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Old October 22nd, 2012, 04:08 PM   #361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435
Saudia still has 14 777-300ERs on order. They have 2 versions, 1 with 305 seats and 1 with 413 seats. Their 747s, both -300 and -400 have around 350 seats, it seems like the 777 will be their replacement for the 747.

The 777-300ER seems together with the A380 the best replacement for the 747-400s. When the A350-1000 and the 777X will hit the market they will also eat into the sales of the 747-8.

So it remains to be seen how many orders the 747-8I will get. There have potential customers like Philippine Airlines and Turkish Airlines this year, but they are still undecided about an order. Hong Kong Airlines have been rumored behind a undisclosed commitment from China last year, but it doesn't look like they will turn it into an actual order since the airline isn't doing that great.

That leaves Delta and United, they could buy it but it doesn't look like both will make a VLA order soon. And more smaller airlines that want to have a new large airplane without having to wait several years.

When the cargo market picks up again it will always remain one of the best planes out there, especially with the front loading that makes big loads possible. But even then it faces stiff competition from the 777F and later from the possible freight variants of the 777X and the A350.
Ah interesting. SV usually sends its B747s to South and Southeast Asia because it carries a lot of passengers... But to replace them with the 77W seems to be a good change. Also, PAL might get the 747-8 because it will replace its 744s, but TK? Hmmm...

And what does a VLA order mean?
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Old October 22nd, 2012, 06:12 PM   #362
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VLA = Very Large Aircraft.

It's a term used for the B747 and the A380.
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Old October 22nd, 2012, 11:23 PM   #363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
VLA = Very Large Aircraft.

It's a term used for the B747 and the A380.
And the A340΄s and 777΄s?
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Old October 23rd, 2012, 12:35 AM   #364
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Usually the term is only used for aircraft that at least one step bigger then the 777 or A340.
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Old October 24th, 2012, 01:58 PM   #365
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Yesterday Lufthansa took delivery of their 4th 747-8I, D-ABYF.

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Lufthansa D-ABYF Boeing 747-8 Intercontinental Delivery Flight by moonm, on Flickr

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Lufthansa D-ABYF Boeing 747-8 Intercontinental Delivery Flight by moonm, on Flickr

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Lufthansa D-ABYF Boeing 747-8 Intercontinental Delivery Flight by moonm, on Flickr
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Old October 24th, 2012, 08:09 PM   #366
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That's a gracious departure for Germany indeed. So will the B748 replace the B744s in the long term?
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Old October 24th, 2012, 08:22 PM   #367
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The 747-8 would sell reasonably well if Boeing was allowed to build '747-8 combis' but the FAA sadly doesn't give out certificates to combis anymore.
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Old October 24th, 2012, 08:28 PM   #368
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I didn't know that. I remember some 744s were built as Combis... But not anymore with the 748s? Awww, looks like the 748 will be built with two versions instead of 3.
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Old October 25th, 2012, 01:29 AM   #369
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Lufthansa's livery looks best on the 7478 so far.
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Old October 25th, 2012, 02:28 PM   #370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
So will the B748 replace the B744s in the long term?
With respect to Lufthansa, yes they will
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Old October 26th, 2012, 09:50 AM   #371
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Old October 27th, 2012, 04:28 PM   #372
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Old October 28th, 2012, 12:23 AM   #373
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Quote:
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too bad there are only two airlines who ordered the 747-8i




source: boeing-747.com and key.aero
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Old October 28th, 2012, 12:47 AM   #374
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What do you mean? Those are 747-400D
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Old October 28th, 2012, 01:21 AM   #375
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I think what he meant was that hopefully, either JL or NH will order the 747-8s because both carriers carry thousands of domestic passengers every single day.
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Old October 28th, 2012, 08:24 AM   #376
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Those B747 have their winglets cut off, and have a few other modifications for short range, with a high amount of passengers, I see its unlikely they will get an aircraft for long range... JAL wants to be a regional airline, and got rid of their B747 fleet as well. There is really no predictability to who will order, and who will not, unless you work for that airline, and know their future plans really well.
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Old October 28th, 2012, 09:05 AM   #377
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that's so true. It seems like JL or NH will stick to their 777s (especially JL retired all of its 747s after 40+ years in service in 2010) because those are more fuel-efficient. It remains to be seen if either Japanese airline will resume 747 operations, though, given the large demand of domestic passengers.
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Old October 28th, 2012, 10:55 AM   #378
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If JAL or ANA buy the 747-8 it will be for intercontinental flights, just to have a bigger plane to get more passengers with their low density lay-outs. With their seat numbers a twin engine aircraft as the 777-300ER could easily be still more economical then a bigger 747-8. It's not really a surprising that their current intercontinental expansion is based on the 777 - 787 combination. And it does seem to do the job rather well, since JAL came out of bankruptcy protection it has come out much stronger and is quickly rebuilding it's international network with new destinations as Boston, San Diego and Helsinki and has plans to open several more European destinations with the 787.

I don't see a domestic use of the 747-8, simply because it will be to big. The 747-400D that still fly for ANA can fit 565 passengers, but still the gates only open around 15-10 minutes before the departure. Even bigger planes, the 747-8 would have more then 600 seats, would also mean longer boarding times. This would mean that the plane would stand longer on the ground making it less economical especially with the short flights. And then again, a 747-8D with 620 seats might be less economical per seat then a 420 seat 787-10.
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Old October 28th, 2012, 11:09 AM   #379
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Ah, very interesting. So it seems like the 748 will be out of the picture for either NH or JL (although NH still operates the 744D), but I still am looking forward to either airline continuing the tradition of using 747s. Yet, again, it seems like the winners are the 777s and 787s, which I find more aesthetically sound and graceful than the 748. No offense, I really love the 747s, 777s, and 787s, but in consideration of carbon emissions, the 777s and 787s are definitely great choices.
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Old October 28th, 2012, 11:26 AM   #380
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It does indeed looks like that when ANA retires their 747-400Ds in 2015 the only Japanese airline that will be flying the 747 will be NCA.

And since they have 13 747-8Fs on order they will probably fly the 747 well into the next decade.

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NCA Nippon Cargo JA13KZ Boeing 747-8 Freighter by moonm, on Flickr
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