TRANSPORT | Piccadilly To Victoria Direct Rail Link | Ordsall Curve

[kebabmonster]

It would be good if Mayfield were developed as an Airport Express location, where you could check your bags in and be conveyed to the airport, perhaps with a walkway link to Piccadilly.

[ScouseinManc]

Originally Posted by kebabmonster

It would be good if Mayfield were developed as an Airport Express location, where you could check your bags in and be conveyed to the airport, perhaps with a walkway link to Piccadilly.

I did hear the something along those lines not that long ago K'monster.
There was talk of building (yet another) hotel on top of Mayfield & the station itself would be used for the Airport runs instead of the Piccadilly platforms.
It makes sense, as the viaduct between Picc & Oxford Rd is pretty congested with the current traffic, this may then allow for future developments... However, reading the plans for future rail in the North West, I didn't come across anything re. this therein. So it could be a long way off, if at all.

[Accura4Matalan]

Its just an idea at the moment rather than a concrete plan. I hope it happens though in the long run. Such a large and ready piece of infrastructure should not be left to rot.

[Isaac Newell]

Originally Posted by kebabmonster

It would be good if Mayfield were developed as an Airport Express location, where you could check your bags in and be conveyed to the airport, perhaps with a walkway link to Piccadilly.

Not a bad idea although I would like to see a railway bridge connecting Mayfield with the MSJ&A viaduct. That would take the pressure of platforms 13 and 14.

[Uncle Remus]

Originally Posted by Isaac Newell

Not a bad idea although I would like to see a railway bridge connecting Mayfield with the MSJ&A viaduct. That would take the pressure of platforms 13 and 14.

I agree with Mayfield being brought in to use for Trans Pennine services in the long term and airport check-in would also be a move in the right direction. Ultimately a link from Mayfield to the deansgate viaduct would be beneficial if P15&16 don't materialise.

To release capacity at Piccadilly a crucial piece of infrastructure required is a flyover from the Guide Bridge line to to the western side of Picadilly Station. This would remove the existing conflict between services from the south which terminate at Piccadilly and the Trans-Pennine services which either turn at Piccadilly and head back out to the airport or continue on to Liverpool. These services cross the width of the approach and significantly reduce the capacity of the station throat. Re-routing the Trans-Pennine airport services via Victoria and the Castlefield Curve is not practical due to the viaduct bottleneck between deansgate - Piccadilly which by the way is already signalled bi-directionally for most of its length.

[Isaac Newell]

Good point. Is a dive under feasable ?

[Uncle Remus]

There are a number of schemes to improve capacity in the Piccadilly station area,
including:
• Providing two additional platforms on the Eastern side of the station linked to
additional running lines to Ashburys. This scheme would increase platform
capacity and reduce conflicts with other services in the station approach;
• The Ardwick flyover which would remove the conflict between Leeds-Liverpool
trains and services using the terminal platforms at Piccadilly. It would also bring
North Trans-Pennine services to Manchester Airport on to the West side of the
layout, reducing conflicting movements between Piccadilly and Slade Lane
Junction;
• Construction of two additional running lines on the Western side of the alignment
between Piccadilly and Slade Lane Junction to increase capacity;
• Provision of additional through platforms (15 and 16) to relieve the congestion
currently experienced on platforms 13 and 14. This would also allow more
flexibility in the operation of the viaduct. This would be especially valuable if
linked to four tracking of the viaduct itself; and
• In addition further terminal platforms (17 and 18) could be provided to cater for
reversing Trans-Pennine services. This option could form part of a package with
the Ardwick flyover and the additional running lines to Slade Lane Junction.
If Victoria were to become the main Trans-Pennine hub, a link would be required to allow
trains to operate from Victoria to Manchester Airport. The Ordsall Lane Chord scheme has
been developed to meet this requirement by providing a connection between Salford
Central and Deansgate. In the same area, there is a scheme to provide a flyover to
separate Victoria-Liverpool services from Windsor Link services.
Finally, platform capacity will be a constraint on expanding the usage of Victoria. This
could be overcome by re-opening parts of the former Exchange station – now used for
surface parking – immediately to the west of Victoria.

Taken from the GMSRS (It refers to the Castefield Curve as the Ordsall Lane Chord. Personally I think Castlefield Curve is a much better name)

http://www.sra.gov.uk/pubs2/indy_gen...06_21chap8.pdf

[Architecty]

Cheers for that Remus, interesting stuff, would all be great. Money as ever is the real problem not a lack of ideas.

