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Old August 26th, 2013, 04:44 AM   #6381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sopomon View Post
Surely if your ticket gives you a seat, it's expected that that is the seat you'll take? Or is the general populace happier simply dashing for whichever suits their needs, regardless of when they actually booked it for?
If there are no specific boarding gates for each train, then you need more people to check and sort out any seating confusions on board. There will be people that will try to take an earlier or later train than their ticket, which will create a lot of problems on board as the G trains do not allow standees.
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Old August 26th, 2013, 05:17 PM   #6382
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
You'd find it much less of a joke if someone were to build a line (not a station) on a high viaduct just 100 m from your apartment.

Seriously looks like the easy and fast era of infrastructure building in China is about to be over. Overall probably a good thing and a sign of more advanced society.
Most of those "concerned residents" are just there trying to get more money out of the government. A lot of the so called concerns are bogus claims such as electromagnetic radiation like what stopped the Shanghai-Hangzhou maglev. If they are really concerned they should have suited their property developers, who knowingly built residential complexes too close to the planned railway lines. This line may be delayed further if CRC doesn't just suck up and pay.
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Old August 26th, 2013, 07:57 PM   #6383
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Old August 26th, 2013, 11:15 PM   #6384
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I have a question. Why did it happen that almost on all lines in shanghai, Hangzhou, Nanjing and even Guangzhou and Shenzhen there are only Siemens Velaro trains? Seems like all Kawasaki and Hitachi trains were written off? Where are they now?

In late 2011 I noticed Kawasaki trains were more spread in Shanghai railway stations than all the other CRH trains. Where did they go?
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Old August 27th, 2013, 01:41 AM   #6385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Night City Dream_ View Post
I have a question. Why did it happen that almost on all lines in shanghai, Hangzhou, Nanjing and even Guangzhou and Shenzhen there are only Siemens Velaro trains? Seems like all Kawasaki and Hitachi trains were written off? Where are they now?

In late 2011 I noticed Kawasaki trains were more spread in Shanghai railway stations than all the other CRH trains. Where did they go?
It's better for a railway track to operate the same type of train, so I guess they've finally got enough trains to segregate by region.

The Kawasaki and Hitachi?? trains are slower than the Velaros.
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Old August 27th, 2013, 01:50 AM   #6386
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Restless View Post
It's better for a railway track to operate the same type of train, so I guess they've finally got enough trains to segregate by region.

The Kawasaki and Hitachi?? trains are slower than the Velaros.
Some CRH2 are designed for 350km/h. Just like CRH3 right?
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Old August 27th, 2013, 04:19 AM   #6387
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Originally Posted by Pansori View Post
Some CRH2 are designed for 350km/h. Just like CRH3 right?
I think so.
But they'll have different operating characteristics, so it's better for them to be segregated off.
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Old August 27th, 2013, 08:31 AM   #6388
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Restless View Post
It's better for a railway track to operate the same type of train, so I guess they've finally got enough trains to segregate by region.

The Kawasaki and Hitachi?? trains are slower than the Velaros.
Slower? Some models are Japanese but they can reach 380. And then, Japanese-based trains are quieter than Velaros when speeding up from the start.

I understand segregation but in this case where did all Japanese trains go?

UPD:

Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Railways_CRH380A they say trains can reach 380 km/h and all the pictures show trains based on Japanese Shinkansen. These are my favorite high speed trains in China and I wonder where they disappeared.

Test have shown their potential as 486 km/h against 487 for Velaros. I don't think it is too much as a difference.

Then, as for Velaros, we read:

Quote:
All 54 CRH380BL trainsets were recalled in mid-August 2011 due to operational problems on the new Beijing–Shanghai High-Speed Railway. The new trains were reported as being "too sensitive" and the subject of frequent breakdowns in stormy weather. They will be temporarily replaced by the CRH380A and CRH380AL
.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Railways_CRH3

As. Can understand it means that Velaros were replaced by Kawasakis, right?
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Last edited by _Night City Dream_; August 27th, 2013 at 08:42 AM.
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Old August 27th, 2013, 09:30 AM   #6389
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Originally Posted by _Night City Dream_ View Post
As. Can understand it means that Velaros were replaced by Kawasakis, right?
Where do you read this?
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Old August 27th, 2013, 10:10 AM   #6390
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I gave the source in the previous post.

Sorry, they WILL be replaced by Kawasakis temporarily.

Still, where did almost all Japanese trains go, I didn't find the answer. They are not slower and they seem to be more reliable.
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Old August 27th, 2013, 11:07 AM   #6391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Night City Dream_ View Post
I gave the source in the previous post.

Sorry, they WILL be replaced by Kawasakis temporarily.

Still, where did almost all Japanese trains go, I didn't find the answer. They are not slower and they seem to be more reliable.
The Beijing-Shanghai line is almost a self-contained railway line - so any train breakdowns won't ripple onto the rest of the network.

