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Old January 12th, 2018, 01:58 AM   #11981
cheehg
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I read all those 600 pages in two weeks. Great thread.
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Old January 12th, 2018, 01:26 PM   #11982
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Cost per km of the lines

600 pages in two weeks, wow
I hope that now you read every little while, it will be better for your health.

I have my own list with, in this case, the average speeds and the cost per km in €uros calculated with the change that was at the time of the announcement of its construction or, when they reported it, when it was inaugurated.
It is very dislocated and without order to group to put a single image and because the original has more data (previous and subsequent time and number of trains) and I had to remove columns.
In blue are the lines that are not yet in service.



And here, in another format, the lines under construction.

Route / Speed / Estimated date / Km / Situation

Harbin-Jiamusi (de 5:49 a 2 h) (12,07 M € mixta) 200 06/2018 343 13→N
Wuzhong (al Sur de Yinchuan)-Zhongwei (13,45 x km, no UIC) 250 31/08/2018 134,75 14
Xuzhou East-Huai'an-Yancheng (17,85 M €) 250 2019 316 UIC/314 04
New Beijing East-Baodi South-Tangshan (40,18/36,73 M €) 350 149/163 01 R
Wuhan Hankou-Xiangyang-Shiyan (17,92 M €) (no UIC) 350 2019 395/399 12 y R
Taiyuan-Zhengzhou (17,19 M €) o Jiaozou (358 km) (no UIC) 2020 391 05
Ganzhou-Shenzhen (18,77 M €) 350 2020 436 03
Kazuo-Chifeng (2→O de Shenyang 14,39 M €)(no UIC) 250 2020 157,4 —
Hangzhou-Shaoxing-Taizhou (23,05 M €) (no UIC) 2021 269 11→01
Zhengzhou-Hangzhou (de 8 h 14 m a 3 h 40 m por 18,64 M €) 350 2021 818 Centro→SE
Zhengzhou-Xiangyang-Wanzhou (19,40 M €) 350 2022 785 (UIC)/818 05 y 12
Nanchang-Huangshan (21,70 M €) 350 2022 286 →NE
Yinchuan-Xi´an (18,29 M €) (no UIC) 618 07
Mudanjiang-Jiamusi HSL (13,08 M €) 375 13→N
Zhangjiajie-Jishou-Huaihua HSL (19,16 M €) 350 247 05
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Old January 12th, 2018, 04:27 PM   #11983
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Bullet train runs for trial operation on Yelang River Bridge in SW China

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/201..._136891142.htm


Photo taken on Jan. 11, 2018 shows the Yelang River Bridge at Tongzi County of Zunyi City, southwest China's Guizhou Province. The bridge is an important part of a railway connecting two major cities in southwest China, Chongqing Municipality and Guiyang, capital of Guizhou. The bridge and the railway are both put into a test run. (Xinhua/Liu Chan)









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Old January 13th, 2018, 08:40 AM   #11984
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Watch Out, Airlines. High Speed Rail Now Rivals Flying on Key Routes
https://www.bloombergquint.com/busin...-global-routes



(Bloomberg) -- Across Asia and Europe, high-speed rail is providing a competitive alternative to air travel on the same routes, in terms of price and the all-important barometer of time. Put that together with the environmental benefits that flow from not burning jet fuel, and staying on the ground begins to make more sense for travelers who would otherwise trudge to the airport.

Speedy trains and planes are generally competitive until your travel plans extend beyond 1,000 kilometers (621 miles), at which point travelers consider flying superior for time savings, according to an overview of academic research by the Journal of Advanced Transportation. But new technologies may push that boundary in the years and decades to come. The chart below gives examples of key global routes where the two are currently comparable.



“Travel time is critical for the competitiveness of different transport modes,” researchers from Beijing’s Beihang University and the University of South Florida in Tampa wrote last year, buttressing a 2014 European study (PDF) that found more air service on routes for which trains take longer. While this supports the theory that trains can supplant air travel if door-to-door time and price are equal or better, that doesn’t turn out to be the case in reality. It’s not a zero-sum game after all.In general, the advent of fast, affordable train service in China, Japan, South Korea and western Europe has eroded such preconceptions as to how airlines and railroads compete. The entry of high-speed rail in markets dominated by airlines doesn’t always lead to fewer available flights—there’s evidence that, in many places, affordably priced train tickets actually spur new travel demand, much the way ultra-low-cost airlines in Asia, Europe and the Americas have affected bargain fares. That helps both trains and planes.



