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Old August 11th, 2014, 05:52 PM   #561
Pedro EM
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Will be interesting to see what comes out of this and I hope all the skeptics get proven wrong.
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Old August 11th, 2014, 06:16 PM   #562
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Alitalia joins Etihad’s constellation of equity partners
Aug 8, 2014

Alitalia’s route network plans show the Italian carrier being pulled into orbit around the fast-growing, Abu Dhabi-based Etihad Airways, following the closing of a long-awaited major investment deal.

From winter 2014, Alitalia will increase frequency between Rome Fiumicino and Abu Dhabi from 5X-weekly to daily and start a new daily service between Milan Malpensa and the emirate. Etihad already operates daily services on these routes.

From next summer, direct flights to Abu Dhabi will also begin from several other Italian cities, including Catania, Venice and Bologna.

Alitalia’s short-haul services have been affected by low-cost carriers such as Ryanair, while domestic routes have also been hit by competition from high-speed railway services.

While maintaining some short-haul services, proposed development of Alitalia’s network focuses on the growth of long-haul flying from Fiumicino and Malpensa.

This will include new destinations, increased frequencies to some existing destinations, plus enhanced connections to Abu Dhabi in order to funnel Alitalia passengers into Etihad’s hub and onward connections.

The two airlines foresee Fiumicino developing as a larger European intercontinental hub, with up to five new routes over the next four years, while long-haul flights from Malpensa will more than double to 25 flights a week by 2018.

To meet these changes, Alitalia’s widebody fleet is planned to grow by a third, while its narrowbody fleet will shrink.

Members of Alitalia’s frequent flyer program will be able to earn and spend miles on Etihad and its partner airlines. The intention is to integrate the frequent-flyer programs of carriers in which Etihad has an equity stake.

Cost savings will come through streamlined hub operations and joint procurement in areas such as aircraft, engines, MRO, training, catering, ground handling and fuel.

Alitalia’s cargo business will be relaunched and expanded, with the establishment of a center of excellence in northern Italy, plus investment in handling capabilities at Italian airports and the optimization of an integrated cargo network.

Etihad president and CEO James Hogan said: “The possibilities when we knit together our network with those of our existing equity partners—including airberlin, Air Serbia, Etihad Regional, Jet Airways, Virgin Australia, Air Seychelles and Aer Lingus, and of course our strategic codeshare partner, Air France-KLM—will provide the most compelling customer offering.”

Etihad and Alitalia already codeshare on 31 destinations, apart from the Rome and Milan to Abu Dhabi trunk routes.

Source: http://atwonline.com/finance-data/al...quity-partners
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Old August 12th, 2014, 12:14 AM   #563
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Who is behind the Linate airport? Is it Silvio? That airport is one of a kind shame for the Italian society. Shut it down ASAP!
Nobody behind, is only the lack of willingness from our politicians of to want to take some serious measures...
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Old August 12th, 2014, 05:56 PM   #564
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Nobody behind, is only the lack of willingness from our politicians of to want to take some serious measures...
Now the transport Minister wants compromises for Milan:

La nuova Alitalia punta su Milano: "Più voli a Linate, grande rilancio per Malpensa"
Il governo apre il tavolo di lavoro per modificare le destinazioni dei due aeroporti in vista dell'appuntamento con Expo 2015, senza squilibri con lo scalo di Fiumicino. Il ministro Lupi: "Avremo un grande hub europeo"

"Un gruppo di lavoro per sviluppare il traffico aereo sugli scali milanesi ed evitare squilibri con l’aeroporto romano. E, probabilmente, un decreto per superare quello di Bersani, consentendo a Linate di sperimentare, almeno nel periodo di Expo, nuove rotte europee senza cannibalizzare Malpensa. È stato un incontro trilaterale quello che si è svolto al ministero dei Trasporti: al tavolo, oltre al ministro Maurizio Lupi, il presidente di Sea Pietro Modiano e l’amministratore delegato di Alitalia Gabriele Del Torchio.

La necessità era quella di rassicurare Milano all’indomani dell’accordo tra Alitalia e Etihad: le ipotesi di ridimensionamento insite nell’ingresso della compagnia di Abu Dhabi sono state, almeno formalmente e almeno per ora, smentite dai partecipanti all’incontro che, anzi, avrebbero convenuto sulla necessità di rilanciare gli scali milanesi.

