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Old December 2nd, 2017, 01:25 PM   #1241
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The "wasp's waist" bottleneck, where all rail traffic, national, regional & local, depends on two tracks, is gone.

However the fundamental problem, that every commute rail share the section Älvsjö-Odenplan, is not. Neither is there any likely improvement for a very long time to come. Relatively minor incidents, e.g. at Älvsjö, shuts down the whole system.
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Old December 2nd, 2017, 01:50 PM   #1242
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Though I commute on the Pendeltåg, and this latest derailing in Älvsjö actually hasen't affected my commute much at all. There have been a few cancelled "extra" trains so the regular trains have been more crowded than usual, and some of the trains have had to wait for a few minutes to enter a station or to leave a station now and then. But by no means have the entire system shut down.
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Old December 2nd, 2017, 06:57 PM   #1243
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Quote:
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Though I commute on the Pendeltåg, and this latest derailing in Älvsjö actually hasen't affected my commute much at all. There have been a few cancelled "extra" trains so the regular trains have been more crowded than usual, and some of the trains have had to wait for a few minutes to enter a station or to leave a station now and then. But by no means have the entire system shut down.
Jeez you are the ultimate apologist. It did cause rather large disruptions and delays of 50 mins which did affect people. Good for you that you were unaffected, a shame for those that were.

Where is the half-hearted explanation as to why the Märsta branch had so many problems since Saturday too? Or are we taking the usual SL and Swedish approach - stick an orange sticker on it scribble a date on that said sticker and perhaps get it fixed by then. If it isn't fixed, well, we can always add a new sticker!
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Old December 2nd, 2017, 07:26 PM   #1244
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Yeah, brand new trains/rail-lines/plane models/car models/... are prone to incidents. As are really old ones. Same pattern for maintenance costs.
A phenomenon known as the bathtub curve.
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Old December 2nd, 2017, 10:37 PM   #1245
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Originally Posted by :jax: View Post
The "wasp's waist" bottleneck, where all rail traffic, national, regional & local, depends on two tracks, is gone.

However the fundamental problem, that every commute rail share the section Älvsjö-Odenplan, is not. Neither is there any likely improvement for a very long time to come. Relatively minor incidents, e.g. at Älvsjö, shuts down the whole system.
Tell me that. I still had the chance to enjoy the "wasp's waist". I haven't experienced the new system but I would expect that it is a substantial improvement nonetheless as it at least adds a lot of capacity by disentangling at least the Pendeltåg from the other railway services at Centralen.

Vienna has a very dense central S-Bahn backbone as well. It is not as completely centralised as the pendeltåg network but still filled to the brim with trains and large number of S-Bahn lines as well as some regular train services. If I am not withtaken it seems to work much more reliably than that "wasp's waist". I am therefore being confident that the new Citibanan will work somewhat ok.
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 01:29 AM   #1246
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However the fundamental problem, that every commute rail share the section Älvsjö-Odenplan, is not. Neither is there any likely improvement for a very long time to come. Relatively minor incidents, e.g. at Älvsjö, shuts down the whole system.
Copenhagen run 30 S-trains an hour each way through the central stretch during rush hour (and 27/h off peak) and will probably make it a couple more when the new signalling is installed. There are delays, but it works alright. Cant Stockholm do the same?
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 01:57 PM   #1247
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Jeez you are the ultimate apologist. It did cause rather large disruptions and delays of 50 mins which did affect people. Good for you that you were unaffected, a shame for those that were.
At least read my post before you start throwing insults. Did I say everything ran smoothly? I just pointed out that the system actually didn't shut down. I was totally expecting it to when I heard that there had been a derailment at Älvsjö, so I was positively surprised when things in fact ran surprisingly well despite what had happened.

Like I said, I commute every day. I've been delayed plenty of times because of everything from technical malfunctions to accidents to unauthorized people on the tracks. I have a pretty good idea of how well the commuter train system work or doesn't work. It sucks every time anyone get's delayed, but in the grand scheme of things this accident didn't cause chaos which it very well could have.
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 05:38 PM   #1248
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Copenhagen run 30 S-trains an hour each way through the central stretch during rush hour (and 27/h off peak) and will probably make it a couple more when the new signalling is installed. There are delays, but it works alright. Cant Stockholm do the same?
They probably can. But they don't need to. Copenhagen's S-Tog moves 50% more people than the pendeltåg in Stockholm. Yet, the trains in Copenhagen are shorter (170 m vs 215 m in Stockholm). This results in a much bigger need to push a large number of trains through the core section of Copenhagens S-tog network.
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Old December 4th, 2017, 04:39 PM   #1249
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Since we are in a griping mood, SLs flexibility during service interruptions leave a lot to be desired. There is one alternative to the pendeltåg, the 748-49 express buses going Södertälje-Fittja/Kungens kurva/Liljeholmen. Unfortunately that's a low-frequency route. If there are interruptions the buss will be filled up with re-routing pendeltåg passengers, leaving passengers behind on the bus stops, waiting for the next that will also be overfilled and not accepting new passengers, and then the next.

