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View Poll Results: Should the US build or improve it's HSR network?
Yes 249 89.57%
No 29 10.43%
Voters: 278. You may not vote on this poll

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Old December 9th, 2010, 11:40 AM   #1941
dumbfword
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here comes mika with his trolling bs. telecommunications is different than HSR.
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Old December 9th, 2010, 11:58 AM   #1942
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dumbfword View Post
here comes mika with his trolling bs. telecommunications is different than HSR.
Is there any way to voteban him or something? This guy is annoying the **** out of me, I'm tired of his bullshit
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Old December 9th, 2010, 12:11 PM   #1943
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mika Montwald View Post


1) I wonder when will some of these idiotic China government officials who are involved in
setting this JV with GE and as well those idiotic China executives from CSR learn the lesson from Huawei and ZTE.

Did GE bribe some China government officials?


2) Huawei and ZTE had been kicked out with such a humiliating force by US,
and yet so many China companies do not seem to learn the painful repeated lessons.



Link: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...googlenews_wsj


-----------------------------------------------------

NOTE:

Let's be frank. Please do not pretend.
Americans wants transparency. So here it is below.

-----------------------------------------------------

3) Giving the HST track Slab construction tech to US is a national treason.

The US -- Tea Bagger President (who is extremely likely win the 2012 election,
judging by the length of people line-up in WalMart parking lot -- waiting to see Sarah Palin up close)
will authorize an order to attack China militarily all out to save American -- Exceptionalism status.


85% American general public are only too eager and too happy to see China gets punished,
gets destroy and gets annihilated
from this planetEarth.


4) USA will use China's HST track Slab construction tech to reinforce and harden all their important military bunkers.
Giving one's enemy to protect themselves better is such an unwise move.





5) Without that special China's HST track Slab construction tech, the new US HST will not be able to run that fast. Which is a good thing.


6) Even if US allows China to build the HST track, US will still always bully China at every corner.


7) Thus, I hope CSR will waste the money and quickly learn the lesson of how much --
85% of American General Public passionately hates China gut Big Time.
dude.... chill!
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Old December 9th, 2010, 01:34 PM   #1944
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Quote:
Siemens has promised that if they would win the tender, they would set up or expand plants in the USA so American people can work on a product for America.
All of the manufacturers will build plants in the U.S. should they win contracts, both to comply with "made in America" regulations, and also to score political points(i.e. "real" jobs for Americans, shaking the hand of the local congressman photo opps, etc.). In fact, I believe almost all the major players in HSR already have plants in the U.S., or are going to build them. CSR's deal with GE gives them a foothold they can expand on, should a contract come their way.
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Old December 9th, 2010, 03:44 PM   #1945
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1) I sincerely hope that other Nation companies (without JV with China)
such as Kawasaki, Bombardier, Siemens, Alstom, Korean Rotem get and win the US contract.


If the other companies executives are wise, they should ask for full payment in the form of

-- California Rare Earth Minerals mine (Japan and German need these RE Metals a lot),
-- Supercomputer Simulation program source code (which Japan, French and German can sell to China later on),
-- or the state of Alaska, and Hawaii (which Japan, French and German can sell to China later on as well).


The main point is you do not ever want to accept payment in terms of USD Bald Eagle Toilet Paper from America.

-------------------------------------------

2) I sincerely hope that China companies will NOT give any cutting edge HST technology to USA , unless USA is bartering technology with China.

Technology Barter -- For example:

China HST Super Slab Track construction tech barter with USA:

1) Submarine Construction tech,
2) + F22 Pratt & Whitney F119-PW-100 Jet Engine,
3) + F22 Stealth Tech,
4) + Spaceship Propulsion tech,
5) + Supercomputer Simulation program source code
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Last edited by Mika Montwald; December 9th, 2010 at 06:09 PM.
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Old December 9th, 2010, 06:14 PM   #1946
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dumbfword View Post
It's not like the PRC is gonna own the rail line. Just build it and it will be owned and ran by an American rail authority. No national security grounds.
What's really interesting in that regard is that important parts of the existing rail network in the western USA were originally built by - the Chinese.

