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Old January 13th, 2014, 11:00 PM   #641
Verso
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There's a place called "Aiea" in Hawaii?
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Old January 13th, 2014, 11:06 PM   #642
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Now you (or at least your neighbors to the southeast) know where all your missing vowels went to.
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Old January 13th, 2014, 11:48 PM   #643
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Quote:
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I didn't know that that was the definition of control city. Outside the Northeast, they seem to be, mostly, major cities....
Don't get me wrong, I gave a description of the type of town commonly selected, not an official definition. The actual selections are on the list that you found, though that list does not always reflect actual signage, let alone the principle that the control city should be the most distant focal point on the distance signs (which follows from the MUTCD).

I don't think that you can say that 'town closest to next Interstate interchange' is a North-East principle only. You will find it throughout the country and, in adapted forms, in many parts of the world. The principle has yielded some of the smallest control cities of the US well outside of the North-East. On the other hand, the North-Eastern state of Pennsylvania plays a key role in the network of the North-East and it stands out with some rather odd control cities that are never far away. I do appreciate that, in light of the dense population of the North-East, the same principle may very well work out differently on routes in the North-East when compared to the emptier parts of the US. In the latter, Interstate junctions are further between and they are more likely to be situated to a city of primary importance. So distances posted on signs are bigger and the next major city is more likely to feature as control city once you leave the North-East. Even though control cities seen elsewhere do not always justify this conclusion. Van Horn, Texas anyone?

Quote:
it'll just be the next major city rather than the next three, and you'll almost never see one for which you'd have to exit the route you're on and take another one (so, no "Brussels" on the French A1).
Just signposting the next three cities does not add a lot, other than information for motorists travelling to that very destination. But what you see in many European countries is a list of two or three cities with different sizes or roles in the network. First up is then a city of regional importance only, the second town signposted is not necessarily the next regional town but the main town in a much bigger part of the country or a town close to major motorway junctions. The latter reference is quite useful for longer-distance travel, whereas the former is good for regional traffic. The French even have three of these tiers of towns used in motorway signposting. Useful as I think that this concept is, I do think that some countries place too much information on some of their guide signs. French pull-through signs with some four or five control cities on them are a bit over the top for me.

You may be interested to learn that the current European trend of signposting towns on intersecting roads is a relatively novel thing in most countries. I think that the principle is good, however, since it is one of the factors that enables a selection of control cities beyond the next motorway intersection. You don't need to select a minor town close to an interchange in order to show people heading for the intersecting road that they are still on track, but directly show the control city of the intersecting route to demonstrate the same. Even though this practice, too, has been applied somewhat over-enthusiastically on the old continent.
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Last edited by -Pino-; January 14th, 2014 at 11:37 AM.
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Old January 14th, 2014, 12:16 AM   #644
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Now you (or at least your neighbors to the southeast) know where all your missing vowels went to.
Aiea should be twinned with Trst.
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Old January 14th, 2014, 04:55 PM   #645
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I was thinking "Krk." I know there were stupid jokes over here during the Bosnian conflict about the apparent shortage of vowels in Serbo-Croatian. (Do we still call it, or them, Serbo-Croatian?) Wasn't sure if that "problem" existed in Slovenian. And I wouldn't make fun of other languages. Except French. Which I know well enough to get away with it.
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Old January 14th, 2014, 05:04 PM   #646
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I was thinking "Krk."
Kirk Douglas?
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Old January 14th, 2014, 05:15 PM   #647
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krk
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Old January 14th, 2014, 05:50 PM   #648
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Aiea should be twinned with Trst.
There isn't any place officially called Trst.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old January 14th, 2014, 06:14 PM   #649
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Quote:
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I know, I've been there a few times and my grandparents lived there for some time. But it's pronounced like Kirk (Douglas).

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There isn't any place officially called Trst.
Except in Italy.
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Old January 15th, 2014, 03:48 PM   #650
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I know, I've been there a few times and my grandparents lived there for some time. But it's pronounced like Kirk (Douglas).
And before 2000 it was pronounced like Keith .

Seriously, even without vowels at all I can pronounce Krk (Thanks to that r ).
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Old January 15th, 2014, 04:16 PM   #651
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Keith?
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Old January 15th, 2014, 04:26 PM   #652
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Keith It got retired and replaced with Kirk .