The new rail industry is seeing its most vibrant growth in China, which also has the world’s largest high-speed network, the fastest trains and the greatest ambitions for future expansion. One of the world’s busiest routes, Beijing to Shanghai, features the new domestically built Fuxing high-speed train, now with a top allowed speed of 218 miles per hour (351 kilometers per hour). That speed increase cut the 775-mile (1,247 kilometer) trip to 4 hours, 28 minutes on a route that has about 100 million rail passengers annually, according to Chinese news service Xinhua.

Japan’s high-speed shinkansen, or bullet trains, date to the 1960s and have become a staple of domestic travel, with speeds of about 199 mph (320 km), making for a 2 1/2 hour trip between Tokyo and Osaka, one of the most heavily trafficked routes. That same city pairing, however, has hourly airline service by both of Japan’s largest carriers—with each using a mix of wide-body Boeing Co. 767s, 777s and 787s for the 70-minute flight. While adding station/airport dwell time and the time spent getting from city center to the platform/gate doesn’t change the result in this case, such calculations sometimes make the difference when it comes to travel time.



In 2015, 910 million Chinese traveled by all forms of rail—more than twice the 415.4 million who flew, according to the journal article. Unsurprisingly, the future of train technology resides in China. The first magnetic-levitation, or maglev train, which can travel as fast as 267 mph (430 kph), operates in Shanghai; engineers are researching future maglev trains that could travel at a stunning 373 mph (600 kph), an achievement that could thoroughly upend the current dynamic between air and ground travel.



Over time, Chinese airlines and high-speed trains have generally evolved so that fares and service classes are comparable, said Yu Zhang, an assistant professor of civil and environmental engineering at the University of South Florida and one of the journal report’s authors. In their early days, Chinese high-speed rail operators sought to emulate airlines in terms of attendant training, with fares that were generally too high to spur much demand, she said. Since then, train fares have dropped.

“Air service is impacted, but we do not see a significant reduction of passengers, either,” Yu said of the Chinese market. “It’s really dependent on the particular route.”



In Europe, the Eurostar high-speed rail from London to Paris and Brussels served 10 million riders last year, the fourth since it first topped that mark. The service began in November 1994 and drew 2.9 million passengers the following year. Current Eurostar fares begin at 29 pounds ($39), down from initial fares of 79 pounds in the system’s early days.

Again, the different modes of transport that might seem to be rivals for the same passengers are in many way complementary. Low-cost airlines focused on short-haul routes and European high-speed rail options that would seem to compete are generally not rivals, given their vast differences on other counts. The trains generally serve city centers, while the air carriers tend to use secondary airports further afield as a way to lower their costs.

On the Paris-Bordeaux line, high speed rail is “by far the most competitive travel offer with a real traffic growth of 70 percent since its launch in July,” the French railway SNCF said in an emailed statement. “In November, we reached 82 percent of the Paris-Bordeaux travel market share,” SNCF official Rachel Picard said. “This high speed benefits all customers, including professional travelers whose number has doubled compared to 2016.”



And what happened to the big airlines on the continent such as Air France-KLM? They have ceded traffic on the shorter routes to low-cost rivals, including Ryanair Holdings Plc and EasyJet Plc. Many major U.S. airlines are following suit, abandoning smaller regional jets and reducing service to less-populated cities.

“The way airlines think of trips that are short-haul has changed,” said Holly Reed, an executive with Texas Central Partners LLC, which is raising money to build a bullet train between Dallas and Houston.

By now, you may have noticed the absence of one large country from this discussion. After a century of neglect, U.S. transit infrastructure has more in common with the developing world than with China or Western Europe. While Asia rail systems measure their passengers in the hundreds of millions, in the U.S., Amtrak had 31.3 million riders in its 2016 fiscal year.

America’s fastest train, the Acela, travels on the Boston-New York-Washington corridor with a speed capability of only 150 mph (241 kph)—but the trains rarely exceed 100 mph (161 kph) due to congestion—and then only for short periods on aging tracks. With the rails often running parallel with the busy Interstate 95, it’s not uncommon to see cars outpacing locomotives.

