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Old December 12th, 2010, 12:41 AM   #1
Magnus Brage
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Headlights at daytime-negative aspects ?

I have never ever been a promoter of using headlights at daytime.

Sweden was the first nation in the world to introduce this eccentricity. This was in 1977 and I still remember it as a strange thing to see all the cars using lights in broad daylight.

Although Finland already had this law in 1972 but only in the wintertime.

Norway followed in 1986 and Denmark in 1990. After the fall of the wall, many former communist regimes also started to use lights at day.

What are the negative aspects?

*Energy consuming
*Risk of dazing especially if the road is wet, because the dipped headlights are reflected by the water.
*Tiring for the eyes
*Turn signals are less seen if headlights are on.
*It would be easier to spot motorcycles if only they were priviliged to use daytime lights.
*Rear lights will also be in use although without necessity.

*So if DRL is supposed to be an advantage why did Austria cancel their rules about DRL?

I have seen that DRL are used in countries where it's not compulsory. This is
mostly in Germany and Holland.

When I last visited NL I would estimate the use of DRL to about 20-30% of cars. In Germany this is less common maybe 10-15% of cars, higher use on the motorways. In Italy also as in NL within cities although not compulsary.

In Italy where it's compulsory on rural road, still use is definately not 100% as in Sweden. Italians tend to disobey trafficrules.

In France I saw few cars using DRL, also french motorists tend to switch on their headlights late in the evening.

In Russia (as always) its a mess. Many newer luxury cars uses DRL all the time, probably to show that they're more important than others. "Get out of the way attitude" At the same time old zhiguli-cars use headlights only when it's pitch dark. In town parklights will do, quite common to see cars at night with no lights at all.

Solution: No compulsory DRL-law but All new cars should be equipped with small LED-lights as the type newer Audi-cars use. Those lights are less disturbing and less energy consuming, still they mark a car in motion which could be an advantage if the vehicle is not seen in daylight because of shadows from surounding trees for exemple.

Question: People in countries with no DRL-rules. If you buy a new Audi do you disconnect the DRL-LED-lights or do these cars come to your country with LED's that dont automatically light up when you start the car?

Last edited by Magnus Brage; December 12th, 2010 at 12:47 AM.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 12:47 AM   #2
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I usually have my lights on at daytime, and so does the majority of the Dutch drivers, I assume around 60 - 70% of them. It's not to see but to be seen. I don't want somebody's passing action run sour if they crash into me. The most popular car color is gray. This is especially a color you cannot see as well as bright yellow or red. Also note there are many people on the road who do not have a good eyesight as most people, especially with the aging, yet mobile population. Lights are not only for the night, but also during adverse weather conditions. I've seen numerous people who still have no lights on during heavy rain or snowfall.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 01:08 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I usually have my lights on at daytime, and so does the majority of the Dutch drivers, I assume around 60 - 70% of them. l.
I disagree, maybe 60-70% on motorways but on the countryside and in town
(Limburg area) I saw that the majority of cars were not using headlights in the summerdays, I would say maximum use of DRL about every 4th or 5th car and I really counted.


I see a car even if no headlights are used, this is of course in broad

daylight, at dusk/dawn & rain headlights should certanly be used -no doubt about that.

I think that headlights are overkill at daytime but LEDs at daytime are usefull still not disturbing, the best ones are those of newer MB's with lower position than on the Audis.


One good thing about the new LEDs on MB's are that they are turned on without rear lights, which is splendid and even permitted in Sweden but...

despite that many swedish drivers still tend to switch on their headlights !!


Question: So do your headlights turn on automatically at start?

When did this phenonema reach the NL ?

Last edited by Magnus Brage; December 12th, 2010 at 02:15 AM.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 01:24 AM   #4
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In Canada DRLs are mandatory on all cars made since 1990. They turn on automatically when the car is started, but not the rear lights. I personally find them very useful most of the time, especially in the winter when contrast is low and, as Chris said, lots of cars here are also in various shades of gray.

