daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old November 25th, 2015, 10:32 PM   #10361
ccdk
Registered User
 
ccdk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 337
Likes (Received): 980

call this "special livery"? ;-)
- Our Prime Minister Li Keqiang, aka. HSR super salesman, takes leaders of 16 central and eastern European countries on a HSR ride from Suzhou to Shanghai
http://news.6park.com/newspark/index...iew&nid=133186









__________________
ccdk no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old November 26th, 2015, 03:34 AM   #10362
Silly_Walks
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,980
Likes (Received): 836

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccdk View Post


Silly_Walks no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 26th, 2015, 03:44 AM   #10363
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,960
Likes (Received): 18220

^ For the 4th Summit of China and Central and Eastern European Countries (CEECs)?
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 26th, 2015, 10:50 AM   #10364
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,980
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by luhai View Post
1. Early visits are for people who travel to the coast (Shenzhen, Shanghai etc rather than just the nearest large city. What important here is time needed to take off, companies in China typically don't off vacations (and if they do, people usually don't use it and exchange it for money instead). So your travel time + time together exceed a weekend or a typical holiday break, you will not go back.
Agreed. Iīve been saying it all the time.
I argue that a lot of people do travel to nearby large cities. And they could afford the time to go home and back in a weekend.
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 26th, 2015, 11:22 AM   #10365
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,960
Likes (Received): 18220

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Agreed. Iīve been saying it all the time.
I argue that a lot of people do travel to nearby large cities. And they could afford the time to go home and back in a weekend.
Not the migrants, and only some of the better-off middle class or above. But you need to show the income figures to prove affordability.
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 26th, 2015, 12:12 PM   #10366
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,980
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by luhai View Post
What important here is time needed to take off, companies in China typically don't off vacations (and if they do, people usually don't use it and exchange it for money instead). So your travel time + time together exceed a weekend or a typical holiday break, you will not go back.

2. Entitlement only work well in the places you're registered. Policies differ. A typical government health plan covers 70% of costs he goes to the hospitals in his city of registration, and 30% in the province of registration and 0% outside of the province. If you're outside of your area, you'll need to pay out of pocket or purchase private health insurance. Both of which costs a pretty penny. So unless you have to, you don't move outside of your area of registration.
In other words, it is not just the actual distance nor travel time that favours people migrating short distance. It is also the location and level of administrative boundaries. Someone whose home is in Huaqiao, right across the border of Shanghai, 30 km from central Shanghai and 60 km from central Suzhou, is better off finding a job in central Suzhou, same prefecture level city, than walking across the border to a different province where he has no health coverage.
Also, someone from Kunshan has more rights in Xuzhou (still Jiangsu province) than across the border in Shanghai.

Sum: a lot of people would be expected to migrate short distances, like to a nearby midsized city.
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 27th, 2015, 01:28 AM   #10367
dobrija
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 11
Likes (Received): 3

serbian pm next to chinese
__________________

t2contra liked this post
dobrija no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 27th, 2015, 08:53 AM   #10368
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,960
Likes (Received): 18220

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
In other words, it is not just the actual distance nor travel time that favours people migrating short distance. It is also the location and level of administrative boundaries. Someone whose home is in Huaqiao, right across the border of Shanghai, 30 km from central Shanghai and 60 km from central Suzhou, is better off finding a job in central Suzhou, same prefecture level city, than walking across the border to a different province where he has no health coverage.
Also, someone from Kunshan has more rights in Xuzhou (still Jiangsu province) than across the border in Shanghai.

Sum: a lot of people would be expected to migrate short distances, like to a nearby midsized city.
The migrant population refers to those from the impoverished countryside, not people living in richer cities that move around the country from rich city A to rich city B.
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 27th, 2015, 07:21 PM   #10369
dimlys1994
Moderator
 
dimlys1994's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Dniepropetrovsk
Posts: 16,355
Likes (Received): 26180

From Rail Journal:

Quote:
http://www.railjournal.com/index.php...ml?channel=540

Hainan Island high-speed line goes full circle
Friday, November 27, 2015



THE construction of a high-speed line encircling Hainan reached a key milestone on November 26 when the first test train ran on the 344km Western High-Speed Ring Railway, completing the 652km loop around the Chinese island

Construction began on the Yuan 27bn ($US 4.23bn) project in September 2013 and the 344km line is due to open next month, linking the provincial capital Haikou with Sanya, a popular tourist destination in the south of the island. The line has a design speed of 200km/h

...
__________________

Pansori liked this post
dimlys1994 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 12:46 AM   #10370
Silly_Walks
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,980
Likes (Received): 836

What type of service will they have on the line? Will they have a continuous circle line, such as Beijing's Metro lines 2 and 10, or will there be termini?
Silly_Walks no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 03:32 AM   #10371
sponge_bob
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,955
Likes (Received): 2207

Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
The CRH network should be better compared against airplanes.
Exactly.

Quote:
You still don't understand China's income profile and why CRH was built for long-distance intercity travel and commutes.
AVERAGE migrants got home once a year ( at CHINESE new year) on a slow train...we are talking 2006 or 2007 here. It took days there and back.

AVERAGE migrants pay is twice ( or more) as high as it was then and the HSR network PLUS the higher pay means they might go home twice a year now, once at New Year and one other time in summer.

Importantly the migrant will be there and back in a few days with some time at home nowadays.

HSR ridership is very high on some routes, the official pretence that the trains are 'Chinese' rather than the European and Japanese knockoffs they are has made the Chinese very proud of 'their' trains and very supportive of the rail business.

The alternative for many is a 'foreign' plane which might not be much faster unless the trip is over 1000km and might not be much cheaper than HSR either.
sponge_bob no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 03:36 AM   #10372
skyridgeline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,525
Likes (Received): 1217

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silly_Walks View Post
What type of service will they have on the line? Will they have a continuous circle line, such as Beijing's Metro lines 2 and 10, or will there be termini?
Leisure ?

dailymail.co.uk
__________________

ccdk, BEE2, ARHANGELstGAVRIIL liked this post
skyridgeline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 07:44 AM   #10373
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,960
Likes (Received): 18220

China to spend $438b on new rails over the next five years
Updated: 2015-11-27
China Daily Excerpt

China sets to invest a total of at least 2.8 trillion yuan ($438 billion) in railway construction during the 13th Five-Year Plan period (2016-2020), reported Economic Information Daily.

National railway network will grow by more than 23,000 kilometers over the next five years, with intercity projects and ones in Midwest regions being priority, said the newspaper citing people familiar with the matter.

China's railway construction has been on a fast track, as the country saw the annual investment surge by 11.3 percent from 580 billion yuan in 2011 to 800 billion yuan in 2014.

During the 12th Five-Year Plan period, China spent a combined 3.47 trillion yuan on new rails, exceeding the original target of 2.8 trillion yuan by far, according to the newspaper.

High-speed railway remains as one of the key infrastructure projects, according to the 13th Five-Year plans released by local governments.

Projects that are expected to be underway include lines from Yinchuan to Lanzhou, Baotou to Xi'an, Chongqing and Guiyang, Datong to Taiyuan and Zhanjiang, and Xiamen to Changsha and Chongqing.

Beijing plans to expand its suburb rail lines by 800 kilometers, and urban transits by 900 kilometers, according to its 13th Five-Year Plan proposal.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!

FM 2258 liked this post
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 09:36 AM   #10374
dbhaskar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 113

Great to see more focus on western regions in the next five years. For continued growth, it is important to close the gap between western/inland regions and east coast.

As economy grows and livelihoods improve, violence and fundamentalism should decrease in far western regions. I hope that in about 2 or 3 decades from now Urumqi will be a transport and trading hub driving the revitalization of former USSR and Central Asian states.
__________________

VECTROTALENZIS liked this post
dbhaskar no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 10:07 AM   #10375
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,980
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by luhai View Post
A typical government health plan covers 70% of costs he goes to the hospitals in his city of registration, and 30% in the province of registration

3. It cost 450 yuan to rent a one bedroom apartment in Taiyuan.
So, a daily commute to Taiyuan would avoid the rental cost if one way ticket cost is 10 yuan or less, correct? 22 workdays per month, so 44 trips.
Train number 4611 has 6 stops between Taiyuan and Jiexiu, 139 km distance (And actually terminates in Jiexiu).
Of which Taiyuan South, 8 km from Taiyuan, is in Taiyuan City. But the next station, just 27 km from Taiyuan, is Yuci - and thatīs already intercity, in city of Jinzhong, Yuci District.
Taigu Station, 63 km from Taiyuan, is in Taigu County
Qixian Station, 86 km from Taiyuan, is in Qi County
Pingyao Station, 108 km from Taiyuan, is in Pingyao County
Zhanglan Station is 119 km from Taiyuan
Jiexiu Station is in Jiexiu County Level City.
So... does it make sense to commute by train between Yuci and Taiyuan at least?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 10:18 AM   #10376
dbhaskar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 113

While the original technology is not Chinese, the trains are manufactured, maintained and adapted for climate in China. The infrastructure is Chinese and it employs a significant number of high skill well-paid Chinese workers. I think this in itself is a good enough reason to be "proud". Furthermore, the system functions at a scale not seen in other countries.

I think there are many tangible and intangible attributes that make a high-speed rail system desirable:

> Eco-friendly: Increasingly, this is in itself a good reason to choose HSR over air transport.

> Ability to move more luggage/cargo: I have personally benefited from this. While attending a tech conference, I was able to carry a lot of hardware that would cause problems in air travel.