Flight and train ticket prices are the lowest average prices including taxes for travel dates Prices that appeared at least twice per day were included. Flight ticket prices were obtained from Skyscanner in USD. Budget airlines were not considered. Train ticket prices were obtained from operator booking sites, except for train tickets in China which were from ctrip.com. Transit time is the fastest metro or commuter transportation to the airport, excluding airport express unless necessary. The cost of transit is the sum of all one-way tickets on the transit route. Transit times and costs were obtained from official transportation and operator websites, Google Maps and Baidu Maps. All prices not obtained in USD were converted. Ticket price research and conversion were performed on
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Old January 13th, 2018, 09:41 AM   #11985
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China´s high speed rail has a problem competing with accessibility, compared to airplanes and compared to Japanese or French HSR.

Unlike Japanese or French HSR, and like airports, CRH tends to not serve established stations in central cities, nor are new stations on old established transit routes. Rather the CRH stations are new, huge, in distant suburbs and hard to get to. This removes one advantage of CRH over air.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 03:37 PM   #11986
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Chongqing-Guiyang railway under trial run

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/201..._136893427.htm


Photo taken on Jan. 12, 2018 shows the Loushanguan South Railway Station, southwest China's Guizhou Province. A railway connecting two major cities in southwest China, Chongqing and Guiyang is under trial run. Designed for passenger trains running at a speed of 200 kilometers per hour, the railway will improve traffic between China's southwest and northwestern, eastern, southern areas. (Xinhua/Han Ye)


A bullet train runs on Chongqing-Guiyang railway near Zunyi, southwest China's Guizhou Province, Jan. 12, 2018.



















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Old January 13th, 2018, 05:59 PM   #11987
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
China´s high speed rail has a problem competing with accessibility, compared to airplanes and compared to Japanese or French HSR.

Unlike Japanese or French HSR, and like airports, CRH tends to not serve established stations in central cities, nor are new stations on old established transit routes. Rather the CRH stations are new, huge, in distant suburbs and hard to get to. This removes one advantage of CRH over air.
CRH has an advantage over air because airports in China are even more distant. The only city I know off the top of my head where the airport is closer to the population centroid of a city than the main new high speed station is Xiamen and maybe Dalian and both those cities airport's days are numbered, as they are being moved quite far away from the city. Also there is Shanghai which has a tie (Hongqiao). Also the notion that CRH stations are new, inaccessible in distant suburbs is quite a myth in big cities. Most of the main stations in Teir I and II Chinese cities are in now in the urban area or have become new established city cores. The real competitor is in the Teir III and IV cities were the new railway stations are built really far away and urban growth is not that strong. However the competitor is not planes, its long distance buses.

Last edited by saiho; January 13th, 2018 at 06:07 PM.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 07:58 PM   #11988
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Modal split between HST and plane

Modal split between HST and plane, taking into account the time and average speed. Some data is something old, and I'm missing Korea.
China's data is also old, taken from a World Bank report.





Any new information would be appreciated, if possible with its source.
Thanks!
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Old January 13th, 2018, 08:47 PM   #11989
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The high speed service Paris-Amsterdam is very popular, and nearly everyone I know from Amsterdam who travels to Paris, takes the train.
I think the modal split % is still so low, because many Air France-KLM destinations first fly you to Paris CDG, where you can change aircraft for the next part of your journey.
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Old January 14th, 2018, 02:51 AM   #11990
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccdk View Post
Watch Out, Airlines. High Speed Rail Now Rivals Flying on Key Routes
https://www.bloombergquint.com/busin...-global-routes
I heard Bloomberg were sometimes a bit slack on accuracy, but Beijing-Shanghai HSR, even if you took a tricab to & from stations, and walked up 23 floors to your apartment, surely you could do better than 7 hours
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Old January 15th, 2018, 02:48 AM   #11991
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The most recent numbers I've seen for Korea are probably around 60% modal share for HSR from Seoul to Busan, but that was in 2008; I'd imagine it's higher now. By contrast, planes are down to about 20% (again, circa 2008).
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Old January 15th, 2018, 07:23 PM   #11992
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A real HSR fan







http://news.163.com/18/0115/21/D87KVJJR00018AOQ.html
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Old January 15th, 2018, 09:24 PM   #11993
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
China´s high speed rail has a problem competing with accessibility, compared to airplanes and compared to Japanese or French HSR.