Because of the DRLs that are always on, I only turn my headlights on during the day when there is poor visibility due to weather conditions.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 01:24 AM   #5
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I turn on the lights quite automatically, wherever I drive, though it is said that in Germany with lights on, the police has simpler job of selecting the foreign cars, especially the czech ones by the border, as in CZ it is compulsory. And they like to check foreign cars in Germany ...
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Old December 12th, 2010, 01:26 AM   #6
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All new cars sold in the U.S. have them built in. Studies have shown they reduce traffic accidents.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 01:32 AM   #7
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It's not more energy consuming using headlights during day. The energy used for the headlights would have otherwise just been "wasted", as the engine transformer produces an excess amount of energy.

As for your second argument, if you are dazed from light hitting a pool of water during daytime, you really shouldn't be driving. Neither should you if you can't spot a motorcycle in broad daylight.

I don't get why all countries don't use DLR.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 04:04 AM   #8
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Mandatory lighting during the daytime causes higher risk of hitting cyclists and bikers. (Many drivers claim not seeing the bike or bicycle on the road) As for bikers there is an easy and effective solution, however it is officialy illegal - using the full beam during the daylight. For cyclists there is no hope, just to take to take higher risk as fact.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 04:16 AM   #9
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I have been using dipped headlights in daytime hours for about 10 years. When I first started doing so many other drivers would flash their lights at me (thinking I had my lights on by mistake!).

Nowadays the majority of Irish drivers also use daytime lights.

It's now even officially encouraged by the Road Safety Authority....

http://rsa.ie/RSA/Road-Safety/Campai...unning-lights/
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Old December 12th, 2010, 04:19 AM   #10
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I use day lights all the time, regardless of weather or so, for the same reasons as Chris: it makes me easier to be seen and I try to practice defensive driving because while I consider myself a good driver, I also want to be able to reduce risks of incidents due to other, more reckless or impaired drivers or pedestrians than me.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 06:57 AM   #11
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I drive a 2001 Toyota Corolla which is equiped with daytime running lights. Overall it's a nice feature since the headlights automatically adjust to daylight/weather conditions. I am not sure why other cars are not equiped for them.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 09:26 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus Brage View Post
I have never ever been a promoter of using headlights at daytime.

Sweden was the first nation in the world to introduce this eccentricity. This was in 1977 and I still remember it as a strange thing to see all the cars using lights in broad daylight.

Although Finland already had this law in 1972 but only in the wintertime.

Norway followed in 1986 and Denmark in 1990. After the fall of the wall, many former communist regimes also started to use lights at day.

What are the negative aspects?

*Energy consuming
*Risk of dazing especially if the road is wet, because the dipped headlights are reflected by the water.
*Tiring for the eyes
*Turn signals are less seen if headlights are on.
*It would be easier to spot motorcycles if only they were priviliged to use daytime lights.
*Rear lights will also be in use although without necessity.

*So if DRL is supposed to be an advantage why did Austria cancel their rules about DRL?

I have seen that DRL are used in countries where it's not compulsory. This is
mostly in Germany and Holland.

When I last visited NL I would estimate the use of DRL to about 20-30% of cars. In Germany this is less common maybe 10-15% of cars, higher use on the motorways. In Italy also as in NL within cities although not compulsary.

In Italy where it's compulsory on rural road, still use is definately not 100% as in Sweden. Italians tend to disobey trafficrules.

In France I saw few cars using DRL, also french motorists tend to switch on their headlights late in the evening.

In Russia (as always) its a mess. Many newer luxury cars uses DRL all the time, probably to show that they're more important than others. "Get out of the way attitude" At the same time old zhiguli-cars use headlights only when it's pitch dark. In town parklights will do, quite common to see cars at night with no lights at all.

Solution: No compulsory DRL-law but All new cars should be equipped with small LED-lights as the type newer Audi-cars use. Those lights are less disturbing and less energy consuming, still they mark a car in motion which could be an advantage if the vehicle is not seen in daylight because of shadows from surounding trees for exemple.

