The SELECT thread...

[Rider]

When I first spoke with Select 5 or 6 years ago, they sent me a copy of the SPA and were adament that no changes were allowed to be made to the terms and conditions.

I was unhappy with some of the terms but signed it in any case. Now they want to have their cake and eat it.

LPP owners, stand firm and don't sign otherwise we will face years of high service charges and the same issues as Point owners have faced.

[Dubai_Steve]

Didn't we discuss this before for the Point handover. In the end everyone signed the addendums to get handover.

[Anjam]

I think everyone at the Point ended up signing it

[FWIW]

Originally Posted by Anjam

I think everyone at the Point ended up signing it

But with hindsight would they still do it?

Are there any Point investors who are also Torch investors?

[Anjam]

Some of the comments from the Point investors are that it hasn't really made any difference to the rentability (is that a word?) of the property.

[glover]

Article 7(1) of the Government of Dubai Executive Council Resolution No. 6 of 2010 clearly forbids the developer from refusing to handover the completed unit of an off-plan apartment if the buyer has fullfiled all his obligations.

If Select insists on signing the addendum, take all documents to RERA/Legal Department in LD.

ARTICLE 7(1)
The Master developer or sub-developer may not, when the real estate project is completed and the developer has obtained the Certificate of Completion from the competent authorities, refuse to handover or register the real estate unit under the name of the Buyer in the Real Estate Registry, so long as the Buyer has fulfilled all his contractual obligations, even if there was any other financial obligations due to the Developer from the Buyer not arising from the Sale Contract of the real estate unit. (my translation)

[ZARO786]

Dear The Torch Investors,

I have also recently received an email confirmation from Select of the proposed handover and the charges that has been applied to our investments. Like all of you, I am also somewhat baffled by the high fees that has been applied esp :

1) Building Charges and 2) Pre reg and Misc charges

I have not known any developer to charge in excess of 20aed/sq ft in the current economic climate. I think those of you who are familiar to Dubai Marina are aware of the current rate of charges which are in force with different projects.

"Captital Reserve Fund" - again this too is beyond me - seems like some sort of a contingency fund.

"Provisional" Chilled Water Charge for a/c - again I am not too convinced of this. Knowing Select - the only way is up!

Oqood "Admin" fee - see esponse below from CEO of RERA

"Affection Plan Charges" - What is this ??

Having read the a/c sheet in detail, I decided to write to CEO of RERA fro clarification - Marwan Bin Ghulaita as I have dealt with him on number of occasions in the past in relation to The Torch project. Please find a response from him:

Ceo Office
From: Marwan Bin Ghulaita (Marwan@rera.gov.ae)
Sent: 14 April 2011 14:04:20
To:
Cc: Ceo Office (ceooffice@rera.gov.ae)


Dear ,
Thanks for your contact. As I read from your email if the building is ready there is no need for Oqood registration it should be registered in land system directly and the fees is 1% of the amount unless agreed otherwise on SPA. Regarding service charge it should be approved by RERA so ask your developer for the approved letter. Regarding delay and other things you should look at the spa and see how it deals with this issue.
I hope its all clear and if you need more info you can contact land dept registration section as this process handled by them.
Best Regards,,,
" The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams" E. Roosevelt

Eng. Marwan Bin Ghulaita
CEO
RERA
+97142030333 [/SIZE][/B]

We need to ask Select for transparency and proof on all the fees that has been levied.
In addition, we should ask Select for an approval letter for the building charges since this has to be approved and stamped by RERA.

[RedWayne28thfloor]

It's a bloody minefield!!

[Rider]

Thanks for sharing that.

Isn't OQOOD simply a database for developers to register the owner details of off-plan properties which haven't been completed? Once completed, the Land Registry should then come into play so why do owners details need to registered with OQOOD at this stage in the game?

I too am baffled by the other charges and will be seeking clarification before I even consider paying them.

[FWIW]

Originally Posted by glover

Article 7(1) of the Government of Dubai Executive Council Resolution No. 6 of 2010 clearly forbids the developer from refusing to handover the completed unit of an off-plan apartment if the buyer has fullfiled all his obligations.

If Select insists on signing the addendum, take all documents to RERA/Legal Department in LD.

ARTICLE 7(1)
The Master developer or sub-developer may not, when the real estate project is completed and the developer has obtained the Certificate of Completion from the competent authorities, refuse to handover or register the real estate unit under the name of the Buyer in the Real Estate Registry, so long as the Buyer has fulfilled all his contractual obligations, even if there was any other financial obligations due to the Developer from the Buyer not arising from the Sale Contract of the real estate unit. (my translation)

Thanks for that Glover - I did a quick search and found this informative article:

https://www.zawya.com/story.cfm/sidZ...20of%202010%20

Also this is quite useful:

http://altamimi.newsweaver.ie/Newsletter/kalr5lz78an

[shakka]

Originally Posted by ZARO786

Dear The Torch Investors,

I have also recently received an email confirmation from Select of the proposed handover and the charges that has been applied to our investments. Like all of you, I am also somewhat baffled by the high fees that has been applied esp :

1) Building Charges and 2) Pre reg and Misc charges

I have not known any developer to charge in excess of 20aed/sq ft in the current economic climate. I think those of you who are familiar to Dubai Marina are aware of the current rate of charges which are in force with different projects.

