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Old April 18th, 2014, 12:05 AM   #7901
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pansori View Post
Even today I really doubt that there are many passengers for the entire Beijing-Guangzhou service which takes 7:59 hours. You can fly much faster so why bother? HSR can work for distances up to around 1500km (depends on how fast the trains go) in order to be competitive with air travel.
And depends on the time of day they travel, too.
When shall Urumqi-Xining-Lanzhou high speed railway open for service? And what shall then be the G train time Urumqi-Beijing? Urumqi-Shanghai? Urumqi-Guangzhou?
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Old April 18th, 2014, 05:55 AM   #7902
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Originally Posted by flankerjun View Post
Shenyang North railway station
Nice photos but we do have a China Stations thread here. Maybe it's best to post all station pictures there.
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Old April 18th, 2014, 06:04 AM   #7903
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Two inter-city rails will open in May in Wuhan

Wuhan-Huangshi Intercity Rail:

96.78km, 10 stations, operation speed 250kmph

Wuhan-Huanggang Intercity Rail:

It's a branch of Wuhan-Huangshi Intercity Rail. The branch length is 36km, operation speed is 200kmph.

source
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Old April 18th, 2014, 09:55 AM   #7904
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Nanning-Guangzhou HSR,April 18th,2014

Guangxi section(Nanning-Wuzhou) has been officially opened today in Guangxi Zhuang Autonomous Region,South of China.
1.

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5.

From chinanews.com
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Last edited by hhzz; April 18th, 2014 at 10:02 AM.
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Old April 19th, 2014, 01:57 PM   #7905
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Quote:
Originally Posted by big-dog View Post
Two inter-city rails will open in May in Wuhan
Wuhan plans to build 16 inter-city HSR lines.

Do you think it's a good idea to create a CHINA | Inter-city Rail thread?

Per wiki "Inter-city rail services are express passenger train services that cover longer distances than commuter or regional trains."

Inter-city rails works best in densely populated city clusters. In China almost all inter-city rails are high-speed rails. Due to lack of commuter rails some inter-city lines often serve the purpose of commuter rails with city metros.

The existing and planning inter-city HSR rails are,
  • Beijing-Tangshan Inter-city Rail (planning)
  • Beijing-Tianjin Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Beijing-Zhangjiakou Inter-city Rail (planning)
  • Changchun-Jilin Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Changsha-Zhuzhou-Xiangtan Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Chengdu-Chongqing Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Chengdu-Dujiangyan Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Chengdu-Mianyang-Leshan Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Chongqing-Wanzhou Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Dandong-Dalian Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Dongguan-Huizhou Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Guangzhou-Foshan-Zhaoqing Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Guangzhou-Zhuhai Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Hangzhou-Huangshan Inter-city Rail (planning)
  • Harbin-Qiqihar Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Liuzhou-Nanning Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Nanchang-Jiujiang Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Nanjing-Hangzhou Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Nanjing-Anqing Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Qingdao-Rongcheng Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Wuhan-Xianning Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Wuhan-Huangshi-Huanggang Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Wuhan-Xiaogan Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Shanghai-Nanjing Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Shenyang-Fushun Inter-city Rail (Opened)
  • Shenyang-Dandong Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Tianjin-Baoding Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Xi'an-Tongchuan Inter-city Rail (planning)
  • Zhanjiang-Maoming-Yangjiang Inter-city Rail (planning)
  • Zhengzhou-Jiaozuo Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Zhengzhou-Kaifeng Inter-city Rail (U/C)
  • Zhengzhou-Xuchang Inter-city Rail (Planning)
It's said more will be planned and built.

source: baidu and wiki

Last edited by big-dog; April 22nd, 2014 at 05:22 PM.
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Old April 19th, 2014, 02:13 PM   #7906
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No, they can go in the China | Railways thread. Railways covers all intercity travel except for the HSR. That is how other countries are organised. The Subways and Urban transport section is for all local transport by rail (suburban rail and metros etc), so this is why the Tokyo, Osaka, Nagoya etc suburban railway systems are included in the Subways and Urban Transport section.

It's up to you to delineate which railways being opened are inter city (so to go in the China | Railways thread in this section) and which are suburban or intrinsically local (and therefore go in the Subways and Urban Transport section).

Hope that's clear. Any problems and you can contact me.
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Old April 19th, 2014, 05:16 PM   #7907
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Thanks for the input.

One concern is, as I mentioned in above post, almost all inter-city rails are high-speed rails in China. So it may cause confusion if they are put in the China | Railways thread (instead of China | High Speed Rail thread).
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Old April 19th, 2014, 05:43 PM   #7908
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Big-dog has a point though, Chinese inter-city HSR is kind of a new category of transport that does not exists in other countries. It is like a high speed commuter rail with longer distances and much higher speed than regular commuter rails. If they were, say, in Germany, they would be possibly counted as just high speed rail. However, in China they run along next to trunk high speed lines. If I have to choose, I would go with "Subways and Urban Transport" section and use the larger city's topic.
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Old April 19th, 2014, 05:55 PM   #7909
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What do you mean by "all intercity rail lines are high speed rail"? What speed do they operate at? If it's above 250km/h and run outside metropolitan areas then they belong here in the high speed rail thread. Intercity trains travel at 200kmph in the UK, but they're not high speed rail (for example). Same in Germany, the IC trains run at 200km/h but are separate from ICE. There are many other examples around the world too of higher speed intercity lines that tend to go at decent speeds (generally below 250km/h) that are separate from HSR.