Mike
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Old December 9th, 2010, 06:30 PM   #1947
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Our discussion is based on the assumption that the CA HSR will get built, which at this point is still unknown.
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Old December 9th, 2010, 08:33 PM   #1948
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You don't happen to be the same greenlion from militaryphotos.net, do you?
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Old December 9th, 2010, 08:51 PM   #1949
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmmwv View Post
Our discussion is based on the assumption that the CA HSR will get built, which at this point is still unknown.
True, but CAHSR is in a pretty good position (of course, it would be in a better position were the state's internal finances not totally f***ed over).

Given that the most recently-stated 1st phase of the project would be between two places I'd never heard of before in the Central Valley, the similarities with this project and the construction of the Pennsylvania Turnpike, which de facto created the modus operandi of U.S. superhighway construction pre-Interstate and Defense Highway Act, are quite striking. The first phase of the Turnpike--as I noted on Skyscraper Page--opened between two little podunk places in the middle of Pennsylvania (Irwin and Carlisle), on top of a Vanderbilt-era unused rail grade, over which it was built cheap. (It should also be noted that by 1956 a network of turnpikes, thruways, tolled expressways, and parkways interlinked most of the Northeast and Midwest.)
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Old December 10th, 2010, 04:42 PM   #1950
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Quote:
Originally Posted by endrity View Post
dude.... chill!
Please stop quoting his entire posts. What is the point of an ignore list if people do that?
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Old December 12th, 2010, 04:59 PM   #1951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgk920 View Post
What's really interesting in that regard is that important parts of the existing rail network in the western USA were originally built by - the Chinese.

Mike
Chinese laborers though, not Chinese companies. I like this though, maybe GE can "digest" some technology from CSR! I wish GE had bought AdTranz...
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Old January 8th, 2011, 05:01 AM   #1952
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Quote:
High-speed rail: Do it right - or don't do it

Gary Patton
Thursday, January 6, 2011



If California wants a high-speed train system, then the Legislature and the governor must place management of the project in qualified hands. The California High-Speed Rail Authority is not qualified to manage the project successfully.
The state auditor has noted financial mismanagement and an over-reliance on consultants. The Legislative Analyst's Office has noted a continued failure to evaluate risks correctly. State Treasurer Bill Lockyer has said that financial investors don't believe that the project can succeed as designed. The Senate Transportation Committee has repeatedly imposed "control language" to try to ensure good management, and has insisted on a better business plan and ridership model. Most recently, the high-speed rail Peer Review Group, established by state law, has written to legislative leaders to call for "a thorough reassessment of ... critical engineering, financial, economic, and managerial issues."
Business, community and political leaders on the Peninsula have demanded that the state "do it right." The response from certain members of the rail authority has been to call them self-interested "rotten apples." To the contrary! They have been pointing out real problems, the same kind of problems noted by the official reviewers.
The ridership model upon which the entire system is based is significantly flawed, as verified by the prestigious Institute of Transportation Studies at UC Berkeley. The first ones to blow the whistle on the ridership model were community volunteers from Palo Alto.
Another set of volunteers from the Peninsula has recently published "The Financial Risks of California's Proposed High-Speed Rail" (at www.cc-hsr.org).
Bottom line: The project can't be financially successful in its present form.
Members of the authority have done a superb job of promoting the project. The vision they've promoted has been accepted by the people of the state, who have authorized a $9 billion down payment to try to make the vision a reality. Effective promotion, however, doesn't automatically translate into successful implementation.
There are serious financial, engineering and legal problems with the proposed project, and the authority is just not confronting them. Can the "Obstacles on the tracks" highlighted by The Chronicle's Dec. 8 editorial be avoided? Yes, but only if the Legislature and the governor put management into different and more expert hands.
The state needs to slow down and put people in charge who have experience building and operating a high-speed rail system. The time to act is now. Neither our new governor nor the Legislature wants to waste money, and it's still possible to get this project under control. Continuing to back the promotional ploys of the rail authority, however, is going to result in system failure. Absent new management, the state is definitely building a very costly train to nowhere.
Gary Patton served on the Santa Cruz County Board of Supervisors for 20 years. Now he is an environmental attorney who is working closely with the Community Coalition On High-Speed Rail on the Peninsula.
..
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Old January 8th, 2011, 05:03 AM   #1953
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Quote:
Worries Follow Route of High-Speed California Line

Jim Wilson/The New York Times
Traditional railroad tracks outside Borden, Calif. The town lies near the first northern construction start point on the high-speed line.




MADERA, Calif. — The area just south of this agricultural city is not much to look at: miles of farmland, a collection of dingy fast food outlets and a gold rush ghost called Borden, where all that remains is a tiny cemetery devoted to long dead Chinese workers.




Enlarge This Image

Jim Wilson/The New York Times

Ron Schaeffer at an Amtrak station in Corcoran, Calif.. Residents are concerned that a new high-speed rail line set to pass through will damage the town’s cultivated character.


But sometime soon, this flat-on-flat expanse — about 150 miles southeast of San Francisco — may well be home to a first-in-the-nation destination as the initial northern terminus of California’s ambitious high-speed rail network.
Under a plan approved in early December, the inaugural stretch of the multispurred 800-mile system will eventually connect San Francisco, Los Angeles, San Diego and Sacramento and other major California cities and will run through the state’s farm-rich Central Valley.
Federal and state authorities have committed some $5.5 billion to the first leg of the project, which will connect Bakersfield, the valley’s southern hub, and the unincorporated area south of Madera. Construction of what will be the first high-speed rail line in the United States is to begin in 2012 and run through 2017, with the promise of creating tens — even hundreds — of thousands of jobs in an area that suffers some of the highest unemployment rates in the state.
But despite the potential bounty of jobs, high-speed rail has not been fully embraced. After the rail authority approved the initial route in early December, Representative Dennis Cardoza, a Central Valley Democrat, disparagingly referred to it as “the train to nowhere.”
“For the California High-Speed Rail Authority to choose this route is to significantly undermine the public’s trust, marks a gross misuse of taxpayer funds and will alienate significant supporters of the project,” he said.
Part of that agita, of course, may be that the first section of high-speed rail will not pass through his district.
But the congressman is not the only person complaining. Several towns have passed resolutions opposing the project because of worries about the disruption of a 220-mile-an-hour train zipping through downtown districts.
And in the Central Valley, where huge, decades-old government irrigation projects have helped turned California into an agricultural powerhouse, farmers have grumbled about the rail project gobbling up valuable farm land.
“We’re of the belief that the productive farmland is an environmental and societal benefit, and we ought to be doing whatever we can to keep that land productive,” said Dave Kranz, a spokesman for the California Farm Bureau. “And once it’s gone, it’s gone forever.”
Roelof van Ark, the chief executive of the California High-Speed Rail Authority, which is overseeing the project, said he was trying not to take criticism of the project personally. “It’s not about today; it’s about the future,” Mr. van Ark said. “I hope that Mr. Cardoza and others will see the light.”
On Dec. 9, California’s rail authority received a windfall of additional federal stimulus money — some $600 million — when Republican governors in Ohio and Wisconsin passed on money intended for their states. California voters approved high-speed rail in 2008, and deadlines are already passing, including a Dec. 31 cutoff for the state to finalize a plan to spend federal money in the Central Valley. Initial spending will span a raft of projects, including designing stations, redirecting nearby roads and acquiring land.
Still, many details need to be worked out, including the exact route, which must be able to accommodate conventional train systems in case the high-speed rail project fails to find enough financing to be completed. And that uncertainty unsettles local leaders.
“The communication has just been atrocious,” said Mayor Robert Poythress of Madera. “If there have been any messages, they’ve been mixed.”
Ronald W. Hoggard, the city manager of Corcoran, to the south, echoes that sentiment, worrying that the big money involved in the high-speed project — the eventual price will be more than $40 billion — will roll over his small-town concerns. “When they talk about ‘the train to nowhere,’ we’re not nowhere,” Mr. Hoggard said. “We’re Mayberry.”
Mr. Hoggard says Corcoran, a city of 26,000 — including 12,000 “guests of the state” at nearby prisons — had spent years painstakingly restoring its main street, repainting store facades and improving City Hall, and he worries that the train will distract from the city’s carefully shaped character.
“If they were to come through town, with an elevated track, at 85 decibels?” he said. “It’s just inconsistent.”
Mr. van Ark said elevated lines passing through city centers were a possibility, but he played down their impact on small-town life. “Trains do run through the centers of town in the rest of the world,” he said.
The Central Valley is accustomed to rail lines, with freight trains loaded with double-decker cargo cars rolling day and night. And Corcoran itself has a small, quaint Amtrak depot in its downtown core.
Still, the selection of the first segment of rail line was a surprise. Other options included connecting major cities, like Los Angeles and Anaheim or San Francisco and San Jose. But the Federal Rail Administration required that the first federal money be spent in the hard-hit Central Valley.
Mr. van Ark pleads for patience, saying, “This is not about building a line in the Central Valley.” And indeed, while the first link may run from Bakersfield to that ghostly area outside Borden, that is not the final destination anyone has in mind.
“This is all about building an intercity, high-speed network,” he said. “One must put that above where this will start.”
..
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Old January 8th, 2011, 05:50 AM   #1954
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Why on earth would they build this line *through* these little towns???