But by that logic I should have changed my name in 2011 because it got retired in Australia. But it is still there in the Eastern Pacific, so...

Anyway, this is really off-topic .
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Old January 15th, 2014, 07:30 PM   #653
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I once said on here that I couldn't say 'Krk', the nearest I could get was 'Kirk' and someone said, 'Good, now just take the "i" away'.
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Old January 15th, 2014, 08:21 PM   #654
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Of course you have to say "Kirk" in American English, not British English, otherwise you end up saying it without "r".
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Old January 15th, 2014, 08:50 PM   #655
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Brits would say something like Kööck.
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Old January 16th, 2014, 10:57 AM   #656
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Do we still call it, or them, Serbo-Croatian?
The mere name used for that language can be a political statement, and that might offend someone. But in the end, it's your choice whether to give a .... about someone getting offended or not.

From here on, let's assume you do.

If you only have a conversation with people living in a certain country (or in the case of BiH, in certain part of it), you can quite safely call the language like the people involved themselves do, namely Serbian, Croatian, Bosnian or Montenegrin.

The problem arises when you try to have a conversation with several of these at the same time. If there are no Bosniaks, then you can say Serbo-Croatian. If there are, maybe you can say "the language spoken in these countries".

When talking with each other in this language, these people (when from different countries and very well aware of these problems) may call it simply "our language". Obviously that doesn't work with you. "Your language" may work if there are no others present.

The University of Helsinki has some courses in this language. Politically neutral, they call it "Central South Slavic" - as compared with Slovenian ("western") and Bulgarian-Macedonian ("eastern"). I've never seen anyone else call it like that, though.

As for me, I call it Serbian, Croatian, Bosnian or Montenegrin in situations in which I only refer to the language spoken in one country/area. Otherwise I call it Serbo-Croatian.
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Old January 16th, 2014, 08:45 PM   #657
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OulaL View Post
The mere name used for that language can be a political statement, and that might offend someone. But in the end, it's your choice whether to give a .... about someone getting offended or not.

From here on, let's assume you do.

If you only have a conversation with people living in a certain country (or in the case of BiH, in certain part of it), you can quite safely call the language like the people involved themselves do, namely Serbian, Croatian, Bosnian or Montenegrin.

The problem arises when you try to have a conversation with several of these at the same time. If there are no Bosniaks, then you can say Serbo-Croatian. If there are, maybe you can say "the language spoken in these countries".

When talking with each other in this language, these people (when from different countries and very well aware of these problems) may call it simply "our language". Obviously that doesn't work with you. "Your language" may work if there are no others present.

The University of Helsinki has some courses in this language. Politically neutral, they call it "Central South Slavic" - as compared with Slovenian ("western") and Bulgarian-Macedonian ("eastern"). I've never seen anyone else call it like that, though.

As for me, I call it Serbian, Croatian, Bosnian or Montenegrin in situations in which I only refer to the language spoken in one country/area. Otherwise I call it Serbo-Croatian.
Demography lessons on our University name this language as Serbo-croatian and distinguishes three dialects according to how certain people as "what"? Personally, I can't recognize Serbs from Croats according to language. After all, my friend from Vojvodina can not as well.
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Old January 17th, 2014, 12:52 AM   #658
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Originally Posted by OulaL View Post

The University of Helsinki has some courses in this language. Politically neutral, they call it "Central South Slavic" - as compared with Slovenian ("western") and Bulgarian-Macedonian ("eastern"). I've never seen anyone else call it like that, though.
Which works fine, unless there is a Greek nearby, and then all hell breaks loose
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Old January 17th, 2014, 12:55 AM   #659
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Demography lessons on our University name this language as Serbo-croatian and distinguishes three dialects according to how certain people as "what"? Personally, I can't recognize Serbs from Croats according to language. After all, my friend from Vojvodina can not as well.
Yes: štokavski, kajkavski, čakavski (last two only in Croatian). Ask a Serb or a Croat to say "bread" in their language, it's very different.
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Old February 10th, 2014, 11:40 PM   #660
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I've just discovered this tourist (brown) sign for Socerb (Slovenia) in Italy. That's interesting, because I've never seen a tourist sign for a place in another country.

http://goo.gl/maps/xMPlz
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