In calendario per fine mese e inizio settembre, per questo, verranno messi diversi altri incontri tecnici tra rappresentanti di Sea e Alitalia-Etihad: bisogna studiare le prospettive di crescita per i due scali, prospettive che — ha spiegato Modiano a fine incontro — «sono state finora sottovalutate». Sarà questo gruppo di lavoro a disegnare l’architettura di questo nuovo decreto che servirà per superare, su Linate, i forti vincoli imposti dal decreto Bersani. Non aumenterebbero i voli del Forlanini: gli slot operativi non supereranno gli attuali 18 all’ora.

Quello che cambierà, invece, saranno i collegamenti europei. Non le capitali — che devono invece spostarsi sempre più su Malpensa — ma le altre città europee da cui possono arrivare turisti, soprattutto in quei sei mesi del 2015 in cui sarà aperta l’Esposizione universale (e anche su come organizzare e gestire il traffico in quei sei mesi sarà un tema del tavolo di lavoro). Sarebbe questo, insomma, il modo per ridurre la competizione tra i due scali milanesi: a Malpensa resterebbero le rotte extraeuropee e le capitali europee, a Linate, oltre ai voli nazionali, quelli con le città non capitali all’interno dei confini europei.

In realtà su Malpensa il progetto è — ma non sarebbe la prima volta — di vero rilancio. «Secondo l’accordo (MXP) diventerà il vero hub europeo, con un incremento dei voli intercontinentali», assicura il ministro Lupi ai microfoni del Tg3. Più voli e più apertura al traffico cargo, quindi. Una divisione dei compiti netta, che però avrebbe bisogno di un decreto ad hoc soltanto per Linate da scrivere e portare alla firma del governo in tempi rapidissimi, per poter essere davvero operativo entro la prossima primavera.

Quel che è certo è che Roma vuole rassicurare Milano, in un momento in cui le tensioni sono tante. Pesa, ovviamente, la questione ancora aperta della multa da 360 milioni inflitta dall’Europa per il caso Sea Handling. Ufficialmente, all’incontro, non si sarebbe affrontato il tema: fonti ufficiose, però, raccontano che Lupi, in giornata, abbia comunque fatto arrivare al sindaco Giuliano Pisapia la sua solidarietà contro la decisione della Commissione europea di deferire l’Italia alla Corte di giustizia europea. Decisione che, qualche giorno fa, aveva già detto di non comprendere."

http://milano.repubblica.it/cronaca/...ieme-93594739/



You know what I am fully sided with Lupi on this one as opposed to the EU who is controlled by the Germans and thus heavily lobbied by LH and co.
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Old August 13th, 2014, 01:13 AM   #565
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Could you provide a rough English translation of what Minister Lupi mentioned in that article, please, so that I can weigh in too?
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Old August 13th, 2014, 08:03 AM   #566
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If Alitalia is planning on Seoul route, naturally they need Korean Air feed.

JV and have KE drop Rome route and concentrate on Milan.
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Old August 13th, 2014, 10:51 PM   #567
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Quote:
In realtà su Malpensa il progetto è — ma non sarebbe la prima volta — di vero rilancio. «Secondo l’accordo (MXP) diventerà il vero hub europeo, con un incremento dei voli intercontinentali», assicura il ministro Lupi ai microfoni del Tg3. Più voli e più apertura al traffico cargo, quindi. Una divisione dei compiti netta, che però avrebbe bisogno di un decreto ad hoc soltanto per Linate da scrivere e portare alla firma del governo in tempi rapidissimi, per poter essere davvero operativo entro la prossima primavera.
The Minister says in that bit that MXP is going to be, after the agreement, the real european hub with an increase in the Intercontinental flights and more space to freight and a differentation from Linate airport but for that there is politics involved and they want to fix the duality before next spring.
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Old August 27th, 2014, 06:51 PM   #568
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Italian economic financial newspaper Il Sole 24 Ore said Alitalia and Etihad Airways are waiting to sign the partnership. In fact, to close the business plan, European Antitrust should give its formal 'ok'. Some months ago, Lufthansa and British Airways had lit light on the whole operation, alarmed by the arrival of the new competitor.

http://www.soldionline.it/notizie/ec...ter-di-fusione

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Old August 28th, 2014, 01:49 AM   #569
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Quote:
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Some months ago, Lufthansa and British Airways had lit light on the whole operation, alarmed by the arrival of the new competitor.
Lufthansa and British Airways are not alarmed for Alitalia, which will continue to be a mediocre vector, but from Etihad that will bring more passengers on its hub in Abu Dhabi.

