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Old December 26th, 2012, 08:46 PM   #481
gino lo spazzino
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro EM View Post
That certainly is an issue Suissetralia but that is something that should have been done years ago. And railway connection could be improved not only to Milan but also to the surrounding areas.
Currently, the rail links with MXP from Milan are much improved (there are trains from 3 railway stations in Milan and in the short term should arrive Italo, an High Speed train) as well as the road connections (in 2015 should be completed the Pedemontana highway Bergamo-Malpensa)
Not only, from one year there are rail connection from Malpensa to Bellinzona (Switzerland) and in a few years also for Lugano.

The problem about closing of Linate is not the connections of Malpensa with Milan, but the policy....
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Last edited by gino lo spazzino; December 26th, 2012 at 09:05 PM.
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Old December 28th, 2012, 11:12 PM   #482
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But it could be too late for AZ. Do you reckon their long-haul fleet is based on the right choices?? Or would a few 787s been good for the airline?
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Old December 29th, 2012, 10:20 AM   #483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axelferis View Post
alitalia is a boring company

i used tham in 2009 between paris-milan and palermo-roma
All look old (hostess, plane etc...) it's not a world class company!

When they changed us at rome to take a a-321 by air france we were happy because it was more beautiful and dynamic feeling.

i don't even know how alitalia could exist again today
but if you know, they have the first serie A321 (first made), which made IN 1993! A320 - 1999, A319 - 200X
P. S. for happiness I flew by AZ only in November FCO-Bari
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Old December 29th, 2012, 12:18 PM   #484
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suissetralia View Post
Has Italy ever thought about closing Linate airport and leaving only Malpensa (and Bergamo for Ryanair and the likes) with improved railway connection to Milan? No doubt AZ can't make money out of Milan if local and international traffic are completely separated
I don't think they've plans to close Linate ....... since Milan's municipality is building a new metro line to connect (finally!!) the airport with the downtown......
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Old December 29th, 2012, 12:26 PM   #485
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro EM View Post
Merry Xmas to all- sadly not so much it seems for AZ:

http://en.europeonline-magazine.eu/i...ys_255990.html
There were some rumours AZ could be taken over by Trenitalia/RFI (!!!), suppressing or strongly thinning the Milan-Rome route and strenghtening international flights, but Moretta (Trenitalia's CEO) denied.
Also, I think AZ could hardly be nationalized, because of UE related restrictions.
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Old December 29th, 2012, 04:02 PM   #486
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro EM View Post
But it could be too late for AZ. Do you reckon their long-haul fleet is based on the right choices?? Or would a few 787s been good for the airline?
The long-haul fleet has improved a lot as quality with the introduction of the A330 instead of B767 and the renewal of the interior of the B777, but at the same time the fleet has been reduced, Alitalia now have got 22 WB (which among other their don't use at their full potential, infact Alitalia use 3 aircraft for charter flights)

The B787 aircraft would be perfect for a strengthening of the long-haul fleet, but if Alitalia starts with the idea that the planes must be based on FCO they can not purchase that planes

Quote:
Originally Posted by NotThatGuy View Post
I don't think they've plans to close Linate ....... since Milan's municipality is building a new metro line to connect (finally!!) the airport with the downtown......
It is not entirely true, the M4 line, rather than serving to Linate, as he made clear the president of the Milan subway, concurs to improve the connections between the east of Milan and the city center, infact now the links are currently very deficient in an area where live more than 300 000 inhabitants

In addition, the company F2i, (a semi-private society with the largest shareholder Cassa Depositi e Prestiti dello Stato), which owns 44% of the shares of SEA with the aim to acquire additional shares of the Municipality of Milan to obtain the majority in SEA, said several times that Linate must be downgraded in favor of Malpensa (until now it has not been done because the close of Linate is very unpopular decision and policy obviously doesn't dare)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NotThatGuy View Post
There were some rumours AZ could be taken over by Trenitalia/RFI (!!!), suppressing or strongly thinning the Milan-Rome route and strenghtening international flights, but Moretta (Trenitalia's CEO) denied.
Also, I think AZ could hardly be nationalized, because of UE related restrictions.
Infact, isn't possible an entry of Ferrovie dello Stato in Alitalia because it would appear as State aid and this is not allowed by EU regulations

P.S The Trenitalia's CEO is Moretti
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Old December 29th, 2012, 05:21 PM   #487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gino lo spazzino View Post
P.S The Trenitalia's CEO is Moretti
Ooops? I thought he was a female......