> Ancillary services: Better wi-fi, power outlets, cellular service throughout, less waiting time (no de-icing, less security hassle), more legroom, more customer service, etc.

> Desire for upward social mobility: This is often ignored, but I think it plays an important role. While it is true that many migrant workers etc. cannot afford to travel in HSR today, it nevertheless evokes a desire in many to be successful and motivates technological progress.

I don't think HSR is wasted effort and it will be consigned to history books like the Concorde. It is here to stay. Since building a network takes time and considerable investment, it is better to start now (even if many cannot afford it) rather than waiting too late when land/labor is too expensive or cost of relocation is too high.
dbhaskar no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 12:02 PM   #10377
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,980
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by dimlys1994 View Post
From Rail Journal:
About that Hainan - the bigger obvious missing link is the one between Guangzhou and Haian.
Are there any plans for a Guangzhou-Maoming-Zhanjiang-Haian high speed railway?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 12:23 PM   #10378
ccdk
Registered User
 
ccdk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 337
Likes (Received): 980

China wants to build a high-speed rail link to a newly open Iran
http://qz.com/557009/chinas-next-big...ilway-to-iran/

China Railway, the state-owned rail-building behemoth, has proposed a high-speed rail link that will carry both passengers and cargo between China and Iran, according to the state-controlled China Daily.


http://www.globalconstructionreview....l-link-direct/

The proposed route, put forward last week at a meeting of the China Civil Engineering Society, would take advantage of the easing of global sanctions against Iran, while also bring Iran closer in to China’s widening economic orbit.

China’s economic influence has been expanding along with president Xi Jinping’s efforts to install a large-scale infrastructure network that connects economies as far apart as Southeast Asia and Western Europe. This is essentially aimed at increasing cross-border trade but, handily, the network puts China at the center of the newly imagined trade map.
The most recently proposed route would begin in Urumqi, the capital of China’s western Xinjiang province, and end in Tehran, the Iranian capital some 3,200 km (2,000 miles) away. Along the way it would stop in Kazakstan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, and Turkmenistan:
The route of the proposed China-Iran railway.

Central Asia already has rail infrastructure that can move goods between China and the region, but a major problem is that Central Asian countries use a different width of track than China and most of the rest of the world. That means goods can be transported across borders, but that trains must wait for days on certain crossings to change their gauges.
China’s plan is to build a single rail line that relies on a uniform gauge along the whole route. That would cut down the time needed to transport goods and increase the route’s competitiveness against ocean freight alternatives. The trains themselves would run at up to 300 km per hour (185 miles per hour) for passenger trains and 120 km/h for freight trains.

China is not the only country making grand plans for Iran’s soon-to-be liberated economy. Aerospace giant Boeing has discussed its intention to open an office in Tehran once sanctions are lifted, and one unnamed German company has already agreed to build solar power powers in Iran, according to Bloomberg. Oil majors have long been talking with Iran’s oil ministry; it’s conceivable that China’s proposed rail link could also be put to use exporting Iranian oil.

But while the government in Beijing has a strong reputation for getting things done at home, it has a less-than-stellar record of completion when it comes to international projects. Recently, local governments have scrapped a hydro-power project in Myanmar and a high-speed rail link in Mexico, to name just two.

One analyst told the China Daily that a project such as the rail route to Tehran could suffer the same fate as those above, due to geopolitics out of China’s control. But while projects in other nations are nice-to-haves, routes that connect to China directly, such as the proposed line to Iran, are generally seen as key strategic goals for Beijing.

That’s partly because the other side of China’s great rail plans involve expanding the network through Southeast Asia, to countries as far as Laos, Thailand, and Malaysia. Another even more fantastic idea is a rail line from Beijing to the continental US. Should such train routes prove successful, China will have placed itself right at the center of a very significant network.
__________________

jonasry liked this post
ccdk no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 12:28 PM   #10379
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,980
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccdk View Post
China’s plan is to build a single rail line that relies on a uniform gauge along the whole route. That would cut down the time needed to transport goods and increase the route’s competitiveness against ocean freight alternatives. The trains themselves would run at up to 300 km per hour (185 miles per hour)
And then itīs just 200 km/h Urumqi to Lanzhou. Where the railway stops dead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccdk View Post
for passenger trains and 120 km/h for freight trains.
How do the 300 km/h passenger trains pass the 120 km/h freight trains?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 28th, 2015, 12:42 PM   #10380
sponge_bob
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,955
Likes (Received): 2207

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Urumqi to Lanzhou

How do the 300 km/h passenger trains pass the 120 km/h freight trains?
Entirely new HSR is built from Urumqi to Lanzhou with the worlds highest HSR tunnels.They would share share west of this section only where your problem will occur. There is talk of continuing from Urumqi into Kazakhstan with new HSR tracks.

Last edited by sponge_bob; November 28th, 2015 at 12:57 PM.
sponge_bob no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
china, high speed rail

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 04:22 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium