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Old April 7th, 2011, 01:51 PM   #161
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It is nice. Warsaw might have been stunning in the event that they reconstructed all those elderly, stunning buildings. A number of those commie replacements are to make your eyes bleed.
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Old April 7th, 2011, 03:18 PM   #162
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Not all of this "elderly" buildings were really that stunning, or old at that time. XIX century architecture wasn't considered precious and worthy of reconstruction or even protection.
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Old April 7th, 2011, 10:32 PM   #163
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Warsaw Building Typologies

A lot of Warsaw's pre-war built form was not stunning but just regular mostly plain 4/5 story tenements with standard articulation of cornices and windows and while today we may value them for their age they were so commonplace before the war that a modern building would actually stand out more. Tthere were a lot of masterpieces of this type of kamienice (tenement) building that were indeed lost though.

What we see in Warsaw today is a combination of: surviving intact historic buildings (modernist, beaux-arts, secession, neo-styles); buildings that have been painstaking restored/rebuilt based on their pre-war appearance; buildings stripped of their pre-war glory; buildings rebuilt with a socialist realist nuance; massive classically proportioned socialist realist and Stalinist baroque edifices, stylish elegant moderns and drab commie blocks and of course a hodgepodge of new construction mostly good. Employing the broadest definition of the definition of survived about 40-45% of pre-war Warsaw survived.

Now when you look at the inventory of buildings before you as categorized above, imagine that pre-war Warsaw had 95 km2 of blocks of buildings with the assortment below and it may lend credence to the legend that Warsaw was the Paris (or one of) of the east. Paris had and still has 144 km2 of such built-form, elegant, grand but not as varied or old as Warsaw's was as much of it was built under the unifying eye of Haussman and he wiped out streets of ancient buildings (except Ile St. Louis and Ile de al Cite) in his late 18th century version of urban renewal, a grand and beautifully realized vision.

These were very common:







These were the masterpieces that are gone forever (maybe?)









Many beautiful buildings that did survive suffered the following fate, stripped of all detail for ideologiocal and aesthetic reasons

Before



After




Before



After



Before




After



Before



After



Before



After



Before



After



Before



After (the owner wants to restore the original but the current conservator forbids it)



Before



After



Pre war modernism – Warsaw has an impressive legacy of intact pre-war modern that were not targeted for destruction by Einzatzgruppen because they were not deemed to have much historic/cultural value then.



























































Historic Buildings Restored with Socreal Nuances or Socreal Buildings Posing as Historic:

















Socialist Realism (Classical Proportions, details and contextual, from ornate to more modern versions)

















Post-war moderns and commieblocks (Devoid of details, pre-fab constructed, skyscrapers-in-the park siting).

Ugly commie blocks with colourful makeovers are common in outlying areas and even where they are least welcome in historic areas


















Ugly commieblocks although in scale with context , do not respect streetwalls and stick out like sore thumbs





WTF!



Tasteful post-war modern – abundant in Warsaw















Beauties that Survived the War – Just a Taste, See More Below (thanks drugastrona)









Come on take it off, stop teasing



This pic provides a true microcosm of Warsaw, 1/3 ruins hoping for restoration, 1/3 beautifully restored (I would say as much as 45% of historic) and 1/3 post war modern/commieblock/socreal



Thanks very much filoss and drugstrona for so many amazing pics.
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Warsaw Post-War Reconstruction to Present

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Old April 7th, 2011, 11:08 PM   #164
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Current Restoration Trends - Good and Bad

Thermomodernization/thermodevastation (the only way most coops can get money to renovate their buildings and reduce heating costs) flattens building facades obliterating shadow lines and details



[IMG]http://i54.************/2iogo3.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i51.************/2q2nxn6.jpg[/IMG]







Current Restoration Project Highlights

Complete restorations









Revitalization of Prozna Begins

Now


After Restoration



This project is being held up due to objections by the conservator for the last few years

The developer is seeking to restore both buildings and the earliest version of the building to the left



This is how this looks like now and will most likely remain so.