Seriously: I know, but sometimes fingers on the keyboard are not connected to brain...... in other times we'd have said "lapsus calami" .....

PS. please don't call them 'Ferrovie dello Stato'....... the real 'Ferrovie dello Stato', the good ones, died when Trenitalia/RFI is born ........
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Old December 29th, 2012, 06:15 PM   #488
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Don't worry, it happens

OT: Why don't call Ferrovie dello Stato? Is it name, also because Moretti is the CEO of Ferrovie dello Stato Italiane not Trenitalia (the Trenitalia CEO is Soprano)
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Old December 29th, 2012, 07:29 PM   #489
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gino lo spazzino View Post
OT: Why don't call Ferrovie dello Stato? Is it name, also because Moretti is the CEO of Ferrovie dello Stato Italiane not Trenitalia (the Trenitalia CEO is Soprano)
It's just - to me - a matter of pure nostalgia of times when FS hadn't still splitted in dozens of SpA and, as a whole and undivided entity, they were certainly working better than now. I could speak further but we'd expand the OT
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Old January 6th, 2013, 09:11 AM   #490
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axelferis View Post
alitalia is a boring company

i used tham in 2009 between paris-milan and palermo-roma
All look old (hostess, plane etc...) it's not a world class company!

When they changed us at rome to take a a-321 by air france we were happy because it was more beautiful and dynamic feeling.

i don't even know how alitalia could exist again today
I have had good experience flying with them. Once their B767 broke down in Toronto, and they offered a voucher for 600 euros. That's was like one free airfare to my old country. You have to fly them on the long haul in order to get a better picture. They are better over austrian for sure.
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Old January 6th, 2013, 01:44 PM   #491
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Any one willing to take a vacation that lives in Europe can take advantage of Alitalia's special, special, next to nothing price flying out of Venice to about five good destinaions. Saw one good deal to China for about 150 USD economy return, it's a steal.
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Old January 6th, 2013, 03:09 PM   #492
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Sun Jan 6, 2013

Franco-Dutch carrier Air France-KLM (AIRF.PA) is in "advanced" talks to take control of Italy's flagship airline Alitalia by the summer, Rome's Messaggero newspaper reported on Sunday without citing its sources.

Alitalia is owned by CAI, a consortium of investors that bought the then-bankrupt airline in 2008. CAI is already partly owned by Air France-KLM. Alitalia's shareholders can exercise options to trade their shares when a lock-up period ends on January 12. In May, Air France said it would probably wait until at least 2014 before using its option to take control of Alitalia, in which it has held 25 percent since January 2009.

Air France-KLM has offered shareholders a 20 percent premium on what they paid for the airline in 2008, the newspaper said, probably in Air France-KLM shares. CAI paid a little more than 1 billion euros to take over Alitalia five years ago. Alitalia and Air France-KLM officials were not immediately available for comment.

Alitalia returned to profit in the third quarter after reporting losses in the first half, booking a net profit of 27 million euros ($35.2 million), down from 70 million euros a year before.

Source: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/0...90503N20130106
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Old January 6th, 2013, 08:02 PM   #493
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Just continuing the transformation of European aviation industry in to 3 BIG aviation groups.

One from each alliances too.
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Old January 6th, 2013, 11:40 PM   #494
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Dru View Post
Sun Jan 6, 2013

Franco-Dutch carrier Air France-KLM (AIRF.PA) is in "advanced" talks to take control of Italy's flagship airline Alitalia by the summer, Rome's Messaggero newspaper reported on Sunday without citing its sources.

Alitalia is owned by CAI, a consortium of investors that bought the then-bankrupt airline in 2008. CAI is already partly owned by Air France-KLM. Alitalia's shareholders can exercise options to trade their shares when a lock-up period ends on January 12. In May, Air France said it would probably wait until at least 2014 before using its option to take control of Alitalia, in which it has held 25 percent since January 2009.