Last edited by Svartmetall; April 19th, 2014 at 06:03 PM.
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Old April 19th, 2014, 09:59 PM   #7910
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I think the definition of intercity HSR may fall between two chairs.

1. As it is owned and operated by CRH - the HSR service branch of CR, they may be considered as HSR.

But since CRH itself define intercity HSR (commuter) differently from the regular (long-distance) HSR, one may consider them as intercity HSR. Some of the intercity HSR are not even connected to the national HSR grid, if I recall correctly.

It could also be considered as light rail, but usually they are owned by local governments, while intercity HSR are owned nationally (through CRH).

What do you think?
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Old April 20th, 2014, 01:42 AM   #7911
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Svartmetall View Post
What do you mean by "all intercity rail lines are high speed rail"? What speed do they operate at? If it's above 250km/h and run outside metropolitan areas then they belong here in the high speed rail thread. Intercity trains travel at 200kmph in the UK, but they're not high speed rail (for example). Same in Germany, the IC trains run at 200km/h but are separate from ICE. There are many other examples around the world too of higher speed intercity lines that tend to go at decent speeds (generally below 250km/h) that are separate from HSR.
This map shows some of them:



Design speeds are 200 - 350km/h.

I would called them "regional commuter high speed rail". How's that?!
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Old April 20th, 2014, 01:59 AM   #7912
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foxmulder View Post
This map shows some of them:



Design speeds are 200 - 350km/h.

I would called them "regional commuter high speed rail". How's that?!
That sounds reasonable.

Take the Shanghai-Nanjing Intercity line, which is 301km long.
It is essentially a single built-up metropolitan area along the entire line - which is why svartmetall got confused about it.

So it runs at 300km/h and has train stations every 15km or so.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 02:40 AM   #7913
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I think those fit under the general definition of high speed lines, even if not as fast on average or long as is a standard in China.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 03:10 AM   #7914
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Svartmetall View Post
What do you mean by "all intercity rail lines are high speed rail"? What speed do they operate at? If it's above 250km/h and run outside metropolitan areas then they belong here in the high speed rail thread. Intercity trains travel at 200kmph in the UK, but they're not high speed rail (for example). Same in Germany, the IC trains run at 200km/h but are separate from ICE. There are many other examples around the world too of higher speed intercity lines that tend to go at decent speeds (generally below 250km/h) that are separate from HSR.
FYI In China Intercity Lines means regional/commuter HSR lines for commuters in the same metropolitan region. They range from the speed of 200km/h to 350km/h.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 03:12 AM   #7915
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Restless View Post
That sounds reasonable.

Take the Shanghai-Nanjing Intercity line, which is 301km long.
It is essentially a single built-up metropolitan area along the entire line - which is why svartmetall got confused about it.

So it runs at 300km/h and has train stations every 15km or so.
Do the all-stop services run at 300km/h?
It seems a little redundant, given they'd be running at those speeds for a minute or two before slowing down once again
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Old April 20th, 2014, 10:04 AM   #7916
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Do the all-stop services run at 300km/h?
None exists. No train makes more than 8 stops between Shanghai and Nanjing.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 10:34 AM   #7917
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No visible trial operations on the Datong-Xian PDL as of yet...scheduled to begin next week.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 11:10 AM   #7918
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I would indeed say that these "shorter" high speed commuter/regional rail lines are very much to stay in this thread. If you think about it, the Shinkansen in Japan operates over shorter distances too and connects cities that are quite close to each other and are used as commuter services. This is also the case in smaller, dense countries like Germany too where the ICE system can operate as short commuter services (even from Frankfurt Airport to Frankfurt Hauptbahnhof for example).

Keep it here and keep up the good posting everyone.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 01:13 PM   #7919
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Svartmetall View Post
I would indeed say that these "shorter" high speed commuter/regional rail lines are very much to stay in this thread. If you think about it, the Shinkansen in Japan operates over shorter distances too and connects cities that are quite close to each other and are used as commuter services. This is also the case in smaller, dense countries like Germany too where the ICE system can operate as short commuter services (even from Frankfurt Airport to Frankfurt Hauptbahnhof for example).

Keep it here and keep up the good posting everyone.
Here is the biggest thread on the first page of this forum.
The 14 threads over that page which are 1000+ posts are:
  1. This China High Speed Rail, before me 7904
  2. China Railways 5494
  3. China High Speed Trainsets 1775

Poll: United States High Speed Rail 4483
  1. Spain: High Speed Rail 2742
  2. Spain Railways 2489
Europe Eurostar and Inter-Country Railways 2339
Germany Railways 2022
Russia Railways 1959
Ukogbani Railways 1775
Switzerland Railways 1604
  1. Japan Railways 1556
  2. Japan High Speed Rail 1228
Netherlands Railways 1394

Just because the high speed railways of Japan or Germany fit in one thread does not mean that the high speed railways of China do not warrant splitting in some logical manner.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 02:39 PM   #7920
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Well, if members here feel it would seriously be just as used as this thread and continue to be updated then fine, I guess the weird designation of "High Speed Regional Rail" for that thread would be okay if someone wants to start it (and put it in the thread finder).
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