Always nice to know the railways are being run by forward thinking fellows, well now and again

[Architecty]

Although just noticed its an SRA document; seeing as they no longer exist I wont be doing any holding of breath just yet.

[spacepostman]

Yup the Ordsall Lane thing was in the news a little while ago, looks great!

[Uncle Remus]

Originally Posted by Architecty

Although just noticed its an SRA document; seeing as they no longer exist I wont be doing any holding of breath just yet.

Unfortunately there's not much chance of any of the schemes getting the go-ahead.

[Longsight M13]

Mayfield Station, for those who like me didn't know this old shed actually was a station...

http://www.subbrit.org.uk/sb-sites/s...ld/index.shtml

[Accura4Matalan]

Such potential... it would cost an awful lot to bring that back into use. The track laying isnt the hard part, its the station itself. The concourse area could be quite nice but the platform area would need to be completely rebuilt.

[Isaac Newell]

Something like that from Mayfield through to platforms 13 and 14 would do for me and it would blend in with the Piccadilly roof.

[Mez]

My god this thread is old.

There was a thread on the Manchester Hub investment study but I can't find it. Anyhoo.

Given the recent statements by Darling on how the government will reverse the resession by investing in infrastructure.

http://www.nce.co.uk/opinion/2008/10..._recovery.html

What are the prospects for the Castlefield Curve project? With all the hype about Manchester's relative resilience to the worldwide economic crisis, the curve's benefits would be immense.

I'll repeat The Grands lovely approach.



Manchester Piccadilly
Manchester's Gateway





Manchester Oxford Road
Manchester's Knowledge Capital





Knott Mill
The Conference Quarter & Metrolink Network






Salford Central
Manchester's Business District





Manchester Victoria
Manchester's Retail Quarter and Metrolink Network

[Jongeman]

Darling said....

"You will see us switching our spending priorities to areas that make a difference," he said, highlighting that areas he thought would make that difference included Crossrail, the 2012 Olympics, power stations and transport projects.

Is this an almost tacit admission that government spending is currently directed at areas that don't make a difference?

This thread is certainly a blast from the past Mez. I really hope the vastly under-utilised Manchester rail network and its potential in reducing congestion and increasing economic connectivity (and output), hasn't totally dropped off the political agenda (yes, it probably has!).

[Cherguevara]

Originally Posted by Jongeman

Darling said....



Is this an almost tacit admission that government spending is currently directed at areas that don't make a difference?

To be fair, in times of economic prosperity it isn't the job of government to be generating economic growth, but rather to not undermine that growth and to facilitate a society that is peaceful and socially cohesive.

You can say what you like about this government, and I have, but to suggest that the investment that has gone into the second of those priorities (in terms of education, health and policing and security) is by definition a waste of money is unfair.

Yes the government could have been more creative and braver in improving transport in this country, but the constraints of our political system make it inevitable that marginal concerns will get sidelined. Ultimately, given the luxury of choice we would all prefer that our kids could read and our parents don't die young than our journeys were 10 minutes shorter every day.

[Jongeman]

Originally Posted by Cherguevara

To be fair, in times of economic prosperity it isn't the job of government to be generating economic growth, but rather to not undermine that growth and to facilitate a society that is peaceful and socially cohesive.

That couldn't be further from the truth. It's precisely the job of any government to generate economic growth, and it's also the responsibility of government to re-distribute the added taxation it receives from an expanded economy in the form of public services. You seem to have latched on to education and health, but not mobility.

You can say what you like about this government, and I have, but to suggest that the investment that has gone into the second of those priorities (in terms of education, health and policing and security) is by definition a waste of money is unfair.

I didn't say that.

Yes the government could have been more creative and braver in improving transport in this country, but the constraints of our political system make it inevitable that marginal concerns will get sidelined. Ultimately, given the luxury of choice we would all prefer that our kids could read and our parents don't die young than our journeys were 10 minutes shorter every day.

Do you really think that the whole TIF/Metrolink expansion issue is about 10 minute shorter journeys? Are we supposed to be so grateful that our kids are literate (barely) and that we have a functioning NHS that any other form of public investment in our society is seen as wasteful?

[Cherguevara]

Well I don't think we'll ever agree if we can't even agree on what we think the point of a government is. However I can only conclude that you understand very little about how government works.

Government has primarilly invested our limited resources into schools, hospitals, social services, and security because those are what people want. To be healthy, safe, and have economic opportunity. If transport has come off poorly it is because outside London and the core cities it isn't a priority. You and I may disagree with that, but it's a fact of life, and making rather glib comments about it is pointless.

[Jongeman]

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