Air France-KLM has offered shareholders a 20 percent premium on what they paid for the airline in 2008, the newspaper said, probably in Air France-KLM shares. CAI paid a little more than 1 billion euros to take over Alitalia five years ago. Alitalia and Air France-KLM officials were not immediately available for comment.

Alitalia returned to profit in the third quarter after reporting losses in the first half, booking a net profit of 27 million euros ($35.2 million), down from 70 million euros a year before.

Source: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/0...90503N20130106

If Alitalia will be purchased by Air France, Air France will do what the current CEO of AZ didn't do: cut.
Cut the fleet, staff, destinations etc..
The risk for AZ is to become a regional of AF/KLM (even if it is already now ....)
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Old January 7th, 2013, 02:18 PM   #495
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Im sure they'll keep a few of the higher performing destinations.
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Old January 7th, 2013, 03:28 PM   #496
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro EM View Post
Im sure they'll keep a few of the higher performing destinations.
Of course, are intercontinental destinations, that don't go very well, to worry, especially the FCO-PEK route

Meanwhile, Air France denies the purchase of Alitalia:

Quote:
Air France-KLM denies Alitalia bailout talks

The Franco-Dutch airline Air France-KLM on Monday denied a newspaper report that it was concluding talks to buy out Italian investors in flagship carrier Alitalia.
AFP - The Franco-Dutch airline Air France-KLM on Monday denied a newspaper report that it was concluding talks to buy out Italian investors in flagship carrier Alitalia.

"There have been no negotiations concerning the purchase of all or part of the shares held by Italian investors," said a company spokesman.

Air France chief Alexandre de Juniac added: "Air France and KLM have very limited means which do not permit us to make these operations."

Air France-KLM has held a 25 percent stake in Alitalia since 2009. It said last month that it did not plan to increase its equity in the airline.

Alitalia is once more on the verge of bankruptcy. It has two options: either being re-nationalised or ceded in a cut-rate deal to Air France-KLM, which in 2008 had offered 2.5 billion euros ($3.26 billion) for the troubled airline.
http://www.france24.com/en/20130107-...-bailout-talks

Last edited by gino lo spazzino; January 7th, 2013 at 03:34 PM.
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Old January 7th, 2013, 04:11 PM   #497
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Hmm..........
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Old January 7th, 2013, 09:45 PM   #498
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gino lo spazzino View Post
If Alitalia will be purchased by Air France, Air France will do what the current CEO of AZ didn't do: cut.
Cut the fleet, staff, destinations etc..
The risk for AZ is to become a regional of AF/KLM (even if it is already now ....)
Very true, just as Tarom and CSA. They did not find much luck with them. French just lured them to SkyTeam so these guys would purchase Airbus airplanes in return.
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Old January 7th, 2013, 09:53 PM   #499
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Some pictures I took from December 2012. Italian pride in Toronto-Pearson.

Here she comes, Alitalia A330-200 from Rome.





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Old January 7th, 2013, 11:31 PM   #500
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Very true, just as Tarom and CSA. They did not find much luck with them. French just lured them to SkyTeam so these guys would purchase Airbus airplanes in return.
Alitalia was already in Skyteam and planes have nothing to do: those planes were in order to AP Fleet, a leasing society of AirOne; before that Alitalia absorbed AP at the behest of Berlusconi, AP had plans to develop a hub at Malpensa in partnership with Lufthansa with the prospect to join Star Alliance, also AP had different C/S with United for MXP-BOS and MXP-ORD routes.

Air France/KLM wanted other and, unfortunately, got it: the precius international and intercontinental traffic in Northern Italy, and currently their divides it along with the other big European and Middle Eastern airlines.

Quote:
Originally Posted by YU-AMC View Post
Italian pride in Toronto-Pearson.
Alitalia is not the italian pride....
However, the photos are beautiful, that location is incredibly fantastic

Last edited by gino lo spazzino; January 7th, 2013 at 11:48 PM.
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