Question: People in countries with no DRL-rules. If you buy a new Audi do you disconnect the DRL-LED-lights or do these cars come to your country with LED's that dont automatically light up when you start the car?
In South Africa you do not have to use DRL but a campaign is currently ongoing to try to get people to use it. Recently on the busy freeway between Johannesburg to Durban signs were shown at all the toll gates to switch on the lights and it was found that accidents reduced by more than 70%. Even in South Africa with bright days all year round it make perfect sense to use it. A lot of people being killed on the roads are pedestrians and the lights reduce pedestrians being injured or killed by a very big margin.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 09:33 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus Brage View Post

Solution: No compulsory DRL-law but All new cars should be equipped with small LED-lights as the type newer Audi-cars use. Those lights are less disturbing and less energy consuming, still they mark a car in motion which could be an advantage if the vehicle is not seen in daylight because of shadows from surounding trees for exemple.

Question: People in countries with no DRL-rules. If you buy a new Audi do you disconnect the DRL-LED-lights or do these cars come to your country with LED's that dont automatically light up when you start the car?
Your solution is actually already being implemented in the European Union. All new cars sold from 1st of January 2011 must be equipped with DRL's. All (or at least almost all?) car manufacturers are doing this with 'Audi-style LED lights'.

The DRL's of modern cars are not disabled in countries with no DRL legislation.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 09:51 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koloite View Post
Your solution is actually already being implemented in the European Union. All new cars sold from 1st of January 2011 must be equipped with DRL's. All (or at least almost all?) car manufacturers are doing this with 'Audi-style LED lights'.
Do you have a link to more info on this.?

I found this map on current rules in the EU, and according to that, DRL´s are prohibited in Greeze, until newyear.:



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Last edited by Fender56; December 12th, 2010 at 10:12 AM.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 10:29 AM   #15
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this map is very wrong. Hungary has mandatory headlights, they have been one of the first countries who introduced it in 90es. In Croatia it is mandatory during the winter period.

personally, I am strong supporter of that idea. i find all those premises such as energy waste, dazing etc just the platitudes when we compare it to better visibility
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Old December 12th, 2010, 10:48 AM   #16
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To all of you that are against DRL: I have seen many cars that didn't have their lights turned on on major national roads and accidents do happen because of this (when you try to overtake a slower vehicle it's much easier to see if a car comes from the other way if it has the lights on). Also, when you want to overtake a slower vehicle on the motorway first thing you do is to look in the left mirror to see if another car is comming from behind. If it has the lights on you spot it very easy, but if they aren't on you might not see it in time and cause an accident...

In Romania is necessary to turn the lights on only if you are driving on a major road (DN - national road). I always turn my lights on when I leave the streets of my town or during bad weather.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 03:28 PM   #17
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I am wondering where Estonia took of to...
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Old December 12th, 2010, 03:32 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fender56 View Post


What the hell happened to Estonia on that map?

Anyway,I can't see anything bad with using headlights during day. Especially considering that I live in country which has 3-5h of 'daylight' for nearly half year (a soggy grey and dim weather fo most of autumn & winter) and ever changing weather - rain,snow,fog etc.

Only problem it can create,is in autumn when wet roads tend to reflect lights. But still,it's smth you can get used to. On good side - it considerably raises safety for both you & others by making you car more visible. And that simply rules out all bad aspects of headlights usage during daytime.
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Old December 12th, 2010, 03:43 PM   #19
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Quote:
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this map is very wrong. Hungary has mandatory headlights, they have been one of the first countries who introduced it in 90es. In Croatia it is mandatory during the winter period.

personally, I am strong supporter of that idea. i find all those premises such as energy waste, dazing etc just the platitudes when we compare it to better visibility
It's mandatory only outside settlements, so the map is correct about Hungary.

But prohibited in Greece?
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Old December 12th, 2010, 03:48 PM   #20
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if your Headlights at daytime are switched off -negative aspects is 60 euro fine by police

Slovakia - mandatory all year long!
(law is already 2 years in force)
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