daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Subways and Urban Transport

Subways and Urban Transport Metros, subways, light rail, trams, buses and other local transport systems



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old October 7th, 2005, 10:07 AM   #21
demanjo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: New South Wales
Posts: 551
Likes (Received): 0

I just found this map, (a very detailed map actually!) showing the new rail lines planned.

http://www.smh.com.au/campaignforsyd...Rail_Links.pdf

The orange areas indicate growth areas - showing the NW, SW, and the CBD-airport corridor which is undergoing alot of renewal on consolidation. The bold line is part of the current system. If you look closely at the map, you can see all the other lines throughout the city.

The map also shows realistaically the reach of the system, and it does become apparent that the NE and E suburbs do have quite a gap between themselves and a rail line. The cityrail maps are often decieving.
__________________
New South Welsh independence! (Victoria can come too)
demanjo no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old October 7th, 2005, 10:14 AM   #22
Justme
Gotta lite?
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester (Forecast: Rain)
Posts: 4,952
Likes (Received): 780

@FastWhiteTA No, it's nothing like a light rail system. It is full heavy rail with double decker trains, similar to those found in the French RER, or the German R-bahn (Although as mentioned above, it more or less resembles the German S-bahn in design). Also, as mentioned, it is not a subway, but like most European systems it travels underground in the central city where the various lines bundle together. This is an excellent way of dealing with commuter or suburban rail, as people don't have to get off at central, they can continue closer to their office or pass through the city center entirely. Only a small handful of the stations in the central area are underground and the line to the airport & Kings Cross, the rest is a standard overground railway.

As for the size of the network, actually, the map covers quite a large area which is why the network looks quite big. The cityrail network covers more than Sydney’s metropolitan area as it also includes the metropolitan area’s of Newcastle to the north, and Wollongong to the South. The portion that covers Sydney urban area and metro is quite reasonable, and in the main urban parts there are a good number of stations.

When I was living in Newtown (near the city center) There always was quite a bottle neck coming into the central station. Usually my train was stranded for 10-15minutes on sidings before Central whilst waiting for a chance to continue, although this may have improved since the new timetable change. Generally, I found the system to be quite good when I lived there, although on the longer journey’s it did pay to wait for the express train if it stopped at your station, as the general trains stop at so many stations it can force long journey’s.

There is nice history in some of the city center stations such as St. James and Museum, which were designed to look a bit like a cross between the Paris Metro & London Underground, but generally, these are the only two stations like that.
__________________
I'm doing my bit to save bandwidth by deleting my signature
Justme no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 7th, 2005, 02:55 PM   #23
AG
Registered User
 
AG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 2,070
Likes (Received): 545

Town Hall and Wynyard also somewhat resemble New York style subway stations.
AG no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 7th, 2005, 03:02 PM   #24
Justme
Gotta lite?
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester (Forecast: Rain)
Posts: 4,952
Likes (Received): 780

Quote:
Originally Posted by AG
Town Hall and Wynyard also somewhat resemble New York style subway stations.
Good point, with the steel beams they do a bit.
__________________
I'm doing my bit to save bandwidth by deleting my signature
Justme no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 7th, 2005, 08:38 PM   #25
Nick
Gosford/Sydney.
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Gosford (From Sydney)
Posts: 1,528
Likes (Received): 53

The Sydney rail system has 14 underground stations.Bondi Jucntion,Edgecliff,Kings Cross,Martin place,Central(Platform's 22 and 23),Redfern(2 platforms),Green Square,Mascot,Domestic,International,Museam,St james,Wynyard and Town Hall.

The rest(around 200 I think?) are above ground.
__________________
STOP THE NIMBYS.SUPPORT THE WATERFRONT PROJECT IN GOSFORD.
Nick no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 12:02 AM   #26
ssiguy2
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: White Rock BC
Posts: 5,404
Likes (Received): 857

It sort of sounds like commuter rail but with higher frequencies some times.
Doesn't look like it would be good for inner city transit like subways, although I understand Sydney is a very spread out city with only a few area that would genuinly be refered to as very high density.
ssiguy2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 03:26 AM   #27
AG
Registered User
 
AG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 2,070
Likes (Received): 545

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick
The Sydney rail system has 14 underground stations.Bondi Jucntion,Edgecliff,Kings Cross,Martin place,Central(Platform's 22 and 23),Redfern(2 platforms),Green Square,Mascot,Domestic,International,Museam,St james,Wynyard and Town Hall.

