ATLANTA - New Falcons Stadium (65,000)

[KingmanIII]

Originally Posted by joezierer

The Georgia Dome is never getting a Super Bowl again. No amount of reonvations will fix that. The NFL likes shiny new places.

Does ATL even need the Super Bowl, and would it be anywhere near a break-even R.O.I. for a billion-dollar stadium?

Look at what good it did Jacksonville...

[KingmanIII]

Originally Posted by royal rose1

I will do neither because
a) I have no interest in putting together 1 billion dollars to build a stadium in Atlanta of all cities, especially when my hometown of San Diego needs one more.
b) I don't live there so I don't have to move, and I have no intention of living in Atlanta ever. I live in Raleigh now, and even this is too "southern" for me.

So why are you so concerned with them building a stadium when they already have one that was recently upgraded, is nearly paid off, is centrally located and has no trouble attracting marquee events?

[rantanamo]

Originally Posted by royal rose1

I know, but I consider grasslands, or land without trees or with few trees to be desert. I was born in San Diego and it seems to be borderline desert, only brush there, no trees, except for the non-native eucalyptus, and the rare torey pine.

Anyway, here's a map of US desert, most of texas seems to be desert by this.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=map+o...39&tx=52&ty=77

That's ridiculous because the type of grasslands in Texas are nothing like the areas around San Diego. They are actually lush with tall grasses and anywhere there is water, there are lots of trees, even forests. Nothing like a desert. The only part of Texas that is desert is the part labelled Big Bend Country, and even that is very mountainous and the extreme western part of the Panhandle. So maybe the western 1/5 of the state.

As for the stadium, what is the ownership and revenue agreement like between the team owner and the owner of the Georgia Dome? There's a always a better way to make money out of the stadium itself, and that's what NFL owners get to keep for themselves. So what's the agreement? Is it a lease? Are they losing out on parking or vending contracts or somesuch?

[WesTexas]

Originally Posted by royal rose1

I know, but I consider grasslands, or land without trees or with few trees to be desert. I was born in San Diego and it seems to be borderline desert, only brush there, no trees, except for the non-native eucalyptus, and the rare torey pine.

Anyway, here's a map of US desert, most of texas seems to be desert by this.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=map+o...39&tx=52&ty=77

The only parts of Texas that are Dessert is around Midland and Odessa.

Back to the Stadium. Georgia Dome is fine, this is all talk and if it happened, everyone would be like....what?

[Topher51]

Originally Posted by royal rose1

I know, but I consider grasslands, or land without trees or with few trees to be desert. I was born in San Diego and it seems to be borderline desert, only brush there, no trees, except for the non-native eucalyptus, and the rare torey pine.

Anyway, here's a map of US desert, most of texas seems to be desert by this.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=map+o...39&tx=52&ty=77

According to that map, the entire Rocky Mountain region is desert. That map is ridiculous. Do you consider Tundra to be desert too?

[massp88]

I don't understand why more owners don't simply build their own stadiums. Bob Kraft did it with Gillette and they get to control the revenues from Patriots games as well as concerts and other sporting events held at the stadium.

[BoulderGrad]

Originally Posted by massp88

I don't understand why more owners don't simply build their own stadiums. Bob Kraft did it with Gillette and they get to control the revenues from Patriots games as well as concerts and other sporting events held at the stadium.

Because most teams get the same revenue control on tax payer financed stadiums. They just get to avoid that whole pesky deal of paying for them. Some teams even get paid for taking tax payer money.

[rantanamo]

Originally Posted by massp88

I don't understand why more owners don't simply build their own stadiums. Bob Kraft did it with Gillette and they get to control the revenues from Patriots games as well as concerts and other sporting events held at the stadium.

because for what Kraft paid you can get a much better stadium that can host 5x as many events and control certain types of revenue in them.

[Jim856796]

What if the Falcons moved somewhere else if this proposed white elephant stadium did not get built? If that had happened, all Atlanta would have are the Braves and the Hawks?

[JJG]

Originally Posted by Jim856796

What if the Falcons moved somewhere else if this proposed white elephant stadium did not get built? If that had happened, all Atlanta would have are the Braves and the Hawks?

Oh, that's not happening....

[joezierer]

Originally Posted by Jim856796

What if the Falcons moved somewhere else if this proposed white elephant stadium did not get built? If that had happened, all Atlanta would have are the Braves and the Hawks?

The Falcons are one of the few teams in NFL history who haven't threatened to move. Nevermind they played at Fulton County for 20+ years, I think they can survive playing in the Dome for a while.

[rantanamo]

yeah, probably not moving. Too much of a regional fanbase and probably making decent revenue. That's not always a promise, even in LA since the revenue rules are so strict in the NFL.

[massp88]

Originally Posted by rantanamo

because for what Kraft paid you can get a much better stadium that can host 5x as many events and control certain types of revenue in them.

How do you figure Kraft could have had a better stadium for the money he paid? A roof would have increased the price and he did not want one on the stadium. Kraft controls everything in his stadium and the surrounding developments.

[GaForce]

Originally Posted by KingmanIII

Has RG even been back to the Dome since they renovated it?

I believe he visited here last season during a Thursday Night game. He stated in no uncertain terms that the facility as in its current state was not up to Super Bowl standards and that the Falcons either need to A. Build a new one or B. Have a massive renovation of the Dome.

Here's the thing no one is talking about. I believe it would be in the Falcons' best interest to have a stadium that is fully enclosed or that has a retractable option. Some Fans down here mostly come to these games and treat it as a fashion show (women wearing club attire, heels,etc.) Most Atlantans today for the most part want no parts of an outdoor game in December with temps in the low 40's. The stadium would be about 70% full. That's just facts. Some come to the games knowing the place is enclosed and are not your typical die hards you see in Pittsburgh or Green Bay.

The other thing that makes me think an outdoor stadium is not a good idea is that there is no guarantee it would bring a Super Bowl to town. Houston arguably had the most impressive stadium in the NFL before Jerry World was built and they still havent the big game since 2004 and it doesn't look like they'll be getting it anytime soon. With Atlanta's so so winter weather, an outdoor Super Bowl here might be a bad look for the NFL.

[KingmanIII]

Originally Posted by GaForce

I believe he visited here last season during a Thursday Night game. He stated in no uncertain terms that the facility as in its current state was not up to Super Bowl standards

Yet the Superdome is?

Even after the upgrade it isn't much nicer than ATL's.

[rantanamo]

Originally Posted by massp88

How do you figure Kraft could have had a better stadium for the money he paid? A roof would have increased the price and he did not want one on the stadium. Kraft controls everything in his stadium and the surrounding developments.

From the NFL, he can only make revenues from certain things in and around the stadium. The rest goes to the league no matter what he controls in the stadium. Without a roof for the winter, he loses out on some events that are required to be indoors. Even if he had a partnership with a public entity, he would still likely have a revenue agreement and make money off of events that he simply can't host without it.

To put it differently, let's say Jerruh and Kraft pay the same amount for a stadium and get similar stadiums. Both get club seat revenues, suite revenues, name licensing/stadium sponsors and parking revenue. Jerruh gives up a little rent for a specified amount of time, non-league vending revenue and non-premises parking to Arlington in a deal for Arlington to add a roof, covered concourses a more luxurious finish out including twice as many suites. Now, Kraft and Jerruh have paid for similar stadiums, and get to take home similar revenue. The difference is with what Arlington has kicked in to add to the stadium, there will be events year round of all kinds that can get Jerruh more of that revenue that Kraft never even gets to see from the stadium itself. And we're talking some doozies like Final Fours, Boxing matches, Super Bowl. This is why you see these chances taken.

[GunnerJacket]

By all accounts the Super Bowl hardly seems worth the worry in this equation. Atlanta as a climate and a city isn't going to be included in the list of regular hosts unless more of the other favored locales (SD, Miami, NO) continue to let their facilities fall into disrepair. Houston, Dallas and Phoenix will host their fair shares, each respective new and up-to-date venue will get the occassional nod, and then the social hot spots will get their turn. At best ATL would be looking at once every 10-15 years, possibly longer as each new venue gets nicer and nicer.

As such, I fail to see how much nicer a Falcons stadium would have to be. I keep hearing about an upgrade in premium seating, but can't imagine what those upgrades would need to be that would necessitate a totally new venue! My only conclusion is that the logistics and costs of renovations are (being purported to be) far more egregious than we assume.

[Deebo.]

i use to like the falcons when they had michael vick....now they have this soft ass QB matty ice

I glad for the organization having a brand new stadium...georgia dome is mad ugly

[joezierer]

Mike Vick was terrible so congratulations of having terrible taste.

[WesTexas]

@GunnerJacket. The Mercedes Super Dome just underwent a HUGE renovation. Also Miami is planning a large renovation for this off season now that it is just a football stadium.