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Old March 2nd, 2011, 09:27 PM   #1841
81jun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khoojyh View Post
Why i dont feel its really fast??? its just like usual train.... its because of view from train interior?
haha,well I think you should take a ride on it to experience that
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Old March 2nd, 2011, 09:35 PM   #1842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khoojyh View Post
Any public facilities will be targeted, how China security force to protect HSR, i have no idea, how they stop terrorist attak, i have no idea but once its attack by terrorist, new policy or new technology will be appear like one of our forumer mentioned earlier. Do we need to wait till 300 people sacrifice? introduce new technolody then?

Maybe somebody from China can explain how they is the HSR security in China, i am kinda interested to know.
See my post in the previous page regarding railway and HSR security in China.

Quote:
Originally Posted by khoojyh View Post
Why i dont feel its really fast??? its just like usual train.... its because of view from train interior?
I didn't feel fast in 350km/h G trains or the 430km/h maglev at all, probably due to the use of so called deceleration glass (which is just a better glass that doesn't "accelerate" the view).
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Old March 2nd, 2011, 09:39 PM   #1843
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the so called deceleration glass is just a myth. the most reasonable cause is that you don't have another moving article as a contrast. you can definitely feel how fast it is when it is passing a 100km/h conventional train in the same direction.
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Old March 3rd, 2011, 12:29 AM   #1844
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you guys heard the news, a vice head of railway under invetigation..

http://www.tudou.com/playlist/playindex.do?lid=11537069
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Old March 3rd, 2011, 06:06 AM   #1845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khoojyh View Post
Why i dont feel its really fast??? its just like usual train.... its because of view from train interior?
How far apart are those catenaries supports? It looks like the train was passing 2 poles per second.

assume those poles are 50 meter apart, the train would be travelling at around 360km/h. 50 meters x 2 x 60 seconds x 60 minutes.
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Old March 3rd, 2011, 06:23 AM   #1846
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Originally Posted by UD2 View Post
How far apart are those catenaries supports? It looks like the train was passing 2 poles per second.

assume those poles are 50 meter apart, the train would be travelling at around 360km/h. 50 meters x 2 x 60 seconds x 60 minutes.
They are exactly 50 meters apart.
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Old March 5th, 2011, 04:07 AM   #1847
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Quote:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110302/...hpbmFyYWlsd2F5

China railways scandal widens, raising criticism

By ELAINE KURTENBACH, Associated Press Elaine Kurtenbach, Associated Press – Wed Mar 2, 3:16 am ET
SHANGHAI – A widening probe into corruption in China's powerful Railways Ministry is raising questions over the scale and pace of its multibillion-dollar drive to build costly high-speed railways, though it is unlikely to derail the program.

Along with concerns over financing and other issues, at least one proposal for scaling down the showcase program is due to be presented to a top advisory group meeting in Beijing this week during the annual session of China's National People's Congress, a state media report said Wednesday.

Critics of the high-speed railways expansion say ticket costs are too high and the services do not really meet the needs of average travelers in many areas.

"Railway development plans should be more down to earth and take into account what people really need," Wu Youying told the Shanghai Daily. Wu is a member of the advisory group, the Chinese People's Political Consultative Congress.

While Wu's proposal will likely gain little traction given the resources invested in high-speed rail, the corruption investigation is a blow to the program, which until recently has rivaled China's space efforts in terms of national pride and importance.

The scandal surfaced last month with the dismissal of Railways Minister Liu Zhijun amid allegations of so-far unspecified "severe violations of discipline." Reports in the financial news magazine Caixin Media and other local media say the allegations involve kickbacks, bribes, illegal contracts and sexual liaisons.

Dismissals of top Communist Party officials are rare, since they can damage the party's credibility among a public already jaded by widespread graft. But the current leadership has sought to burnish its image with various cleanup campaigns.

In the latest development, Zhang Shuguang, an engineer in charge of research and development of the country's high-speed railways, was removed, also for alleged but unnamed disciplinary violations, the official Xinhua News Agency announced late Tuesday.

Zhang oversaw innovation of China's high-speed rail technology, according to an earlier Xinhua report that quoted him describing his triumphs in negotiations with foreign companies.

"Our strong point is that Chinese producers are united to form a 'China corps,'" Zhang said.

The same epic account cited Liu, the ousted railways minister, as likening the country's high-speed railways to "dragons in the sky."

The concerns over the railway program are not limited to corruption.

The country's 56,400 miles (91,000 kilometers) of passenger railways are the world's longest and, in some cases, the fastest, but are still working beyond their capacity.

China will spend 700 billion yuan ($106 billion) in railways construction this year, railway officials say, as it works toward its goal of having 8,060 miles (13,000 kilometers) of high-speed rail in place by the year's end.

The costs are raising worries over financing. Major state-owned railway and railcar building companies with shares listed in Hong Kong and Shanghai increasingly are relying on bonds and bank loans to finance projects, with onerous repayment obligations that may be difficult to meet given the revenue projections for many projects.

Annual interest payments on loans for a high-speed rail link between Beijing and the nearby city of Tianjin, for example, will fall short of the line's annual revenues. Other lines face similar woes, the financial magazine Caijing reported, citing Zhao Jian, a professor at Beijing's Jiaotong University.

"It seems that political impetus, rather than market needs, lies behind China's railway frenzy," said a recent commentary in the Chinese newspaper Global Times, describing the boom as "incredibly risky."

The speed of construction has some experts asking about safety issues, but the top gripe among critics of the program is that the emphasis on bullet trains is coming at the expense of slower but more practical services.

Despite the increasingly public criticisms over the high-speed rail program, it is unclear what impact the scandal will have on future and current projects. They include a 870 mile (1,400 kilometer) high-speed link between Beijing and Shanghai, the country's commercial capital, that is due to open in June.

China, meanwhile, is going head-to-head with global rivals like Siemens, Japan Railways and Bombadier and winning overseas contracts, among them a recent $13 billion deal to build eight railway lines in Iran and plans for joint construction of a high-speed railway in Kazakhstan.
.....
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Old March 5th, 2011, 05:16 AM   #1848
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China being the first country in human civilization to establish bureaucracy, it must have the longest history of corruption too
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Old March 5th, 2011, 03:53 PM   #1849
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fragel View Post
the so called deceleration glass is just a myth. the most reasonable cause is that you don't have another moving article as a contrast. you can definitely feel how fast it is when it is passing a 100km/h conventional train in the same direction.
Actually the view is zoomed, that why it does not feel so fast.

Anyway great video, especially amazing bridges around the middle of the movie. Is the railway in construction beside running railway the new Beijing-Shanghai HSR?
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Old March 6th, 2011, 03:15 AM   #1850
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Full steam ahead on China's high-speed rails
Source: Global Times [08:22 March 01 2011]
By John Gong

http://opinion.globaltimes.cn/commen...03/628507.html

Quote:
A wave of doubt and criticism of China's ambitious high-speed railway plans have surfaced lately.
Last week, the Global Times published an article by Ye Tan, a financial commentator, "Transportation boom set for financial bust," that essentially points to two arguments challenging the strategic plan of Ministry of Railway (MOR).

Ye argues that high-speed railway is too fast, too costly, way ahead of its time and not sustainable over the long run. She also claims that the debt ratio at the MOR is so high that in the next two to three years it is likely to run into insolvency in servicing its debt.

Let me first address the second argument, which is easier refute. The MOR's debt-to-asset ratio right now stands at a bit over 50 percent. Although it has steadily climbed higher over the years, this level of debt ratio is well within the safety margins compared to many other providers of public infrastructures of such large scale.

Financial analysts who make a living following companies like Microsoft and Google are destined to be disappointed with public transportation companies, where earnings are mediocre, debt-to-asset ratios are high, and investment payoffs take a long time to materialize.

Just look at China's three largest airlines, Air China, China Southern Airlines, and China Eastern Airlines. Their debt-to-asset ratios are all around 90 percent, and yet they are still solid companies delivering decent earnings year after year.

The MOR's net profit margin has been around 10 percent for the last three years. And I do have a complaint about that - it's too much. There is no reason for a State monopoly to reap in such high profits. The MOR should lower its fares to benefit the public.

The MOR is a cash cow, being the only player in town in the railway business. The prospect of it running into insolvency is total nonsense. In the worst case, even when the MOR has a short-term cash flow problem, the Chinese government won't stand by and watch it go down.

Public transportation has many other economic benefits that financial analysts usually don't understand, including facilitating inter-province trade of goods and services, regional economic integrations, and stimulus functions to create jobs and economic activities.

The overall economic impact can't be seen just from cranking out ratios from the MOR's balance sheets and income statements. Therefore it is not unusual for the State to subsidize such public transportation rollouts.
When it comes to constructing high-speed rail, no country so far has relied entirely on the private capital markets. The Obama administration has already allocated billions of federal money for high-speed railway development in the last two years.

This leads to the issue of whether China's high-speed railway projects are ahead of its time and have become too expensive for the public to bear. Some analysts have used the mediocre financial performance of the Beijing-Tianjin line as a basis for asserting the lack of demand for such high-speed service.

Speed is indeed costly. High-speed railway tends to have a sweet spot of operation in terms of traveling distance - usually between 200 kilometers to 1,000 kilometers. Even though the Beijing-Tianjin line falls short of this range, it has still earned a positive cash flow within two years of opening service, with an occupancy rate above 70 percent.

The Shanghai-Nanjing line's occupancy rate is even above 100 percent, meaning there's more demand than seats available. Judging from these encouraging statistics, one has every reason to believe that newly opened high-speed railway lines will continue to deliver solid ridership statistics.
It is understandable that some citizens with lower incomes will lament the disappearance of slow but cheap green trains and minority is vocal about it. The silent majority, however, are already voting with their wallets.

The author is an associate professor of the Beijing-based University of International Business and Economics. [email protected]
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Old March 6th, 2011, 11:45 AM   #1851
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Meilan Railway Station Hainan East Ring ICL

Thanks X2000


Meilan Railway Station Hainan East Ring ICL

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Old March 6th, 2011, 12:02 PM   #1852
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Sanya Railway Station 中国最南端的火车站,我不知道“最南端”英语咋说,不好意思。

Thanks X2000

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Old March 6th, 2011, 12:19 PM   #1853
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Are there any other stations in the CRH network that had PSDs? The design at Meilan Station seems very unique.
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Old March 6th, 2011, 12:51 PM   #1854
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chewys View Post
Full steam ahead on China's high-speed rails
Source: Global Times [08:22 March 01 2011]
By John Gong

http://opinion.globaltimes.cn/commen...03/628507.html
Finally some sane voice in all the choir of attention seekers on the back of hyped program! I do believe that there should be criticism and some mistakes had and probably will be made in the process of building CRH network, yet that critisim sometimes seem a bit too politically motivated, no less than as some claim the system itself. Also there are way to many factual errors and "typos" like this one:

Quote:
By ELAINE KURTENBACH, Associated Press Elaine Kurtenbach, Associated Press – Wed Mar 2, 3:16 am ET
...
Annual interest payments on loans for a high-speed rail link between Beijing and the nearby city of Tianjin, for example, will fall short of the line's annual revenues.
...
I just wonder did the author even read what she said? Did her editors? If they did what are their qualifications?
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Old March 6th, 2011, 01:52 PM   #1855
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Originally Posted by HunanChina View Post
Sanya Railway Station 中国最南端的火车站,我不知道“最南端”英语咋说,不好意思。
China's southernmost railway station.
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Old March 6th, 2011, 08:29 PM   #1856
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Nice pictures....

If there is one good policy that China has followed in last years, it is the investment in high speed rail. There is no better option to move people.
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Old March 7th, 2011, 12:02 AM   #1857
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SimFox View Post
Also there are way to many factual errors and "typos" like this one:



I just wonder did the author even read what she said? Did her editors? If they did what are their qualifications?
what is the obvious mistake she made in that sentence? Even if what she said was false, is that really obvious?
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Old March 7th, 2011, 12:50 AM   #1858
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That new station in San Ya must be one of the most beautiful ones China has built lately. I love the combination of glass and wood. The latter makes it look very high class. Also the design is modern but not kitschy but still has this Chinese touch to it.

Thumbs up
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Old March 7th, 2011, 03:33 AM   #1859
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slartibartfas View Post
That new station in San Ya must be one of the most beautiful ones China has built lately. I love the combination of glass and wood. The latter makes it look very high class. Also the design is modern but not kitschy but still has this Chinese touch to it.

Thumbs up
I agree... but then you see how they put the name on the front of the railway station: they call it a "YaRailway" station...

Last edited by Silly_Walks; March 7th, 2011 at 09:11 AM.
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Old March 7th, 2011, 04:05 AM   #1860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cal_t View Post
Are there any other stations in the CRH network that had PSDs? The design at Meilan Station seems very unique.
Several underground high speed railway stations are currently under construction, so we might see more stations with PSDs. AFAIK, Shenzhen station is designed to have PSDs.

There are platform edge doors at some stations along the Guangzhou-Zhujiang ICL. This is the edge door installed at Zhongshan Nantou Station:

source:http://www.citygf.com/FSNews/FS_0020...1058386_1.html

There are also platform gates at some stations along the Chengdu-Dujiangyan ICL.
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Last edited by fragel; March 7th, 2011 at 04:16 AM.
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