"Captital Reserve Fund" - again this too is beyond me - seems like some sort of a contingency fund.

"Provisional" Chilled Water Charge for a/c - again I am not too convinced of this. Knowing Select - the only way is up!

Oqood "Admin" fee - see esponse below from CEO of RERA

"Affection Plan Charges" - What is this ??

Having read the a/c sheet in detail, I decided to write to CEO of RERA fro clarification - Marwan Bin Ghulaita as I have dealt with him on number of occasions in the past in relation to The Torch project. Please find a response from him:

Ceo Office
From: Marwan Bin Ghulaita (Marwan@rera.gov.ae)
Sent: 14 April 2011 14:04:20
To:
Cc: Ceo Office (ceooffice@rera.gov.ae)


Dear ,
Thanks for your contact. As I read from your email if the building is ready there is no need for Oqood registration it should be registered in land system directly and the fees is 1% of the amount unless agreed otherwise on SPA. Regarding service charge it should be approved by RERA so ask your developer for the approved letter. Regarding delay and other things you should look at the spa and see how it deals with this issue.
I hope its all clear and if you need more info you can contact land dept registration section as this process handled by them.
Best Regards,,,
" The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams" E. Roosevelt

Eng. Marwan Bin Ghulaita
CEO
RERA
+97142030333 [/SIZE][/B]

We need to ask Select for transparency and proof on all the fees that has been levied.
In addition, we should ask Select for an approval letter for the building charges since this has to be approved and stamped by RERA.

It would be great if we had a set procedure to follow that would allow us handover without signing addendum or paying oqood fees if they are already covered by our law 13 land reg payment request some years ago. I feel that Select's reps will just ignore you unless you had a solicitor with you to prove that they are breaking the law. If everyone stood firm then this would happen but EVERYONE has to stand firm.

[shakka]

Has anyone on LPP had goodwill charge credited to them?

[Anjam]

Originally Posted by shakka

Has anyone on LPP had goodwill charge credited to them?

Yes

[Dubai_Steve]

yes, most seem to have, but not all.

[Dubai_Steve]

Originally Posted by Rider

Thanks for sharing that.

Isn't OQOOD simply a database for developers to register the owner details of off-plan properties which haven't been completed? Once completed, the Land Registry should then come into play so why do owners details need to registered with OQOOD at this stage in the game?

I too am baffled by the other charges and will be seeking clarification before I even consider paying them.

I don't think we should have to pay this AED 3000 (£500) oqood fee. We need clarification.

[Psofos]

Originally Posted by Anjam

Based on a discussion I had many years ago with Select, they said either owner can go. I have sent them another email to confirm this.

I left my wife behind and went on my own but ensured that she signed an authorisation and also attached a copy of her passport. This was also witnessed by a third party and his passport copy was also attached. Make sure the page in the passport bearing the signature is copied and that it matches the signature on the letter

Louise will advise you on current procedure acceptable to SG. I think she has a template. If not, pm me and I will send you a template which you can pass by SG before setting off to Dubai.

Psofos.

[Psofos]

nn

[mackie1964]

All the other developers that I had to deal with in the past charged me AED275 or 295 or nothing at all for the registeration fee

My unit is already registered so, no oqood fees from me. RERA will need a NOC Letter from the developer to release the title deed, this is where I can see me having a fight also

@Steve; The chilling is obviously central and there is no individual units for apartments. The developer will have to pay the utility bills and divide it by the overall sqft in the building and pass it back on to the owner through the service charges. Its normal practice in 90% of Dubai Marina Towers. You will have to charge your tenant the AED5/sqft upfront as part of your tenancy agreement or, increase the rent and recover it that way. That's what I do

[MANUTD]

Originally Posted by RedWayne28thfloor

Did any point owners who didn't sign the addendum manage to get their keys?

THERE WAS A LOT OF "TALK" ABOUT PHONING THE POLICE TO GET OUR KEYS AT HANDOVER BUT WE ALL CAVED IN AT THE END -- NOT THAT I WILL CAVE IN AGAIN WITH SG --

[smshah]

Dear Fellow investors

i received a summary of account for my torch apartment. i'm on a SP payment plan so i have paid 90%. On the statement it says a late payment charge of approx 2950 DHS. I queried this and select said i was late on my third installment due 1st june 06 by six months!!!!!. I looked at my receipts and found the receipt for my third installment dated 7/06/06!!!!! WATCH YOUR STATEMENTS LADS!!!!