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Old August 20th, 2014, 08:06 PM   #1801
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This heroic chapter is not actually the greatest pride we should gain from our history and till it's beginning the discussion is held whether it really made any sense whatsoever or not. We just like to celebrate our failures more than victories. It's extremely an eyesore to compare the amount of media attention and run of anniversaries of Warsaw Uprising and how we celebrate the anniversaries of the Battle of Warsaw in 1920. The date of the latter is also a Polish Army holiday, but I don't know if as many know why this exact date was chosen, when more and more people know what happened on August 1st.
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Old August 21st, 2014, 02:45 AM   #1802
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Old August 21st, 2014, 02:50 AM   #1803
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the discussion is held whether it really made any sense whatsoever or not.
This is a negative way of thinking and would be offensive to the fighters and survivors. Besides, everyone can be an "expert" on something that already happened.
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Old August 21st, 2014, 02:55 PM   #1804
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Nothing ment to be offensive. Funny you say that, cause the discussion began actually shortly before the uprising started. There were vasts of Warsaw citizens who weren't glad about what was happening, and the leaders of the uprising versus country leaders in London is something totally different than the youngsters who were just enthusiastic in what they wanted to believe had a chance to be sucsessful. It's a little bit more complicated than just survivors and fighters, who of course deserve respect and memory. I think that what shows how we are proud of our failures and skip those real heroic moments is a huge (not saying it's bad), very modern seat of the Warsaw Uprising Museum, again there was a celebration held in the PASTa building, most of streets, squares, green areas get the name to memorize the uprising. And one of the really few Uprisings we won (among really many failures), the Wielkopolskie Uprising has just a small hall of memory in Poznań, that not many people really know where it's seat is.
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Old August 21st, 2014, 03:26 PM   #1805
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It's really time to renovate the palace of culture and science to its brilliant white former glory.

Seriously, it's been more than sixty years.
Bucharest also has a similar Stalinist building, that would look good if it wasn't covered in grime, ads, and stupid mechanical equipment.
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Old August 21st, 2014, 04:10 PM   #1806
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You mean this?


Pic from the Internet
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Old August 21st, 2014, 04:38 PM   #1807
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Yeah. It's a total mess. All that's missing are mismatched plastic white frame windows.
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Old August 23rd, 2014, 05:02 PM   #1808
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Nothing ment to be offensive. Funny you say that, cause the discussion began actually shortly before the uprising started. There were vasts of Warsaw citizens who weren't glad about what was happening, and the leaders of the uprising versus country leaders in London is something totally different than the youngsters who were just enthusiastic in what they wanted to believe had a chance to be sucsessful. It's a little bit more complicated than just survivors and fighters, who of course deserve respect and memory. I think that what shows how we are proud of our failures and skip those real heroic moments is a huge (not saying it's bad), very modern seat of the Warsaw Uprising Museum, again there was a celebration held in the PASTa building, most of streets, squares, green areas get the name to memorize the uprising. And one of the really few Uprisings we won (among really many failures), the Wielkopolskie Uprising has just a small hall of memory in Poznań, that not many people really know where it's seat is.
I agree with you, we celebrate failure rather than success far too much. The present day provides even greater insight into this Polish psychosis. Many totally ignore the massive, really miraculous changes brought about over the last 8 years and the brilliantly skillful manner in which the Tusk government navigated the nation through so many global crises through hard work, cooperation and calm intelligence, working with our European partners...and many now prefer the deranged destructive nonsense of a group of lunatics around Jaroslaw Kaczynski and his party of hate and terror. Unfortunately the commander of the AK (Home Army) during WWII was boorish, rabble-rouser pseuodnymed "Monter" and real name General Antoni Chrusciel instead of the brilliant deputy chief Janusz Bokszczanin who warned against the uprising knowing well the Nazis and Soviet Russian disposition towards Poland and the lack of real support Poland had. Those who made the decision to launch the Uprising (Monter really) did the nation an eternal disservice, those who fought I have immense respect for. I compare those misguided individuals driven by testosterone and ignorant hate to those today who support Kaczynski. If he wins...and I doubt he ultimately will, Poland is finished once again.
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Old August 23rd, 2014, 06:40 PM   #1809
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I agree with you, we celebrate failure rather than success far too much. The present day provides even greater insight into this Polish psychosis. Many totally ignore the massive, really miraculous changes brought about over the last 8 years and the brilliantly skillful manner in which the Tusk government navigated the nation through so many global crises through hard work, cooperation and calm intelligence, working with our European partners...and many now prefer the deranged destructive nonsense of a group of lunatics around Jaroslaw Kaczynski and his party of hate and terror. Unfortunately the commander of the AK (Home Army) during WWII was boorish, rabble-rouser pseuodnymed "Monter" and real name General Antoni Chrusciel instead of the brilliant deputy chief Janusz Bokszczanin who warned against the uprising knowing well the Nazis and Soviet Russian disposition towards Poland and the lack of real support Poland had. Those who made the decision to launch the Uprising (Monter really) did the nation an eternal disservice, those who fought I have immense respect for. I compare those misguided individuals driven by testosterone and ignorant hate to those today who support Kaczynski. If he wins...and I doubt he ultimately will, Poland is finished once again.
Whoa, I did not exactly want to launch the political affaris topis in this thread. I generally agree with you, but I am not gonna elaborate on current state more. What still needs to be said is this huge phenomenon of the Warsaw Uprising that I think got out of control. I knowingly remember and can easily recall anniversaries from about past ten years. And actually, I mostly happened to be in Warsaw during the celebrations. And 10-8 years ago I remember it as a celebration dedicated to the town of Warsaw, here it started, and here it ended. On general news in television there was just one or two materials on how the celebrations were held. This and last year it got crazy. Not to mention the tshirts and LEGO-alike brick sets. But what really made me furious was that the celebrations actually spreaded out of Warsaw. There were many cities in Poland where the sirens were turned on at 5 pm on 1st August. I mean, why? What for? We are really close to a very dangerous state of mind. I know that Warsaw remembers, it always did, even during PRL, and it will always do. But Warsaw uprising is Warsaw uprising, and occupation in Poznań, Greater Poland generally was something totally different than in GG.
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Old August 24th, 2014, 05:36 PM   #1810
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Well I agree with you on many issues, but I don't mind commemorations spreading outside Warsaw and becoming part of European culture even as it has, because it shows what fascism and totalitarianism can do, after all Warsaw after the Holocaust was the greatest single crime committed in WWII (ethnic cleansing on a massive scale human and physical), and it celebrates the indomitable human spirit's at times as is here reckless quest for freedom despite the odds.
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Old August 24th, 2014, 05:53 PM   #1811
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Powazki Cemetary Restorations (wall and main gate):



