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Old September 27th, 2011, 03:21 PM   #221
brisavoine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Q: Does/Do your country/ies have signs for cities in neighbouring countries?
A: We talk about taxes
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Old September 27th, 2011, 03:25 PM   #222
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Godius, frankly, you shouldn't talk about things you don't seem to know anything about. It's annoying to read factually wrong statements after factualy wrong statements.
Quote:
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It's a fact that you can't get much tax from factory workers.
The taxes didn't come from the workers (no income tax back then!), but from capital taxes (paid by the bosses) and taxes on merchandise.
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Originally Posted by Godius View Post
The state-revenues were used to highly improve infrastructure in the southern part.
The state revenues coming in a large measure from Wallonia were used in a large measure to improve the port of Antwerp and build the canal between Antwerp and Brussels. Both of which are not exactly located in Wallonia...
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Old September 27th, 2011, 04:10 PM   #223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brisavoine View Post
Godius, frankly, you shouldn't talk about things you don't seem to know anything about. It's annoying to read factually wrong statements after factualy wrong statements.

The taxes didn't come from the workers (no income tax back then!), but from capital taxes (paid by the bosses) and taxes on merchandise.

The state revenues coming in a large measure from Wallonia were used in a large measure to improve the port of Antwerp and build the canal between Antwerp and Brussels. Both of which are not exactly located in Wallonia...
I can refute your arguments, a specially your last argument, in this topic.
But maybe it is better to start a new thread and respect the topic starter his thread.
Contact me if you are in favor of this idea, maybe we can start a thread about this discussion together.
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Old September 27th, 2011, 07:42 PM   #224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muttie View Post
image hosted on flickr



Sign for Ceuta (Sebta), Spain - on the Moroccan A1.

A very strange detail.

When I watched the photo I asked myself which city was signales abroad. I needed to read the explains to know it was "Ceuta".

It is the problem with the Arabic-Roman alphabeths... we write them "like it sounds" and Sebta seems too different.

The "C" at Ceuta is pronounced like the TH at "think".
So compare CE-U-TA with SEB-TA

I am sure that any Arabic speaker will not need translation into Roman characters
And any speaker of any language with Roman characters maybe will do not understand the translation as well as he will find Ceuta in all maps.
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Old September 27th, 2011, 09:17 PM   #225
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I think that they would understand if they were expecting it
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Old September 27th, 2011, 09:37 PM   #226
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A driver who speaks Arabic do not need the translation

A driver who doesn't speak Arabic will not need a translation according like it sounds but the name it will appear in Roman alphabeth.

We are not talking about only languages but alphabeths too.
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Old September 27th, 2011, 09:56 PM   #227
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Sebta is the moroccan name of Ceuta (spanish name). Since Morocco is claiming the city, they will not put its spanish name. The city is considered part of Morocco here.

2 more pictures I made:

image hosted on flickr

image hosted on flickr
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Old September 27th, 2011, 10:04 PM   #228
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Taking away territorial reasons, I think the translation is not useful for drivers.

Most of them will go there to get a ferry.

How many of them will have a ticket "Sebta-Algeciras"?

Will a not Arabic speaker driver be looking for Ceuta or for Sebta?

There are many cases where they write the name in one language and in the map you find in other language. It is not "usually" problem if names are similar. When they are very different ones the problem can begin.

But here we have a case where there is a bilingual? signal.
"bilingual?" because cities are translated to French except Ceuta that it is translated like it sounds. That city has not translation into French.
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Old September 27th, 2011, 10:23 PM   #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alserrod View Post
Taking away territorial reasons, I think the translation is not useful for drivers.

Most of them will go there to get a ferry.

How many of them will have a ticket "Sebta-Algeciras"?

Will a not Arabic speaker driver be looking for Ceuta or for Sebta?

There are many cases where they write the name in one language and in the map you find in other language. It is not "usually" problem if names are similar. When they are very different ones the problem can begin.

But here we have a case where there is a bilingual? signal.
"bilingual?" because cities are translated to French except Ceuta that it is translated like it sounds. That city has not translation into French.
Moroccans do not take the ferry from Sebta anymore. Tanger Med port is now connected to our national highway network. Taking the ferry from/to Sebta = losing time.

I understand what you're saying but in Morocco we only use arabic and french. In arabic and french we read it Sebta. In Spain they put arabic signs for Tangier and Algeciras for moroccans. In nothern Morocco they have signs in spanish for the spanish tourists. Maybe it's a political thing for the highway signs (maybe they refuse to use the spanish name).

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Old September 27th, 2011, 11:40 PM   #230
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I still think that Sebta is understandable if you're looking for a sign to Ceuta
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Old September 28th, 2011, 01:37 AM   #231
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In the opposite side the signals only say "Marruecos"... but there are only two points to cross the border and you decide... the Mediterranean or the Atlantic border. Less than 6 km between them.

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Old September 28th, 2011, 01:42 AM   #232
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At viamichelin.fr all Moroccan cities are written in French but Ceuta is write like it.
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Old September 28th, 2011, 01:50 AM   #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alserrod View Post
In the opposite side the signals only say "Marruecos"... but there are only two points to cross the border and you decide... the Mediterranean or the Atlantic border. Less than 6 km between them.
What???

Quote:
Originally Posted by alserrod View Post
At viamichelin.fr all Moroccan cities are written in French but Ceuta is write like it.
Ceuta is the international name. We use Sebta only in Morocco. The same for Melilla, it's moroccan name is Melilia.
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Old September 28th, 2011, 02:10 AM   #234
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I mean that there are only two custom borders at Ceuta, which connects with P-4703 and N-13
(at Melilla there are four)


This is why obviously anywhere you go outside the city is Morocco and you can choose only the point to cross the border. In the signal it appears the international border (it is usual to put it 1 km before in all Spanish roads)... but in general they should put the name of the border or the name of the nearest city after it.
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Old September 28th, 2011, 02:11 AM   #235
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And... as I said... Andorra only writes Espanya and Franša. In fact they have only those two borders... and four main roads, so everyone knows which direction they are taken if going to France or to Spain (or CG-3, CG-4 which goes to the interior)
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Old September 28th, 2011, 02:16 AM   #236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alserrod View Post
I mean that there are only two custom borders at Ceuta, which connects with P-4703 and N-13
(at Melilla there are four)


This is why obviously anywhere you go outside the city is Morocco and you can choose only the point to cross the border. In the signal it appears the international border (it is usual to put it 1 km before in all Spanish roads)... but in general they should put the name of the border or the name of the nearest city after it.
There's only one crossing point called Bab Sebta (Puerta de Ceuta).
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Old September 28th, 2011, 03:33 PM   #237
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I answer in the Border thread
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Old November 9th, 2011, 02:00 AM   #238
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Motorway Madrid-Vigo has a point only 15 km away from Portugal.

In that point there is a cross to another motorway for entering Portugal and connecting its network.

In the cross, the signal indicates only the first Portuguese city you will find (nothing related to the border, to "Portugal" only, or to the city located in the border).
They just write a "P" after the name of the city.


http://maps.google.es/?ll=41.914605,...244.87,,0,-8.5
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Old November 9th, 2011, 05:29 AM   #239
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I've never seen ovals in Spain. Are there any other?
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Old November 9th, 2011, 06:24 PM   #240
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I must say that it is the first oval I see.

The motorway is the main to fo from southern Galicia to almost, almost any other point of Spain but passes just very close to Portugal and there is a little motorway, half in each country, to connect different motorways.

As I said, instead of writting "Portugal" or a little town near the border, they wrote the name of the main cross when you arrive inside Portugal.

But it is the first oval I see in Spain.
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