Something like this must be built on a ROW that bypasses them, coming close to them at convenient places only if there are intended to be regional/local train station stops at them - much like how interstate and similar highways are routed.

Mike
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Old January 8th, 2011, 06:04 AM   #1955
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The HSR alignment is supposed to parallel the BNSF alignment. The BNSF alignment = arrow-straight. Towns were built around the BNSF alignment--not vice versa.

In this way, CAHSR is kind of screwed. Either they have to commission bypasses around all these small towns, or they have to use mass condemnation to widen the easements through the heart of town...
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Old January 8th, 2011, 06:14 AM   #1956
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Man, I was under the impression that this line was going to be built on a routing that would kind of parallel I-5 through the Central Valley, perhaps even using its median as ROW on some lengthy stretches, not go along an existing railroad that was never designed for operations at speeds faster than about 150 or so km/h.

How much of this is expected to go adjacent or very nearby to CA 99?

Mike
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Old January 9th, 2011, 09:12 AM   #1957
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgk920 View Post
Man, I was under the impression that this line was going to be built on a routing that would kind of parallel I-5 through the Central Valley, perhaps even using its median as ROW on some lengthy stretches, not go along an existing railroad that was never designed for operations at speeds faster than about 150 or so km/h.

How much of this is expected to go adjacent or very nearby to CA 99?

Mike

Your impression is incorrect.

No part of the rail will follow I-5. It will follow the existing BNSF ROW until Fresno, then the UP ROW (which is where the 99 is) up from there.

Just look at the route on the official website
http://www.cahighspeedrail.ca.gov/Fr...kersfield.aspx
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Old January 9th, 2011, 06:45 PM   #1958
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I'm also kind of scratching my head as to using a routing roughly along CA 14, Palmdale and Tehachapi Pass, instead of a much shorter and more direct routing via the 'Grapevine' (I-5). Were the grades, amounts of needed tunneling and messing around with the San Andreas Fault too much all together to overcome going that way?

Mike
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Old January 10th, 2011, 12:38 AM   #1959
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mika Montwald View Post
Hoping China CSR Wisely Cancel the GE - JV Deal

The World is Big --- There are so many Countries that need China CSR attention.
These other countries will pay with REAL money not the worthless USD Bald Eagle Toilet Paper.
[/B] Big Time..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................etc
...................................
Mika,
This is utter nonsense!
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Old January 10th, 2011, 01:30 AM   #1960
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I don't think its really an issue with HSR technology, there's nothing preventing the US from importing them first, learn, improve upon them and then establish American HSR technology, that is, if they are as innovative as they claim to be.

At this point the issue is very much if the line will be built at all, all the projects planned so far assumed a larger scale network to be built later, and that is very much a big question mark. Without the the large scale networks, the initial regional lines are really just bridges to nowhere.
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