the famous gate is turning 100 next year





Finishing touches on the Palace on the Water



New Addition to Lazienki Park - Chinese Garden built by craftsmen from China using techniques used in Forbidden City - not a restoration per se but an enrichment worth noting

















Potocki Palace Gate Restoration





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Old August 24th, 2014, 07:27 PM   #1812
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Amazing reconstruction!
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Old August 26th, 2014, 05:11 AM   #1813
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I agree with you, we celebrate failure rather than success far too much. The present day provides even greater insight into this Polish psychosis. Many totally ignore the massive, really miraculous changes brought about over the last 8 years and the brilliantly skillful manner in which the Tusk government navigated the nation through so many global crises through hard work, cooperation and calm intelligence, working with our European partners...and many now prefer the deranged destructive nonsense of a group of lunatics around Jaroslaw Kaczynski and his party of hate and terror. Unfortunately the commander of the AK (Home Army) during WWII was boorish, rabble-rouser pseuodnymed "Monter" and real name General Antoni Chrusciel instead of the brilliant deputy chief Janusz Bokszczanin who warned against the uprising knowing well the Nazis and Soviet Russian disposition towards Poland and the lack of real support Poland had. Those who made the decision to launch the Uprising (Monter really) did the nation an eternal disservice, those who fought I have immense respect for. I compare those misguided individuals driven by testosterone and ignorant hate to those today who support Kaczynski. If he wins...and I doubt he ultimately will, Poland is finished once again.
Isn't Tusk helping sell off most of Poland? There's reasons he's not liked. By the way, if Poland joins the Euro currency then they'll really be f*cked.
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Old August 26th, 2014, 05:20 AM   #1814
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Does that Chinese garden have any historical significance? Was it there before the war?
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Old August 26th, 2014, 06:36 AM   #1815
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Isn't Tusk helping sell off most of Poland? There's reasons he's not liked. By the way, if Poland joins the Euro currency then they'll really be f*cked.
what exactly is Tusk selling off, not sure what you mean? He's using everything at his disposal to promote development and investment it seems to me. I don't think Poland is going to adopt the Euro yet, on balance too many cons versus pros at this time.

I should clarify my position about the Uprising, my criticism is only of the leader who decided to launch it despite all the intelligence that was against it. Varsovians were among the bravest people that ever existed for fighting for their freedom. Above all I admire those who returned to Poland post war and Warsaw to a very uncertain future and started to pick through the ruins to rebuild the city and country.
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Old August 26th, 2014, 02:43 PM   #1816
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Isn't Tusk helping sell off most of Poland? There's reasons he's not liked.
Not truth. It is just simple propaganda for his opposition which is aiming those less, let's call it - knowledgeable

Answer for the second sentence you have above Honestly, it is nightmare to watch how people are brainwashed by some media which at the same time are blaming other media that they brainwash, getting to the root it is so clear and obvious that those shouting loudest are linked financially with some political groups

Typical 'Polish Hell'
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Old August 26th, 2014, 04:20 PM   #1817
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that's right rychlik, the opposition party my friend above is referring to has launched a media misinformation campaign, like Canada's conservatives they know how to misinform, twist the truth while not being able to do anything good for their people when in power. anyway, shall we get back to Warsaw reconstruction, more coming very soon. Cheers
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Old August 26th, 2014, 04:29 PM   #1818
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Recent Old Town, New Town and Nowy Swiat restorations in progress:









three in a row here ( most of these buildings have original pre-war facades and structures):





thanks zyclunt
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Old August 27th, 2014, 01:21 AM   #1819
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what exactly is Tusk selling off, not sure what you mean?
I have read a lot of complaints online how a lot of Polish companies have fallen into foreign hands. There's "job creation" but the profits flow out of the country. Things of that nature. I go on Onet.pl once in a while.
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Old August 27th, 2014, 05:24 AM   #1820
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yes that's happening everywhere where companies set up headquarters in tax havens. Time for EU to crack down on tax havens. This is nothing to do with Tusk. At least he has created conditions that has generated more job growth than anywhere in Europe.
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