At the end Italy there will gain nothing if not a some other flight to AUH from other Italian cities (see Air Berlin)....
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Old October 20th, 2014, 11:33 PM   #570
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The new Alitalia and Etihad ‪#‎Livery‬ celebrating Expo - ‪#‎EtihadAlitalia‬ • Expo 2015 Milano














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Old October 21st, 2014, 04:34 AM   #571
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The deal with Etihad marks the end of all hopes for having a hub or at least a decent amount of long range routes based out of Milan Malpensa.

Although Malpensa can be reached in 30 minutes by train from Milan's downtown, it is too far away from a big chunk of the city's population which will continue to prefer flying out of Milan Linate, the smaller and much more accessible airport (it's only 5 miles from downtown, not to mention it's at the intersection of two freeways and much closer to other city transport nodes).

Malpensa was opened less than 16 years ago to host a hub by what was going to be Europe's number 2 airline: Alitalia-KLM. Milan Linate only has one runway and is too nested inside the city to be expanded; wide bodies cannot land there.

As a result the government built Malpensa specifically in order to give the new airline the hub it needed. The Dutch had the 747's, the Italians just needed to build the darn airport. As part of the deal, traffic out of Milan Linate was supposed to be highly reduced at a minimum in order to allow Malpensa to grow into a worldwide hub.

Needless to say, the plan to limit Linate's traffic found brutal opposition by local politicians from both sides, city lobbists, and many of Milan's citizens who never understood what a hub and are simply too dumb to care.

Time went by and traffic was not limited to the extent that had been agreed upon before the merger. The Dutch realized they were dealing with an unreliable partner and backed away form the merger. They then made a deal with Air France and they became Europe's number 1 airline. That was 2004.

Ironically, in 2008, AF-KLM bought 25% of a nearly bankrupt Alitalia, which they basically turned into their regional carrier for Southern Europe with the only objective of feeding their own hub (CDG) with Northern Italy's high yield traffic while moving Italy's hub to Rome. And of course everyone in Rome has saluted this as a victory against its rival city in the North...

Now Etihad is turning Milan Linate into Alitalia's Milan base for European routes (in fact, the process had already been initiated by AF). The existing caps at Linate have been increased once again, so they are moving most of the few Alitalia routes that had been left at Malpensa to Linate.

Regardless if it's under Air France or Etihad, both Milan and Rome and all Italian airports will become terminal points in a network of foreign carriers routing traffic through their own international hubs. Alitalia is today roughly 30% the size of what it was 15 years ago. This is billions in lost investment and economic growth.

This is exactly how Italy as a country fails repetitively at the most basic things any developed country worthy of being called so would instead get right.
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Old October 26th, 2014, 10:34 AM   #572
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayOOfoshO View Post
The deal with Etihad marks the end of all hopes for having a hub or at least a decent amount of long range routes based out of Milan Malpensa.

Although Malpensa can be reached in 30 minutes by train from Milan's downtown, it is too far away from a big chunk of the city's population which will continue to prefer flying out of Milan Linate, the smaller and much more accessible airport (it's only 5 miles from downtown, not to mention it's at the intersection of two freeways and much closer to other city transport nodes).

Malpensa was opened less than 16 years ago to host a hub by what was going to be Europe's number 2 airline: Alitalia-KLM. Milan Linate only has one runway and is too nested inside the city to be expanded; wide bodies cannot land there.

As a result the government built Malpensa specifically in order to give the new airline the hub it needed. The Dutch had the 747's, the Italians just needed to build the darn airport. As part of the deal, traffic out of Milan Linate was supposed to be highly reduced at a minimum in order to allow Malpensa to grow into a worldwide hub.

Needless to say, the plan to limit Linate's traffic found brutal opposition by local politicians from both sides, city lobbists, and many of Milan's citizens who never understood what a hub and are simply too dumb to care.

