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Old December 9th, 2009, 11:06 AM   #821
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Can the Chinese CRH go at a slow speed to the old lines to access old railway stations or serve branch lines, like French TGV does?

Travelling through cities at slow speed wastes time. But in first and last stops, it would make a lot of sense - those who want can get off in a suburban station.

What is the distance by rail from Changsha to Wuchang? What shall the trip times be from Changsha to Wuchang and Guangzhou as of 27th of December?
Most of CRHs are running 160~200km/h at existing lines today.
China MoR is testing above 30ton axle load freight train.
The speed limit of China conventional lines are 160km/h @ 20ton axle load or 120km/h @ 23ton, very similar with Europe. If a 30ton axle load train was running at a conventional line, the rail condition would be very poor, so the speed limit may be 80~120km/h.

I can image the future of Chinese railway, when Passenger Specail Network is built, 14ton axle load CRHs are running at it with speed of 250~350km/h, and heavy slow freight trains running at an other parallel double-track, maybe cheapest passenger trains will running at freight lines at 80km/h.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 11:45 AM   #822
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Can the Chinese CRH go at a slow speed to the old lines to access old railway stations or serve branch lines, like French TGV does?
Yes. Not by any means in all circumstance but yes. Same electrification, same guage.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 01:03 PM   #823
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Changsha-Wuchang

I found quite some information.

The distance Changsha-Wuchang is 362 km. A schedule can be found at:
http://www.chinatravelguide.com/ctgw...Submit1=submit

The fastest train is D150, and it covers the distance in 3:09, with 3 intermediate stops (Yueyang, Chibi, Xianning).

There are 54 trains total in a day. 24 of them are T trains, which take roughly 3:24 to 4:00

A lot of trains stop in Changsha at odd hours of night, passing through and picking up passengers.

The number trains are generally the slowest. Mostly taking about 5 hours. The exception is train number 1804, which takes about 6 and a half hours.

What shall the trip time be from 28th of December?
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:01 PM   #824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
I found quite some information.

The distance Changsha-Wuchang is 362 km. A schedule can be found at:
http://www.chinatravelguide.com/ctgw...Submit1=submit

The fastest train is D150, and it covers the distance in 3:09, with 3 intermediate stops (Yueyang, Chibi, Xianning).

There are 54 trains total in a day. 24 of them are T trains, which take roughly 3:24 to 4:00

A lot of trains stop in Changsha at odd hours of night, passing through and picking up passengers.

The number trains are generally the slowest. Mostly taking about 5 hours. The exception is train number 1804, which takes about 6 and a half hours.

What shall the trip time be from 28th of December?
I've heard that Wuhan-Guangzhou 350km/h HSR will be opened at December 27. You should be the one of first passengers.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:22 PM   #825
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Can the Chinese CRH go at a slow speed to the old lines to access old railway stations or serve branch lines, like French TGV does?

Travelling through cities at slow speed wastes time. But in first and last stops, it would make a lot of sense - those who want can get off in a suburban station.

What is the distance by rail from Changsha to Wuchang? What shall the trip times be from Changsha to Wuchang and Guangzhou as of 27th of December?
Chinese CRH does go at a slow speed to the old lines to access old railway stations or serve branch lines, like French TGV does.

For the old Beijing-Guangzhou line, the rail distance from Wuhan to Changsha is 362 km (Wuchang to Changsha), the fastest train takes 03h21m to cover this distance, with three stops at Xianning, Chibi and Yueyang, or 03h09m in the opposite direction from Changsha to Wuchang with the same stops.

For the new Wuhan-Guangzhou high-speed line, the rail distance is shorten to 348 km (Wuhan to Changsha South), and a non-stop train takes 01h05m to cover this distance. If the train stop at Xianning North, Chibi North and Yueyang East, each for one minute, it should take 01h21m or so.

Last edited by yaohua2000; December 9th, 2009 at 02:32 PM.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 05:23 PM   #826
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yaohua2000 View Post
For the new Wuhan-Guangzhou high-speed line, the rail distance is shorten to 348 km (Wuhan to Changsha South), and a non-stop train takes 01h05m to cover this distance.
Which means 321 km/h average. This sounds realistic, considering the 350 km/h maximum.

With 1:05 trip distance station to station, this makes daily commute to Wuhan a rather practicable proposal. Especially if there are convenient opportunities to get to metro network.

Are any CRH stations located in airport terminals?
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Old December 9th, 2009, 06:54 PM   #827
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China to launch high-speed railway from central to south China
A railway linking Wuhan in central China's Hubei Province and Guangdong's capital Guangzhou city was set for trial run on Wednesday.

It took three hours for trains to cover the 1,068.6-kilometer railway, said an official with the railway bureau of Wuhan.

The railway costs about 116.6 billion yuan (about 17 billion US dollars) and shortens the 10.5-hour trip between Wuhan and Guangzhou to three hours.

Trial operation of the railway shall start on December 20, according to the official.

China is in a fervor of improving its railway system amid transportation pressure. As planned, it will build 42 high-speed passenger rail lines with a total length of 13,000 kilometers in the three years.