But SL will not provide a single extra bus while other buses go half-empty. It may be an artifact of the tendering system. The bus routes are tendered with an pre-agreed bus schedule. But it shouldn't kill them to have a contingency tender, providing extra buses for whatever part of the transport system that is in trouble at the moment.

Speaking of pendeltåg and scheduling: The new post-Citybanan schedule December 10 is a bit of a disappointment. There are no benefits relative to today's schedule, if anything it's marginally worse. The benefits will (start to) come next autumn, after the usual summer disruptions. Even that is a minor increase of services, barely keeping track with population growth.
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Old December 4th, 2017, 05:25 PM   #1250
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adde View Post
At least read my post before you start throwing insults. Did I say everything ran smoothly? I just pointed out that the system actually didn't shut down. I was totally expecting it to when I heard that there had been a derailment at Älvsjö, so I was positively surprised when things in fact ran surprisingly well despite what had happened.

Like I said, I commute every day. I've been delayed plenty of times because of everything from technical malfunctions to accidents to unauthorized people on the tracks. I have a pretty good idea of how well the commuter train system work or doesn't work. It sucks every time anyone get's delayed, but in the grand scheme of things this accident didn't cause chaos which it very well could have.
If apologist is an insult, then half the things I want to say would definitely be classed as worse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adde
Though I commute on the Pendeltåg, and this latest derailing in Älvsjö actually hasen't affected my commute much at all. There have been a few cancelled "extra" trains so the regular trains have been more crowded than usual, and some of the trains have had to wait for a few minutes to enter a station or to leave a station now and then.
Your words. Your fluffybunny story implies that pretty much it was a minor blip in an otherwise silky smooth running period and that it wasn't a big issue. This of course is total nonsense. It was a big issue. A train derailed, delays of 50 minutes were the norm and if your silver lining is that the entire system didn't shut down given it is quad-tracked at älvjö, then you definitely fit my bill of being an apologist. Either that or an insufferable optimist.

Oh, and this coupled with YET MORE delays today. Pathetic. Then during the delays they start running short trains.

Last edited by Svartmetall; December 4th, 2017 at 09:59 PM.
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Old December 15th, 2017, 02:39 PM   #1251
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https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/st...moter-kritiken
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Old December 21st, 2017, 09:34 AM   #1252
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Old December 21st, 2017, 06:04 PM   #1253
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Some of these projects are incredibly long-term. Seems very odd to not link up the new Odenplan tunnelbana line to Fridhemsplan and then extend to Älvjö.
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Old December 21st, 2017, 06:39 PM   #1254
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Some of these projects are incredibly long-term. Seems very odd to not link up the new Odenplan tunnelbana line to Fridhemsplan and then extend to Älvjö.
It is unfortunately not a surprise. Swedish authorities seem to adore long-long-long-long-long-long-long-long-long-long-long...term planning. It's Sweden, we don't get surprised. Instead we just sigh one more time.
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Old January 7th, 2018, 07:30 PM   #1255
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Construction on Tvärbanan light rail branch to Helenelund is expected to start spring 2018.

https://mitti.se/nyheter/byggstart-skjuts-tvarbanan/



Track work on tram # 7 extension to the central railway station begins this month, with opening planned by 2018.12.13.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...postcount=3990


http://www.urbanrail.net/eu/se/stock...kholm-tram.htm
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Old January 7th, 2018, 11:46 PM   #1256
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Preparation works for line 7 have been underway for quite a while. Sergels torg needed a lot of work.

As for the Tvärbanan, that work is sorely needed. The new district of Annedal was built expecting the Tvärbanan to be there a lot earlier, and is now a bit of a PT blackspot despite having some very nice apartments there (likewise for Ursvik). Will be good to see it there.
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Old January 8th, 2018, 11:15 AM   #1257
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Preparation works for line 7 have been underway for quite a while. Sergels torg needed a lot of work.
While that work has included quite a bit of prep for the tram, the point of those works was that the concrete the street sits on needed replacing due to age and wear. In fact, the tram extention was postponed to give that replacement time to complete.


btw - that urbanrail map is wrong. The Sergels Torg stop is permanently closed and will be removed.



Quote:
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As for the Tvärbanan, that work is sorely needed. The new district of Annedal was built expecting the Tvärbanan to be there a lot earlier, and is now a bit of a PT blackspot despite having some very nice apartments there (likewise for Ursvik). Will be good to see it there.
Wørd.
It was supposed to start construction before the new year (afaik mostly as a PR thing), but haveing it start Q1 makes me think (in the immortal words of Gert Fylking) "ÄNTLIGEN!" When complete it will create new travel routes that will take a few years to really build up to capacity tho, is my guess. The new possible commutes are currently so far from most people's minds that it will take time for people to understand when to use it,
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Old January 13th, 2018, 12:18 PM   #1258
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While that work has included quite a bit of prep for the tram, the point of those works was that the concrete the street sits on needed replacing due to age and wear. In fact, the tram extention was postponed to give that replacement time to complete.
It's interesting because they didn't demolish the whole construction. Did they just put new concrete deck at the top of the old?
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