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Old June 27th, 2011, 12:59 PM   #561
Bruce.Tenmile
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kix111 View Post
Also i hate it when people say 'how can a glassy tower compare with art deco'...
Well in some people's minds it can't. I like them in equal measure, but it takes a stand-out deco building, such as the ESB, to really win my affections, just as it takes a particularly great glassy tower.

Just because someone votes for the ESB, doesn't mean they hate glass. It just means they don't think a standard glass tower is as nice as a very nice deco tower, or at least that's why I've voted for it.
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Old June 27th, 2011, 05:00 PM   #562
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Hey Gunner.

I don't agree with anything you posted ...
Good for your for standing your ground. But it affirms your points I was addressing are just opinions, just as mine are only opinions and neither set should be bandied about as facts.
Quote:
My sig having something to do with vanity or compensating ??

That statement leads me to wonder if you have any idea what your talking about ...
Fair enough. That cut too personal and for that I apologize. I'll rephrase: I think the reasons you've touted the Burj as the "Greatest of our time" don't add up and am always weary when people assume so much upon something that is still brand new. In fact, everything I hear people celebrating about the Burj can often be cited for other structures (like Petronas) that, some would say, do it even better. Except, of course, for the height.

It's easily among the better structures today and is indeed a global icon, I simply haven't heard enough to justify tons of praise other than the fact it's the tallest, and for my money that's not enough.

I've said my piece and know many disagree. Thanks for those that have contributed to the discussion. Cheers.

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Old June 27th, 2011, 06:08 PM   #563
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What a mature post.
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Old June 27th, 2011, 07:07 PM   #564
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from the vote chart i can see final will be between twin and burj khalifa..bravo for all skyscraper...u've made this world soo exciting..i hope this kind of competition is anual thing.maybe every 2years..maybe a real worldcup.with more vote from people around the world..a real trophy..!
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Old June 27th, 2011, 07:26 PM   #565
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idk if burj can beat boc. petronas will probably beat esb tho.
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Old June 28th, 2011, 04:57 AM   #566
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Hi all.

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Originally Posted by GunnerJacket View Post
Good for your for standing your ground. But it affirms your points I was addressing are just opinions, just as mine are only opinions and neither set should be bandied about as facts.
Fair enough. That cut too personal and for that I apologize. I'll rephrase: I think the reasons you've touted the Burj as the "Greatest of our time" don't add up and am always weary when people assume so much upon something that is still brand new. In fact, everything I hear people celebrating about the Burj can often be cited for other structures (like Petronas) that, some would say, do it even better. Except, of course, for the height.

It's easily among the better structures today and is indeed a global icon, I simply haven't heard enough to justify tons of praise other than the fact it's the tallest, and for my money that's not enough.

I've said my piece and know many disagree. Thanks for those that have contributed to the discussion. Cheers.

Hi Gunner.

We'll have to agree to disagree.
True that - just opinions.
Well said reply man.

I really like the design of the BK and I like most of the projects designed by AS - Jin Mao included.
I wrote my sig shortly after coming here. It came from the sorrow for the outlook of taller structures post 9/11 and then the joy of mans first freestanding structure taller than any guyed mast in decades.

From the first day I heard of the BK I decided to learn all I could about it, gather all the info I could, and collect all the pics I could. When someone cracked the construction dbase I collected every scrap of info there was. I then broke down many of the PDF's and posted on many aspects during construction - made 'my plan' and many other things. My knowledge on the structure even let me contribute in a small way in keeping Emaar honest during the CTBUH height ratification process.

I watch and collect pics / info on over a dozen projects around the world but none have amassed the GB's the BK has (obviously because it's my fave by far) and it's the technical details I'm most interested in.

I agree everyone has their own fave and the BK isn't it based on height alone, but perhaps if they were into the technical details and had as much info as I do they may feel differently.

Peace.



On another note ....
this world cup brings out some interesting discussion (and some not ...) and is a great idea from Jan. IMO it definitely adds some fun to an already great forum.


Ray.
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Old June 28th, 2011, 02:58 PM   #567
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fury View Post
I wrote my sig shortly after coming here. It came from the sorrow for the outlook of taller structures post 9/11 and then the joy of mans first freestanding structure taller than any guyed mast in decades.
Interesting take. Given that association you've made between the Burj and 9/11, what is you're emotional reaction to the construction happening at the World Trade Center site? Will a rebuild at that particular location hold as visceral a connection as the new pinnacle of Dubai?