Unlike Japanese or French HSR, and like airports, CRH tends to not serve established stations in central cities, nor are new stations on old established transit routes. Rather the CRH stations are new, huge, in distant suburbs and hard to get to. This removes one advantage of CRH over air.
I agree some stations are too far from city center, such as Guangzhou south. most of the terminal stations are ok in China. some of them are actually very close to center, such as Beijing, Shenyang, Hangzhou, Ningbo, Shijiazhuang, Zhengzhou,etc. there are reasons HSR cannot enter the center stations. limited land and limited space for upgrade the old stations. If you know the old stations in China normally are very small in term of platforms.
also station locations have to decided together with local gov. a lot of them have plan to develop the new areas so they want the stations to be in the planned new area. but now the situation is changed when the HSR become very popular in China and they realized this problem.
Guangzhou has plan to convert old Guangzhou station to HSR and move all the conventional routes to a new station located between Guangzhou and Guangzhou North. which is now a freight only station.
Shanghai has similar plan to move the long distance low speed terminal station to new Songjiang and change Shanghai South to a HSR and commuter station. Beijing will do the same for Beijing West and move the low speed routes to new Fengtai station.


HSR lines in France are also cannot bring to all the existing stations either. TGV est has stations in the mid of nowhere or between two cites, where they built new connection lines to cities.
it is not good plan like Japanese first HSR line Tōkaidō Shinkansen while the line connected to the old stations but most of the trains are not even stopped on those stations. the speed limit has to change very frequently. they have to make the train set to automatically programmed the speed limit changes according to the line. It is easier for Tōkaidō Shinkansen to connect the old station because the speed limit was designed for 210 k/h only.

The good solution is to connect those suburban stations to center stations with connection lines. Feeder connection trains can be timing with the main line service. so the seamless connections can be made.

Chinese center gov. is pushing railway to serve the urban commuters so new commuter railway lines will be connected to those HSR stations.
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Old January 15th, 2018, 10:14 PM   #11994
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There are no Chinese airline routes among the top 5 busiest in the world. I bet there would be without HSR playing such a prominent role.
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Old January 16th, 2018, 12:59 AM   #11995
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheehg View Post
I agree some stations are too far from city center, such as Guangzhou south. most of the terminal stations are ok in China. some of them are actually very close to center, such as Beijing, Shenyang, Hangzhou, Ningbo, Shijiazhuang, Zhengzhou,etc. there are reasons HSR cannot enter the center stations. limited land and limited space for upgrade the old stations. If you know the old stations in China normally are very small in term of platforms.
Quote:
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it is not good plan like Japanese first HSR line Tōkaidō Shinkansen while the line connected to the old stations but most of the trains are not even stopped on those stations.
How big is Tokyo Station compared to Shanghai Station? Because Tokyo Station is shared by Shinkansen, zairaisen and also Yamanote Line. And opened in 1914!
And I understand Shanghai Station is not good for trains passing through, so CRH trains won´t pass through without stopping there...
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Old January 16th, 2018, 01:07 AM   #11996
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One major issue with Chinese stations is not the stations themselves but rather boarding procedures. They are inefficient and have a pre-programmed risk of delaying the trains (albeit admittedly the staff usually do a good job coping with this). This is not something that can be changed easily because it's got more to do with people's culture and manners rather than infrastructure. But it probably explains, at least in part, why Japan is managing to achieve such incredible efficiency AND punctuality with its trains. Boarding is far more efficient and passengers are better behaved. Chinese stations have extremely large reserve capacity provided they start using less restrictive boarding rules.
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Old January 16th, 2018, 11:01 AM   #11997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
There are no Chinese airline routes among the top 5 busiest in the world. I bet there would be without HSR playing such a prominent role.
Or the military shutting off the vast majority of airspace to commercial use, causing near constant delays.
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Old January 16th, 2018, 11:49 AM   #11998
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In Taiwan, Nangang, Taibei, Banqiao and Zuoying Stations are all shared with slow speed rail.
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Old January 16th, 2018, 02:31 PM   #11999
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Harbin-Mudanjiang HSR progress
http://www.gov.cn/xinwen/2018-01/16/..._5257145.htm#3

Total length: 293km, designed speed: 250km/h, operational: end of 2018





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Old January 16th, 2018, 05:19 PM   #12000
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Chinese bridge
Published on Jan 16, 2018


First half is Nanchang to Ganzhou high speed railway,located in Jiangxi province,southern China:

second half is Harbin to Mudanjiang high speed railway,located in Heilongjiang province,northern China:

前半部分是位于江西省的南昌到赣州高铁,后半部是位于黑龙江的哈尔滨到牡丹江高铁,可以看出中国南北方高速铁路的不同风貌
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