The rest(around 200 I think?) are above ground.
IIRC, North Sydney is also underground. There are several other stations which are built under buildings such as St. Leonards and Hurstville. After the new rail link between Epping and Chatswood is open, there will be 4 more stations that are underground (in the case of Epping it would have 2 of its 5 platforms underground).

There are several sections of the network that are very congested. The City Circle's two tracks serve two lines in an anticlockwise direction (inner track) and two lines clockwise (outer track), and during peak hour sometimes more than just those lines, and it isn't uncommon for trains to come around at 2-3 minute headways. If the City Circle somehow shuts down because of a failed train or a supposed "gas leak" as was the case in February last year, the rest of the system begins to fail to some extent.

The corridor between Central and Strathfield is the most heavily used section of line other than in the city, but it can still cause problems, even with 6 tracks. Every line other than the Illawara and ESR pass through here. If problems occur anywhere in this stretch, then the delays can pass on through to the rest of the network very quickly. It was worse before the turnback at McDonaldtown was built because there were several trains that ran express to Ashfield from the city just so that they could be turned around.

There are several other problematic parts of the network including Hornsby station.
AG no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 09:43 AM   #28
Nick
Gosford/Sydney.
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Gosford (From Sydney)
Posts: 1,528
Likes (Received): 53

Quote:
Originally Posted by ssiguy2
It sort of sounds like commuter rail but with higher frequencies some times.
Doesn't look like it would be good for inner city transit like subways, although I understand Sydney is a very spread out city with only a few area that would genuinly be refered to as very high density.
Sydney is medium to high density in the inner ciy(Newtown to Bondi,St Leonards to Green Square,about a 10km radius).You are right.A heavy rail commuter system isnt good for this part of the city.

I like Clover moore's light vision for the inner city.
__________________
STOP THE NIMBYS.SUPPORT THE WATERFRONT PROJECT IN GOSFORD.
Nick no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 09:44 AM   #29
Nick
Gosford/Sydney.
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Gosford (From Sydney)
Posts: 1,528
Likes (Received): 53

Quote:
Originally Posted by AG
IIRC, North Sydney is also underground. There are several other stations which are built under buildings such as St. Leonards and Hurstville. After the new rail link between Epping and Chatswood is open, there will be 4 more stations that are underground (in the case of Epping it would have 2 of its 5 platforms underground).

There are several sections of the network that are very congested. The City Circle's two tracks serve two lines in an anticlockwise direction (inner track) and two lines clockwise (outer track), and during peak hour sometimes more than just those lines, and it isn't uncommon for trains to come around at 2-3 minute headways. If the City Circle somehow shuts down because of a failed train or a supposed "gas leak" as was the case in February last year, the rest of the system begins to fail to some extent.

The corridor between Central and Strathfield is the most heavily used section of line other than in the city, but it can still cause problems, even with 6 tracks. Every line other than the Illawara and ESR pass through here. If problems occur anywhere in this stretch, then the delays can pass on through to the rest of the network very quickly. It was worse before the turnback at McDonaldtown was built because there were several trains that ran express to Ashfield from the city just so that they could be turned around.

There are several other problematic parts of the network including Hornsby station.
Cheers.I forgot those stations.

I guess with the opening of the Epping to Chastwood line we could add another 3 or 4
__________________
STOP THE NIMBYS.SUPPORT THE WATERFRONT PROJECT IN GOSFORD.
Nick no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 10:25 AM   #30
samsonyuen
SSLL
 
samsonyuen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Canary Wharf > CityPlace
Posts: 8,350
Likes (Received): 314

The monorail that just circles the CBD, is that something that was built for tourists, or is it heavily used? I went on it thinking, are there any non-tourists here? How successful is it, and is there going to be any expansions?
samsonyuen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 10:52 AM   #31
AG
Registered User
 
AG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 2,070
Likes (Received): 545