A modern attic was added here









A kamienica with a modern addition





The base of the modern building to the right sits on a reconstructed historic facade. In keeping with the conservators penchant for sign of the times elements, the historic building was rebuilt with pre-cast elements





Adding a modern attic to an old building to help pay for restorations











Revival of pre-war grandeur on Flora Street where all buildings have been restored



Details are coming back



image hosted on flickr



Revival of ground floor retail throughout Warsaw will bring new life to the city - the most important trend in Warsaw's renaissance







Whitewashes with some restoration of pre-war detail ( a few examples)





[IMG]









image hosted on flickr




Hybridization – transforming pre-war landmarks into contemporary buildings

This pre war survived almost intact:



Modified by communists postwar



Modified by current conservator into this



This building looked like the one next door







Building footprint, massing and silhouette somewhat restored without details and original materials (*The current conservator favours this approach because the buildings reflect the current time period while paying homage to the past, unfortunately this concept does not always work in real life)

Before



After



Historicist-Modernist Combos



Buildings restored while preserving pre-war scars



Bulletholes under glass (place of mass executions)



Ochota district undergoing massive facelift



Future Needs

Restoration of Warsaw’s Right Bank untouched by War but deteriorating through neglect









Landmarks being allowed to crumble





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Warsaw Post-War Reconstruction to Present

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Old April 7th, 2011, 11:44 PM   #165
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Great posts, thanks.
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Old April 9th, 2011, 10:40 PM   #166
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Thanks for visiting, should have some more pics later in the week.
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Old April 10th, 2011, 03:02 AM   #167
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Urbanista1!!!Great history lesson about Warsaw!
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Old April 10th, 2011, 06:59 AM   #168
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Thank you, coming from you it's a compliment indeed
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Old April 10th, 2011, 08:09 AM   #169
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Great updates!
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Old April 11th, 2011, 06:26 AM   #170
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Gorgeous city The restorations and reconstructions are fantastic. In 5-10 years, Warsaw will surely be able to bring all of it old beauty, plus several modern additions that will make the city that much nicer
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Old April 11th, 2011, 08:11 AM   #171
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Warsaw looks stunning and a place I must visit!
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Old April 12th, 2011, 01:25 AM   #172
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It's a very intriguing city - you won't get bored and the locals are friendly
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Old April 12th, 2011, 04:02 AM   #173
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Love this thread! I have to say - people really hate on Socialist Realism but honestly, it's such an intriguing building style. It's definitely part of the "experience" of Warsaw as a destination. I think people are starting to get it.

I can't wait to visit after almost 12 years. I'm staying at the Hotel Grand in Krucza and hitting up Plac Konstytucji and Mariensztat
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Old April 12th, 2011, 06:12 AM   #174
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12 years, wow! well you will see lots of little changes, pockets of big changes, there is a new town of Wilanow near Wilanow palace (like Don Mills) and a whole new neighbourhood of offices and lofts (just a few so far ) around Domianewska Street, a number of new museums. I am also so drawn to Warsaw for reasons I still can't divine, maybe it's because my ancestors are buried somewhere under those streets and they're calling to me, those spirits, that history still somehow electrifies this place, maybe it's because I love the process of creating life, the urban synergy that transforms spaces into places, that is happening in Warsaw, but not fast enough for my imagination.

But I digress, I think Krucza is so cool, I will have to throw in a few Krucza before and afters for your trip. When are you going?
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Old April 12th, 2011, 03:24 PM   #175
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Related music vid:
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Old April 12th, 2011, 06:10 PM   #176
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Great video, thanks for sharing
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Old April 12th, 2011, 07:57 PM   #177
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Found this interesting and witty article comparing Warsaw and Krakow in the Guardian

Warsaw, Krakow … which is in pole position?

Krakow and Warsaw both have plenty to recommend them, so which to choose for a cool urban break? Experts from each city argue their case

Share284 Jamie Stokes and Dana Dramowicz
The Guardian, Saturday 9 April 2011 Article history
Friendly rivalry … Warsaw's old town and the Alchemia bar in Krakow. Photograph: Getty; Alamy
Krakow

Jamie Stokes, managing editor of the Krakow Post (krakowpost.com): OK, so Guardian readers want to know which city they should choose to visit in Poland. You and I both know that the capital is a dreary, grey place with zero charm. Krakow is much lovelier, but how can I make them understand?

Warsaw

Dana Dramowicz, editor of Warsaw Life (warsaw-life.com): It appears that your time living in the granny capital of Poland has clouded your judgment. While Krakow clings to its past, endlessly patting itself on the back for ancient achievements, Warsaw is speeding forward, creating a thriving metropolis of business and culture. Warsaw has loads more to offer. And while we may have more traffic (after all, this is a proper city, instead of just an expanded village), it is hardly the "big smoke".