Time went by and traffic was not limited to the extent that had been agreed upon before the merger. The Dutch realized they were dealing with an unreliable partner and backed away form the merger. They then made a deal with Air France and they became Europe's number 1 airline. That was 2004.

Ironically, in 2008, AF-KLM bought 25% of a nearly bankrupt Alitalia, which they basically turned into their regional carrier for Southern Europe with the only objective of feeding their own hub (CDG) with Northern Italy's high yield traffic while moving Italy's hub to Rome. And of course everyone in Rome has saluted this as a victory against its rival city in the North...

Now Etihad is turning Milan Linate into Alitalia's Milan base for European routes (in fact, the process had already been initiated by AF). The existing caps at Linate have been increased once again, so they are moving most of the few Alitalia routes that had been left at Malpensa to Linate.

Regardless if it's under Air France or Etihad, both Milan and Rome and all Italian airports will become terminal points in a network of foreign carriers routing traffic through their own international hubs. Alitalia is today roughly 30% the size of what it was 15 years ago. This is billions in lost investment and economic growth.

This is exactly how Italy as a country fails repetitively at the most basic things any developed country worthy of being called so would instead get right.
jayOOfoshO, questo articolo è tuo o lo stai riportando?
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Old October 26th, 2014, 03:37 PM   #573
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Please, use English in the International Forum
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Old October 28th, 2014, 03:36 AM   #574
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jayOOfoshO, questo articolo è tuo o lo stai riportando?
It's just a summary I made about the whole story, not an actual article.

Most people don't know Alitalia had a real chance at becoming one of the world's leading carriers, I was just sharing some of the history behind the disaster we are all witnessing today.

Alitalia could have had two hubs by now, with a few long haul routes based out of Venice and Pisa/Florence and other seasonal focus cities. Kind of like what Lufthansa is nowadays, at a smaller scale. They just never had enough planes to really reach any economies of scale in the first place. That was what the deal with KLM was supposed to be about: network expansion.
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Old October 28th, 2014, 06:43 PM   #575
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Originally Posted by jayOOfoshO View Post
It's just a summary I made about the whole story, not an actual article.

Most people don't know Alitalia had a real chance at becoming one of the world's leading carriers, I was just sharing some of the history behind the disaster we are all witnessing today.

Alitalia could have had two hubs by now, with a few long haul routes based out of Venice and Pisa/Florence and other seasonal focus cities. Kind of like what Lufthansa is nowadays, at a smaller scale. They just never had enough planes to really reach any economies of scale in the first place. That was what the deal with KLM was supposed to be about: network expansion.
Would be interesting to imagine what would have happened had the KLM deal worked better. Anyway that is history now. There could have even been another alliance along the lines of OneWorld, Star and SkyTeam.
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Old October 29th, 2014, 03:03 PM   #576
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Would be interesting to imagine what would have happened had the KLM deal worked better. Anyway that is history now. There could have even been another alliance along the lines of OneWorld, Star and SkyTeam.
Who knows! But yeah, you're right, it's history now
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Old November 2nd, 2014, 09:04 PM   #577
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You might have noticed that I have expanded the airline list on this thread... it's because, I'd like to see other Italian carriers represented here, including:

- AP - AirOne
- BV - Blue Panorama
- GJ - Eurofly
- IG - Meridiana
- NO - Neos

This way, most of Italy's larger carriers are represented, and that we can have a more rounded discussion. Sounds fair?
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Old November 3rd, 2014, 12:49 AM   #578
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Good idea but i allow myself to do to you 2 corrections:

- Air One ceased operation at the end of september 2014
- Eurofly ceased operation at february 2010

Meridiana and Blue Panorama coming soon?
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Old November 3rd, 2014, 01:11 AM   #579
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All right... so that leaves us with Meridiana and Blue Panorama? I want to make sure that most of Italy's largest carriers are covered...
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Old November 6th, 2014, 02:48 PM   #580
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Eurofly has been absorbed by Meridiana in 2010. Now the company is: Meridiana Fly.
Air One was part of Alitalia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
I want to make sure that most of Italy's largest carriers are covered...
Largest operative carries are (in order):
AZ Alitalia
IG Meridiana Fly
BV Blue Panorama
NO Neos

✈ | AZ™/BV/IG/NO | Italian-Based Carriers
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Last edited by IThomas; November 6th, 2014 at 03:05 PM.
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