A driver leads the train through the tunnel on the Wuhan-Guangzhou Railway, December 9, 2009. The High-Speed Passengers-dedicated Wuhan-Guangzhou Railway, which extends 1,068.6 km in full length and scheduled to be operational by the end of 2009, made its trial operation on wednesday.


The test-running trains prepare for their first journey at the station in Guangzhou, capital of south China's Guangdong Province, Dec. 9, 2009.


The test-running train prepare for its first journey at the station in Guangzhou, capital of south China's Guangdong Province, Dec. 9, 2009.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2...nt_9150831.htm
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Old December 9th, 2009, 07:10 PM   #828
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beautiful...
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Old December 9th, 2009, 07:22 PM   #829
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slartibartfas View Post
@highway35
Thanks for that very informative post.



Of course, but a large capacity long distance rail that is not connected by large capacity local rail/metro experiences a serious disadvantage.

Rail has to be competitive on shorter travels against the car and on eg 1000 km against aviation. Maybe the situation in China is different but in Europe, it is a major advantage of the High Speed Rail that its stations are pretty close to the centre, compared to the airports.

Anyway, I think most of these Chinese rail hubs are connected either to Metro or local rail connectors anyway. If what someone said above, that the average distance to the centre would be 8 km thats something very different from the 70 km above and is nothing awkward then.
8km is a very short distance. As mentioned above, situations such as this would be very rare. Stations located within 10KM of existing city centers should mostly be existing terminals serving older lines.

70KM, on the other hand, would be the opposite end of the spectrum. In certain cases, as it is explained with great articulation by Highway35 in his/her post above as well as the list of reasons that I've given, this does happen.

But mostly, these new HSR stations would be quite a distance away from the existing city center.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 07:24 PM   #830
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HunanChina View Post
I think I should make more efforts in my English study.
English is the most difficult language in the world.
Actually I believe Chinese is.

Your English is fine.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 08:30 PM   #831
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Thats the western aproach to the question which language is the most difficult one. How about a compromise between you both? Let's say Finnish is the most difficult one. No one understands the Fins
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Old December 9th, 2009, 09:17 PM   #832
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Wuhan Station is beautiful, except for the silly calligraphy font for the outside display. Come on now, it's 2010.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 09:24 PM   #833
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Actually, English is one of the languages that are most like Chinese in structure. Both have a subject-verb-object word order, subject-noun phrase structure, relatively simple verb conjugation and relatively complicatd verb aspects. The difference lies in that the vocabulary of English is mostly Indo-European, whereas Chinese Sino-East Asian. Behind there there are also a lot of cultural factors. Most Chinese would find Japanese and Korean much easier to learn as the three share a lot of vocabulary and cultural heritage, although Japanese and Korean have some very different grammar.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 10:01 PM   #834
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My goodness, what an improvement! I've done the journey from Guangzhou to Wuhan twice, and as much as I like the sleeper trains, a reduction from 10.5 hours to 3 hours is just amazing!
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Old December 9th, 2009, 11:29 PM   #835
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Wow, that's a cool animation, not only the station is nice, but they seem to build not just a station there but a whole urban station district. Great.

Quote:
image hosted on flickr
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Old December 9th, 2009, 11:37 PM   #836
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slartibartfas View Post
Thats the western aproach to the question which language is the most difficult one. How about a compromise between you both? Let's say Finnish is the most difficult one. No one understands the Fins
my first language is Chinese. it's freaking hard.... althought I'm sure Finnish is very tough as well...
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Old December 9th, 2009, 11:38 PM   #837
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Originally Posted by leo_sh View Post
Actually, English is one of the languages that are most like Chinese in structure. Both have a subject-verb-object word order, subject-noun phrase structure, relatively simple verb conjugation and relatively complicatd verb aspects. The difference lies in that the vocabulary of English is mostly Indo-European, whereas Chinese Sino-East Asian. Behind there there are also a lot of cultural factors. Most Chinese would find Japanese and Korean much easier to learn as the three share a lot of vocabulary and cultural heritage, although Japanese and Korean have some very different grammar.
Actually in this respect, I'd say French is more like Chinese, in terms of grammer, than English.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 11:58 PM   #838
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UD2 View Post
my first language is Chinese. it's freaking hard.... althought I'm sure Finnish is very tough as well...
To be honest I think Chinese is harder to learn, not that Finnish would be that much less alien to a person that is at home in the indo European language family, but it helps big time that Finnish is written in latin writing and you pronounce it the very way you write it. So it does not take a lot to get to know how to read Finnish properly. Same can hardly be said of Chinese, at least from a European perspective

Minä olen eurooppalainen, mutta en puhua paljon suomea

Ok, enough OT from my side, I don't want to mess around too much here.
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Old December 10th, 2009, 12:15 AM   #839
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moi non plus
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Old December 10th, 2009, 12:27 AM   #840
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Sehr gut

Have I already expressed my deep admiration of China's High speed rail program? Its breath taking to see the dimensions.
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