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Quote:
Originally Posted by China Hand View Post
PPP GDP Per Capita Per Year
HK 50 to 55k USD
Shanghai ~30k USD
Beijing ~20k USD
Does that include migrant workers or only those with an official residence permit in Beijing/Shanghai? I suspect there would be a big difference between both modes of accounting.

But of course this is a bit off-topic...
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Old March 7th, 2013, 09:13 PM   #5545
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Some distances to get the reference framework

Changsha-Guangzhou, on old railway - 707 km
Changsha-Shenzhen, on old railway - 854 km
Wuchang-Guangzhou, on old railway - 1069 km
Wuchang-Shenzhen, on old railway - 1216 km

Nanchang-Changsha, on old railway - 419 km
Nanchang-Hangzhou, on old railway - 629 km
Nanchang-Shanghai, on old railway - 813 km
Changsha-Hangzhou, on old railway - 989 km (passing Nanchang)
Changsha-Shanghai, on old railway - 1173 km

Ningbo East-Xiamen, on new railway - 821 km

Nanchang-Shenzhen, on old railway - 923 km
Nanchang-Guangzhou, on old railway - 956 km
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Old March 8th, 2013, 11:08 AM   #5546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Does that include migrant workers or only those with an official residence permit in Beijing/Shanghai? I suspect there would be a big difference between both modes of accounting.

But of course this is a bit off-topic...
Various anecdotal observations strongly support that China is moving into the lower developed area of 10k to 13k PPP GDP USD at this moment, this year. Kids buying lots of sodas, more trash, more trash workers picking it up, buying clothes based upon style preferences, the enormous increase in autos on the roads, smartphones, laptops; hi-rise, skyscraper and Super/Mega-tall buildings everywhere, the increasing height of young boys and young men, and most importantly the nonplussed nature of the response when I mention this.

Apathetic Teens? You are developed!
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Old March 8th, 2013, 11:34 AM   #5547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dodge321 View Post
Ah I see, thanks. That's quite a bit behind earlier schedules as the line was said to begin trial runs by the end of 2012.

Btw, it seems from this article that the design speed of the Baoji-Lanzhou section of the Xuzhou-Lanzhou HSR line will be 250kph (instead of 350kph). What's the latest plan for the Baoji-Lanzhou section? Any idea?

http://www.ha.xinhuanet.com/hnxw/201..._113471102.htm
Correct, the Baoji-Lanzhou PDL has been adjusted to 250km/h with a minimum curve radius of 4500m. The interesting bit is that this line is 68% tunnel and 25% bridge/viaduct, so it's essentially a huge subway. This is necessary to negotiate the complicated terrain of the Loess Plateau. The line is fair straight except a turn near Tianshui, so if they want I don't see why can't they increase the operating speed to 300km/h, which will match nicely with Lanzhou-Urumqi's 300km/h design speed.
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Old March 8th, 2013, 11:56 AM   #5548
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Quote:
Originally Posted by China Hand View Post
PPP GDP Per Capita Per Year
HK 50 to 55k USD
Shanghai ~30k USD
Beijing ~20k USD

Shanghai is trying to be HK v2.0, Shenzhen-Guangzhou and most of Guangdong are close behind, and various other large cities and provincial capitals are ~10 to ~15k USD.
Those numbers are not correct. Shanghai and Beijing are on about the same level of GDP per capita. Almost all the big cities on the east coast are on a similar level of GDP per capita. Even some inland cities are on a similar level.

PPP GDP per capita for Shanghai and Beijing are about 21K and 20 USD respectively and for Guangzhou and Shenzhen about 23K and 25K USD respectively.

Here is a GDP per capita list for 2012.

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Old March 8th, 2013, 02:51 PM   #5549
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VECTROTALENZIS View Post

PPP GDP per capita for Shanghai and Beijing are about 21K and 20 USD respectively and for Guangzhou and Shenzhen about 23K and 25K USD respectively.