Quote:
From the first day I heard of the BK I decided to learn all I could about it, gather all the info I could, and collect all the pics I could. When someone cracked the construction dbase I collected every scrap of info there was. I then broke down many of the PDF's and posted on many aspects during construction - made 'my plan' and many other things. My knowledge on the structure even let me contribute in a small way in keeping Emaar honest during the CTBUH height ratification process.
I won't bog the conversation on one structure, but may I ask then what of the design details do you consider the most unique, innovative or special about the project, apart from the efforts to reach such height?
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Old June 28th, 2011, 07:26 PM   #568
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most people think esb is a big,gigantic and stand tall but if we compare both size,gifc is bigger,more gigantic and more awesome..it is because the scale of the building in those cities..here are the diagram..esb look small and gifc look so big and outstanding..from those diagram,i can say that gifc is better building than esb futhermore,it look glassy,unique,modern,flawless.moreover,it just win best asia supertal 2011..thats mean ctbuh recognised them as one of the best supertall on earth..
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Old June 28th, 2011, 07:45 PM   #569
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Originally Posted by ben_23 View Post
most people think esb is a big,gigantic and stand tall but if we compare both size,gifc is bigger,more gigantic and more awesome..it is because the scale of the building in those cities..here are the diagram..esb look small and gifc look so big and outstanding..from those diagram,i can say that gifc is better building than esb futhermore,it look glassy,unique,modern,flawless.moreover,it just win best asia supertal 2011..thats mean ctbuh recognised them as one of the best supertall on earth..
agree!
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Old June 28th, 2011, 08:16 PM   #570
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben_23 View Post
most people think esb is a big,gigantic and stand tall but if we compare both size,gifc is bigger,more gigantic and more awesome..it is because the scale of the building in those cities..here are the diagram..esb look small and gifc look so big and outstanding..from those diagram,i can say that gifc is better building than esb futhermore,it look glassy,unique,modern,flawless.moreover,it just win best asia supertal 2011..thats mean ctbuh recognised them as one of the best supertall on earth..
I entirely disagree with all that. YOU may like the GIFC more than the ESB, and that diagram may confirm that for you, but it does the opposite for me and we are both entitled to that.

The part I have highlighted is something which others have brought up before and I think speaks to a certain level of misapprehension.

Previously, a poster did not understand how the Shanghai WFC won an award for best skyscraper of 2008, and yet had been beaten in the competition by the Chrysler Building. First let's ignore the fact that this award was obviously NOT voted for by the same people who voted in this competition, because that should really go without saying, but said poster seemed to actually believe that because the SWFC had been deemed the best Skyscraper completed in 2008, that that meant it was seen as the best building EVER.

You seem to have a similar grasp on things. I was not aware of this particular CTBUH award, but how does the GIFC being crowned the best skyscraper in Asia for 2011 (which I probably agree with) mean it is one of the greatest on Earth? 2011 is just one year. Skyscrapers have been being built for over 100 years. Also, Asia is just one of 3-6 (depending on definition) continents.

You may think that the GIFC IS one of the best building ever, but winning the Best Asian Tower 2011 isn't evidence of that.
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Old June 28th, 2011, 09:18 PM   #571
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I've seen both, GIFC and ESB. ESB looks way better, 'nuff said.
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Old June 28th, 2011, 09:24 PM   #572
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And if GIFC was built in NYC and EBS was built in Guangzhou i think the result will most likely to be the opposite.

And when did he say that winning ctbuh was the sole reason it was better than EBS? From what he was saying it feels more like a reinforcement of the qualities he described of GIFC than anything else. He actually added this statement using "moreover" which you did not even bother to quote.
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Old June 28th, 2011, 09:27 PM   #573
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i bet gifc look even BETTER then esb in next 80 years and if gifc build in 1930 it still lot BETTER then esb
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Old June 28th, 2011, 09:29 PM   #574
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I've seen both, GIFC and ESB. ESB looks way better, 'nuff said.
that's your opinion, others have other opinions, deleting the antenna from the comparison is kinda unfair even when it doesnt count to the height, and alsthough its taller then, GIFC still looks more massive overall. GIFC is a simple modern nice design and ESB is a complex classic nice design. every man its own taste and i think both buildings are nice, but won't suit for the top 3, but thats just me
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Old June 28th, 2011, 09:30 PM   #575
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i bet gifc look even BETTER then esb in next 80 years and if gifc build in 1930 it still lot BETTER then esb
What?
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Old June 28th, 2011, 09:34 PM   #576
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What?
what wrong?
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Old June 28th, 2011, 10:22 PM   #577
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i bet gifc look even BETTER then esb in next 80 years and if gifc build in 1930 it still lot BETTER then esb
Uhh what are you talking about?
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Old June 28th, 2011, 10:33 PM   #578
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Uhh what are you talking about?
i think its pretty obvious what he means, he meant to say that if GIFC was build in the 1930s it would have looked better or if it was even build in 80 years and that the time it was build doesnt matter for him in the architectural sense oh and that in 80 years it will look nicer than esb too i suppose, nah okay maybe its not that clear at all
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Old June 28th, 2011, 11:13 PM   #579
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gifc is bigger,more gigantic and more awesome
...

from those diagram,i can say that gifc is better building than esb futhermore,it look glassy,unique,modern,flawless.
Would you mind explaining the bold parts for me? I'd simply like to understand your reasoning a bit better. Thanks.
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Old June 28th, 2011, 11:14 PM   #580
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i think its pretty obvious what he means, he meant to say that if GIFC was build in the 1930s it would have looked better or if it was even build in 80 years and that the time it was build doesnt matter for him in the architectural sense oh and that in 80 years it will look nicer than esb too i suppose, nah okay maybe its not that clear at all
Your post has just a bit more sense than his But if we wonder how these to will be received in this 80 years in future, I think it will be even worse for gifc. Because now its fresh and people haven't enough time to "know" this tower. It's always like that with new things. They may be tacky and people still may like it for some time until the "wow" effect past. And when this happen, and both towers will be "old" it will be way easier to see whats what. And obviously gifc is just tube covered with undetailed glass facade. Nothing innovative really.
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