Krakow, JS: OK, I'll give you that – Krakow is compact compared with the Warsaw sprawl. The reason you have all that traffic is because the few things worth seeing are so scattered. In Krakow, if you're not willing to walk the 30 minutes it takes to get anywhere, you can take one of our fabulously modern trams. The last time I was on a Warsaw tram it was so old the driver had to keep getting out to feed the horse.

Warsaw, DD: How could I forget about your revolutionary tram technology! In Warsaw, though, we do have this other modern marvel of science called a subway. In two years, we'll have a new metro line connecting the east and west corners of the city. The brand new National Stadium (stadionnarodowy.org.pl) on al. Ksiecia J.Poniatowskiego, will open in June, in preparation for the Euro 2012 football championship (that seems to have passed you by as well). By 2016 our already extraordinary collection of private galleries and national art museums will be joined by a cutting-edge Modern Art Museum (artmuseum.pl). I think I'd be correct in thinking the most exciting new additions to Krakow's public spaces are a pair of renovated roundabouts?

Rynek Underground, Krakow. Krakow, JS: We have some stuff going on underground too. The archaeology museum, the size of three football pitches, is under our main square (that would be the largest and most perfectly preserved medieval square in Europe). If the thousand years of history above ground aren't enough, you can get in a lift and go back another millennium: Rynek Underground, (mhk.pl/oddzialy/podziemia_rynku). It is probably the most startling museum in Europe right now, with its glass-bottomed footbridge over medieval architecture dating back to the 12th century. The other thing we keep underground is the wildest, hippest pub and club scene in Central Europe. I'd love to enumerate the subterranean drinking and raving dens in cellars within a kilometre of the city centre, but nobody really knows. I'll just mention the Nic Nowego bar (ul. Sw. Krzyza 15, +48 12 421 6188, nicnowego.com) and Alchemia (ul. Estery 5, +48 12 421 2200; alchemia.com.pl), a pub with Narnia-style wardrobes and live music, and leave it at that. There are what, two or three great partying places in Warsaw?

Hydrozagakda club, Warsaw. Warsaw, DD: Hardly! We locals like to start our weekend at a pawilony, a series of secret bars hidden behind ul. Nowy Swiat. All doors are unmarked, and nearly every bar is a tiny, two-floor enclave with no more than 10 tables (try Pewex or Klaps for a little more space). For live music and DJs, I go to clubs such as Hydrozagadka (hydrozagadka.waw.pl) on ul. 11 Listopada, 1500m2 Do Wynajecia (1500m2.blogspot.com) on ul. Solec, or Cafe Kulturalna (kulturalna.pl) on Plac Defilad. At some point, a shot of vodka and a slurp of herring (costing less than £1) must be ingested at the communist-style Przekaski Zakaski bar on the corner of Krakowskie Przedmiescie. And if we're still standing, we head to the best after-hours party in Poland, Luzztro (luztro.pl) to dance well into Sunday afternoon.

For a calmer adventure, Warsaw has several new, interactive museums. The Chopin Museum (chopin.museum) and the Copernicus Science Centre (kopernik.org.pl) are popular with families, and the Warsaw Rising Museum (1944.pl) tells the incredible story of the Polish resistance during Nazi occupation.

Krakow, JS: We've got museums and galleries coming out of our ears: the National Museum on al. 3 Maja (muzeum.krakow.pl) alone has 21 branches in Krakow, including the newly renovated gallery of 19th- century Polish art and the new Schindler Factory museum on ul. Lipowa (mhk.pl/oddzialy/fabryka_schindlera) in Oskar Schindler's original premises.

The sheer diversity and density of restaurants, bars, music venues and hangouts in Krakow is unmatched. You can have a civilised meal at Wierzynek (Rynek Glowny, +48 12 424 9600, wierzynek.com.pl), which has been going since the 14th century; excellent sushi at Edo Sushi Bar (ul. Bozego Ciala 3, +48 12 422 2424, edosushi.pl) in the old Jewish quarter; great Mexican at Manzana Restaurant (ul. Miodowa 11; +48 12 422 2277, manzana.com.pl), or take your pick from Thai, Italian, French, Russian, Hungarian and, of course, Polish. You could eat at a different restaurant every night for a month and still not try them all. Try that in Warsaw and you'll quickly wear your legs down to disappointed stumps.

Warsaw, DD: Warsaw's culinary options reflect our vibrant city, from refined French cuisine at the Rozbrat 20 bistro (ul. Rozbrat 20, +48 22 628 0295, rozbrat20.pl), a bowl of aromatic Vietnamese pho noodle soup at Toan Pho on ul. Chmielna. We couldn't be more proud of our Polish culinary heritage either. A particular Varsovian speciality is steak tartare, popular at U Kucharzy (ul. Ossolinskich 7, +48 22 826 7936), which channels old-school, no-frills Polish charm. This is something Warsaw has perfected – taking time-honoured flavours and reimagining them for a modern audience. But I'm sure you guys in Krakow are quite satisfied with your greasy pork knuckle establishments.

Park Planty in Krakow. Photograph: Alamy Krakow, JS: Sorry for the slow reply, when I saw your mention of pork knuckles (golonka) I just had to nip out and have one at Hawelka (ul. Rynek Glowny 34, +48 12 422 0631). It's great Polish food – chunky meat, crispy fat and creamy sauces.

A stroll helps to burn off the regrettable calories. Fortunately we have the Planty – that tree-lined promenading circuit around the centre of the city that takes you from the ancient Florian gate and city walls down to Wawel castle and the Vistula river. I think you have the same river up there don't you? I forget, because you never see it – unless you brave the six-lane highway to get down to its sludgy, empty banks.

Lazienki Park, Warsaw Photograph: Alamy Warsaw, DD: In Warsaw, not only can visitors explore the Old Town and Royal Route to the baroque Wilanow Palace (wilanow-palac.pl), there are plenty of green spaces, too. Need I remind you that Warsaw is the greenest city in Poland? Lazienki Park has the stunning Palace on the Water, outdoor Chopin concerts in summer and resident peacocks.

North-west of the city lies the primeval Kampinos Forest national park, a brilliant place for wildlife spotting (bison, lynx, and moose) with hundreds of kilometres of trails for hiking and cycling. You can even rent a horse-drawn sleigh in the winter. The most exciting wildlife you'll find in Krakow are the pigeons.

Krakow, JS: We hardly lack the green stuff. The monumental Kosciuszko Mound sits on the wooded hills overlooking the city, and Zakopane, the mountain resort in the Tatras mountains, is just 100km away, by bus or train. Much as we would love to have our ancient streets teeming with giant bison, bankers and advertising executives, I guess we're stuck with being the most relaxed, most cultured and most civilised place in Poland. You guys carry on with the money-making, the DJs and the iPads and we'll take it easy with a beer as usual.

• Where to stay: In Krakow's old town, Hotel Wawel (ul. Poselska 22, +48 12 424 1300, hotelwawel.pl) has doubles from £85 a night. Warsaw's hotels include Witt (ul. Emilii Plater 9/11, +48 603 632 588, hostelwitt.pl), a friendly guesthouse with a beer garden and rooms from £33 a night
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Warsaw Post-War Reconstruction to Present

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Old April 12th, 2011, 10:10 PM   #178
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Beauties that Survived the War

A would like to credit drugastrona for most of these fantastic pictures obtained through his labour of love in documenting the inventory and condition of most of Warsaw's surviving kamienice.









Come on take it off, stop teasing



























This pic provides a true microcosm of Warsaw, 1/3 ruins hoping for restoration, 1/3 beautifully restored (I would say as much as 45% of historic) and 1/3 post war modern/commieblock/socreal































































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ten rząd wstrząsa podstawami naszej państwowości i funkcjonowania społeczeństwa. Natomiast większość społeczeństwa śpi, nie zwraca uwagi, co się dzieje i trzeba je z tego snu obudzić - Piotr S


Warsaw Post-War Reconstruction to Present

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Old April 13th, 2011, 03:33 AM   #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Urbanista1 View Post
12 years, wow! well you will see lots of little changes, pockets of big changes, there is a new town of Wilanow near Wilanow palace (like Don Mills) and a whole new neighbourhood of offices and lofts (just a few so far ) around Domianewska Street, a number of new museums. I am also so drawn to Warsaw for reasons I still can't divine, maybe it's because my ancestors are buried somewhere under those streets and they're calling to me, those spirits, that history still somehow electrifies this place, maybe it's because I love the process of creating life, the urban synergy that transforms spaces into places, that is happening in Warsaw, but not fast enough for my imagination.

But I digress, I think Krucza is so cool, I will have to throw in a few Krucza before and afters for your trip. When are you going?
In exactly 30 days!
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Old April 13th, 2011, 04:19 AM   #180
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Hope you have good weather.
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