Here is a GDP per capita list for 2012.
I think you were looking at the wrong column...or I'm mis-reading it?

From what I see, per capita gdp is 16,000 for Guangzhou, almost 20,000 for Shenzhen, and 13,000 for Shanghai and Beijing.
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Old March 8th, 2013, 02:53 PM   #5550
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The numbers listed in the table are nominal values. The numbers written out in his post are in Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) terms.
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Old March 8th, 2013, 02:55 PM   #5551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scion View Post
The numbers listed in the table are nominal values. The numbers written out in his post are in Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) terms.
Well then, that would make sense. Thanks.
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Old March 8th, 2013, 08:07 PM   #5552
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Guangzhou South

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Guangzhou South Station (236B/365) by nicoyangjie, on Flickr

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Guangzhou South Station (236A/365) by nicoyangjie, on Flickr

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Guangzhou South Station (240B/365) by nicoyangjie, on Flickr
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Old March 9th, 2013, 02:59 PM   #5553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VECTROTALENZIS View Post
Those numbers are not correct. Shanghai and Beijing are on about the same level of GDP per capita. Almost all the big cities on the east coast are on a similar level of GDP per capita. Even some inland cities are on a similar level.

PPP GDP per capita for Shanghai and Beijing are about 21K and 20 USD respectively and for Guangzhou and Shenzhen about 23K and 25K USD respectively.

Here is a GDP per capita list for 2012.

These figures appear to be pulled from an analyst's spreadsheet, so I will demur to vectro's info above.
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Old March 10th, 2013, 05:34 AM   #5554
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In Japan it is reported that there is a bill that will be voted during this years national assembly that the Ministry of Railroad will be dismantled and operation will be turned into a private company and planning and future construction will be absorbed into the Ministry of transportation.
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Old March 10th, 2013, 08:33 AM   #5555
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Guangzhou South is my very favorite, thanks for the pictures hkskyline.
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Old March 10th, 2013, 08:53 AM   #5556
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Quote:
Originally Posted by China Hand View Post
These figures appear to be pulled from an analyst's spreadsheet, so I will demur to vectro's info above.
No I don't think they are made up since the numbers are in line with 2011's and 2010's figures.

Look here for 2011's and 2010's GDP per capita numbers.

2011

2010
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Old March 10th, 2013, 10:40 AM   #5557
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuraiBlue View Post
In Japan it is reported that there is a bill that will be voted during this years national assembly that the Ministry of Railroad will be dismantled and operation will be turned into a private company and planning and future construction will be absorbed into the Ministry of transportation.
It is already a done deal. Google "china ministry of railways", and you will find many reports.

BTW, Guangzhou South is fantastic with a broad open view and much of daylighting.
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Old March 10th, 2013, 11:09 AM   #5558
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It's official: the Ministry of Railways will be broken up and merged with the Ministry of Transport.

Reuters

Quote:
The Railways Ministry and Family Planning Commission have been particularly unpopular, and their restructuring was widely expected.

The Railways Ministry has faced numerous problems over the past few years, including heavy debts from funding new high-speed lines, waste and fraud.

Railways planning will be coordinated under the broader transport ministry. The government has pledged to open the rail industry to private investment on an unprecedented scale.
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Old March 10th, 2013, 03:52 PM   #5559
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VECTROTALENZIS View Post
No I don't think they are made up since the numbers are in line with 2011's and 2010's figures.

Look here for 2011's and 2010's GDP per capita numbers.
I think you misunderstand. An analyst's figures would not be made up, they would be more accurate and up to date based upon collecting the data in house for whatever investment house the analyst works for. Since they are close, but not identical, and have a column for Share.

Unless these are just yours and you did the spreadsheet yourself...
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Old March 10th, 2013, 03:54 PM   #5560
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@Hmmwv

Is there any information about the current status and opening date
of these 3 HSR lines?


- Lanxin HSR

- Beijing - Shenyang HSR

- Shanghai - Kunming HSR

Thx
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