So I suspect that the 250km/h Kawasaki CRH2 and it's faster derivatives have been deployed to Beijing-Guangzhou and the other interior lines - because they have longer distances and a network configuration which means train breakdowns cause more disruption.
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Old August 27th, 2013, 11:32 AM   #6392
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
If there are no specific boarding gates for each train, then you need more people to check and sort out any seating confusions on board. There will be people that will try to take an earlier or later train than their ticket, which will create a lot of problems on board as the G trains do not allow standees.
yes this is not a big issue for small stations but for large ones with many platforms and the crowds it'll be very frustrating.
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Old August 28th, 2013, 12:30 AM   #6393
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Night City Dream_ View Post
I have a question. Why did it happen that almost on all lines in shanghai, Hangzhou, Nanjing and even Guangzhou and Shenzhen there are only Siemens Velaro trains? Seems like all Kawasaki and Hitachi trains were written off? Where are they now?

In late 2011 I noticed Kawasaki trains were more spread in Shanghai railway stations than all the other CRH trains. Where did they go?
I never noticed that those lines only run Velaro based trains, there are plenty of CRH380As running on Beijing-Shanghai, and the Shanghai-Nanjing ICL has the bulk of CRH2C (350km/h capable) rolling stock. The older CRH2s are not on those lines because they are only rated at 250km/h, so they are now deployed to 200-250km/h lines.
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Old August 28th, 2013, 12:41 AM   #6394
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Night City Dream_ View Post
Slower? Some models are Japanese but they can reach 380. And then, Japanese-based trains are quieter than Velaros when speeding up from the start.

I understand segregation but in this case where did all Japanese trains go?

UPD:

Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Railways_CRH380A they say trains can reach 380 km/h and all the pictures show trains based on Japanese Shinkansen. These are my favorite high speed trains in China and I wonder where they disappeared.

Test have shown their potential as 486 km/h against 487 for Velaros. I don't think it is too much as a difference.

Then, as for Velaros, we read:

.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Railways_CRH3

As. Can understand it means that Velaros were replaced by Kawasakis, right?
China did not import any 350-380km/h very high speed trainset technology from Japan. The only Japanese origin design that's capable of such speed is the CRH2C, which is more of an unsanctioned domestic effort.

The test you were referring to actually shows the 380As were quicker, the 486km/h record was achieved by an unmodified train, 380B's 487km/h was done with a shortened trainset.

The 380Bs were temporarily replaced by 380As and after the corrections have been implemented they are returned to serivce. No one replaced the other.
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Old August 28th, 2013, 06:55 AM   #6395
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It boggles my mind that people insist that they aren't making advancements in technology...

I mean, they are building a thousands of km of lines! They're bound to discover a few things others haven't been able to perfect yet...
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Old August 28th, 2013, 09:06 AM   #6396
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Datong-Xian has caternary tensioning weights attached to the infrastructure at 50m spacings as they tighten the wire overhead.
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Old August 28th, 2013, 01:23 PM   #6397
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It boggles my mind that people insist that they aren't making advancements in technology...
They are making progress, but they are trying to leap from nothing to state of the art in a timespan that nobody has achieved before.

Japan, France and Germany have spent decades to get to their current designs and we all know they're still not flawless. People will get wary when China buys those high speed trains from abroad and claims within 2 years to have produced an improved version that is capable of much higher speeds.
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Old August 28th, 2013, 03:10 PM   #6398
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Question for everyone:

Anyone have speed profiles BY TIME, not BY DISTANCE IN KM?

Anyone know what the time it is to take to accelerate on G/D trains to a given speed is?

Example:
1 minute to accelerate to 60kph, 2 min to 120, 3 min to 150, etc.

I am attempting to figure out possible maximum speeds for new PDL's that will have many stations that are close together. Trying to figure out that if two stations are 15km's apart, what the max speed will be due to acceleration and deceleration times; if stations are 20km's apart, 25km's apart, etc.
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Old August 28th, 2013, 04:54 PM   #6399
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Yaohua2000 most likely has the profile, if he posted them in terms of km maybe he can go back to the raw data to find out the time equivalent.
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Old August 28th, 2013, 04:54 PM   #6400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M-NL View Post
They are making progress, but they are trying to leap from nothing to state of the art in a timespan that nobody has achieved before.

Japan, France and Germany have spent decades to get to their current designs and we all know they're still not flawless. People will get wary when China buys those high speed trains from abroad and claims within 2 years to have produced an improved version that is capable of much higher speeds.
You are assuming China started from zero which is wrong. China has a solid research background in rail technology. Also the money China is investing is orders of magnitude higher than those countries combined. Don't you think it will have some results?

The main reason for higher speeds is the infrastructure not the trains themselves necessarily.
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