The monorail is by far more targeted at tourists rather than the locals. For a start, the cost to travel on the monorail is an absolute ripoff to be using as an everyday commuter. Plus it only does a loop anticlockwise from the southern CBD to Darling Harbour and back round up Pitt Street again. It was built for the 1988 bicentennial celebrations. There are no planned extensions, and if anything, is more likely to be torn down completely.
AG no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 12:24 PM   #32
samsonyuen
SSLL
 
samsonyuen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Canary Wharf > CityPlace
Posts: 8,350
Likes (Received): 314

Why should it be torn down?
samsonyuen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 04:18 PM   #33
AG
Registered User
 
AG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 2,070
Likes (Received): 545

Quote:
Originally Posted by samsonyuen
Why should it be torn down?
There are a couple of reasons I can list as to why people want it torn down. The first is because it is hardly viable to operate with so many empty seats. The second is because of the apparent blight that they leave on the streetscape, for example, Pitt Street where it runs right up against buildings and on one corner (with Market Street) right through one. IMO, it's a failed experiment.
AG no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 04:35 PM   #34
ncik
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Sydney
Posts: 254
Likes (Received): 1

Well it certainly gives Pitt Street a different (good or bad) streetscape IMO.
ncik no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2005, 06:01 PM   #35
samsonyuen
SSLL
 
samsonyuen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Canary Wharf > CityPlace
Posts: 8,350
Likes (Received): 314

So the ticket revenue isn't enough to support a seven-station line? I remember it being busy, but it was half a dozen years ago...
samsonyuen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 10th, 2005, 12:21 AM   #36
Justme
Gotta lite?
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester (Forecast: Rain)
Posts: 4,952
Likes (Received): 780

Quote:
Originally Posted by samsonyuen
So the ticket revenue isn't enough to support a seven-station line? I remember it being busy, but it was half a dozen years ago...
I'm quite fond of the monorail, but it really has to be agreed that it is simply not functional. It's effectively a train from downtown Sydney to downtown Sydney via downtown Sydney - and only goes in one direction.

It is also generally as fast to walk between any two points, taking into account the time to get to a station, wait for the next monorail, and then walk to your destination.

But for tourists walking all day in the middle of summer, the high cost and novelty maybe worth it.
__________________
I'm doing my bit to save bandwidth by deleting my signature
Justme no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 11th, 2005, 04:32 AM   #37
Nick
Gosford/Sydney.
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Gosford (From Sydney)
Posts: 1,528
Likes (Received): 53

The Monorail

Its ugly.A toy train more than anything else.

Tear it down
__________________
STOP THE NIMBYS.SUPPORT THE WATERFRONT PROJECT IN GOSFORD.
Nick no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 11th, 2005, 04:36 AM   #38
kiku99
ไทย Amazing Thailand 泰国
 
kiku99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 3,350
Likes (Received): 7

interesting topic. how about Melbourne?? the same? I am planning to go study in Aus. pretty soon. but still deciding between Syd and Mel.
__________________
'BANGKOK-THAILAND' --> Los Angeles --> Melbourne, Australia! --> & now back to amazing Bangkok, Thailand again

Bangkok Skyline Links
Thai forum | Bangkok Skyscrapers Info | Amazing Thailand | Bangkok City
kiku99 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 11th, 2005, 09:09 AM   #39
nikko
Registered Yooser
 
nikko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,456
Likes (Received): 9

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiku99
interesting topic. how about Melbourne?? the same? I am planning to go study in Aus. pretty soon. but still deciding between Syd and Mel.
Melbourne is pretty much the same, yes. It is a suburban rail system with an underground loop in the city.
__________________
See whats happening in BRISBANE!
nikko no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 11th, 2005, 09:39 AM   #40
invincible
Lurker
 
invincible's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3,804
Likes (Received): 523

Melbourne's network is more far reaching but lacks connections between lines and there's a few holes in coverage. Reliability varies depending on what line you're travelling on.

Ticketing is a whole lot simpler though - you buy a ticket for any combination of 3 zones that gives you unlimited travel within specified zones on trains, trams and buses for a set period of time (two hours, a day, week, month or year).
invincible no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
sydney, tram

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium