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Old July 27th, 2011, 08:00 PM   #61
durden5573
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I love that they are rebuilding the Stadt Schloss, but I'm disappointed at the modern block facing the Spree. I would rather they left that wall out and expose the 2nd inner courtyard to the Spree, try to integrate the Spree with the building a bit more than a bland wall.....
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Old July 27th, 2011, 11:57 PM   #62
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the starkness of the modern Spree-side of the new building with its wall-like characteristics will probably emerge as a joke being referred to as the second coming of the Berlin Wall...out of place, unattractive, inhibiting, characterless, and literally a barrier to what was once a grand place.
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Old July 28th, 2011, 11:41 AM   #63
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At the moment I am working on an initiative against the modernist east facade of the City Palace.
I'll let you all know when it's finished so you can drop in.
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Old July 28th, 2011, 04:14 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keepthepast View Post
the starkness of the modern Spree-side of the new building with its wall-like characteristics will probably emerge as a joke being referred to as the second coming of the Berlin Wall...out of place, unattractive, inhibiting, characterless, and literally a barrier to what was once a grand place.
+1
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Old August 9th, 2011, 01:27 AM   #65
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I found this when looking for color pictures of the Stadtschloss for a new 3D I'm making. The video is made of photos showing the history of this emblematic building and recreations of the rebuilt palace as well.

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Old August 12th, 2011, 05:26 AM   #66
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thought you might be interested

Another restoration project:

Koenigsberg

http://www.altstadt.ru/
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Old August 20th, 2011, 02:13 AM   #67
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Now it's +2.

Quote:
Originally Posted by keepthepast View Post
the starkness of the modern Spree-side of the new building with its wall-like characteristics will probably emerge as a joke being referred to as the second coming of the Berlin Wall...out of place, unattractive, inhibiting, characterless, and literally a barrier to what was once a grand place.
And the same design will be applied to the western façade of the Schlüterhof (which by the way, was also Renaissance).
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Old August 20th, 2011, 02:10 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keepthepast View Post
the starkness of the modern Spree-side of the new building with its wall-like characteristics will probably emerge as a joke being referred to as the second coming of the Berlin Wall...out of place, unattractive, inhibiting, characterless, and literally a barrier to what was once a grand place.
so a prefect architectural representative of the Berlin Republic...
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Old August 20th, 2011, 02:19 PM   #69
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... whereas the architecture of the Bonn Republic was characterized by a dull colorless brutalism. What does this tell us about West Germany?
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Old August 22nd, 2011, 10:19 PM   #70
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A fascinating project. I must go back to Berlin and see how the city looks now having last seen it in 1991.

The idea of recreating three sides of a traditional building and creating a modernist fourth side does seem a rather laboured point by the architect and I guess that Berliners will see this as a money-saving ploy rather than an architectural statement (maybe it is, I don't know) but you can see the logic behind it.

Had the building been repaired during the years following WWII then there would be little argument in reconstructing it as near to the original as possible. However, to have a break of well over half a century between the destruction of the original and the reconstruction means that the site has accumulated a lot of history in the intervening years - not least being a headquarters building for the German Democratic Republic.

Whatever you think of that era, it was one of the most important in German and European history and can't just be erased from history. I guess that in designing the fourth facade in this way, the architect is attempting to recall the monolithic buildings of the communist era.
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Old August 23rd, 2011, 02:57 PM   #71
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That history has already been erased. At least in that particular location. There is just a green grassland that one has to deal with.

Regarding the one modern facade: the original building had some kind of appendix at that location,
because the building was grown over centuries, but there was no reason to reconstruct such a appendix.
So there was no facade worth of beeing reconstructed on that side of the building.
I think not to fake a historism facade there was a good idea.

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Old August 23rd, 2011, 07:24 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wunderknabe View Post
That history has already been erased. At least in that particular location. There is just a green grassland that one has to deal with.

Regarding the one modern facade: the original building had some kind of appendix at that location,
because the building was grown over centuries, but there was no reason to reconstruct such a appendix.
So there was no facade worth of beeing reconstructed on that side of the building.
I think not to fake a historism facade there was a good idea.
In fact, what you call an "appendix" was, along with the transverse wing between Schlosshöfen I and II, the essential part of this palace before Schlüter's project of 1699-1706. It cointained the living quarters of King Frederick I, the Schlossapotheke, the Braunschweig and Elector's galeries, the chapel and others, at a time in which the other wings were little more than simple corridors.

Last edited by GFM 3D; August 23rd, 2011 at 07:35 PM.
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Old August 23rd, 2011, 11:59 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wunderknabe View Post
That history has already been erased. At least in that particular location. There is just a green grassland that one has to deal with.

Regarding the one modern facade: the original building had some kind of appendix at that location,
because the building was grown over centuries, but there was no reason to reconstruct such a appendix.
So there was no facade worth of beeing reconstructed on that side of the building.
I think not to fake a historism facade there was a good idea.
It is an interesting argument, although it does seem from the model that there was an original facade there before the 'appendix' was added. That begs the question - do you want to restore the building to how it originally looked or how it looked just prior to being destroyed.

What I mean by 'erasing something from history' though goes further than just demolishing a building. If you see a large patch of grass in the centre of a city, you are likely to ask 'what used to be there?' However, if you see a building that to all appearances looks like it was built in the 18c, to the uninitiated it is going to look as if that is how things always have been.

Having first visited Berlin just two years before the wall came down, I'm a bit surprised that so little of it now remains and yet it shaped the history of the post-war era and its fall heralded the end of the communist era. Maybe the truth is that Berlin wants to forget about its twentieth century history and go back to an era that it feels more comfortable with.
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Old August 24th, 2011, 06:09 PM   #74
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to bad they didn’t go for a taller building. they should have asked someone like zaha hadid to design a modern style palace with a shopping mall in it, perhaps with a nice tower on top of it. everyone would love that. just like frankfurt did, zeil galery should be a example for berlin
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Old August 24th, 2011, 06:19 PM   #75
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You've got to be kidding me, A SHOPPING MALL?! In the historical and cultural core of what today is Berlin? Only the most uneducated hillbillies would love that.
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Old August 24th, 2011, 06:25 PM   #76
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He's obviously joking.

But a shopping mall isn't that far fetched, looking at Braunschweig or the initial plans to make the Berlin Palace a commercial one too. Perhaps we would have got a complete reconstruction that way.
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Old August 24th, 2011, 06:41 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin S View Post
It is an interesting argument, although it does seem from the model that there was an original facade there before the 'appendix' was added. That begs the question - do you want to restore the building to how it originally looked or how it looked just prior to being destroyed.

What I mean by 'erasing something from history' though goes further than just demolishing a building. If you see a large patch of grass in the centre of a city, you are likely to ask 'what used to be there?' However, if you see a building that to all appearances looks like it was built in the 18c, to the uninitiated it is going to look as if that is how things always have been.

Having first visited Berlin just two years before the wall came down, I'm a bit surprised that so little of it now remains and yet it shaped the history of the post-war era and its fall heralded the end of the communist era. Maybe the truth is that Berlin wants to forget about its twentieth century history and go back to an era that it feels more comfortable with.
Good points. But one must also not loose site of the fact that in 1945 "so little of it (the city)" remained anyway. The post war/pre wall-coming-down era was one of flux and haphazard building to accomodate basic needs and political agendas. The new Berlin is both an attempt to sober up from the 1945-1990 period and get back on track, even though quite often the "track" has taken the city in some new diretions. Case in point--the new Lehter Bahnhof. It is a fabulous, modern transportation hub taht looks great and fits in its location. Had it been built closer to the Schloss and museum island, it would have been a scar on the city scape (like the 4th wall of the schloss is going to appear).
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Old August 25th, 2011, 12:04 AM   #78
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^

I first went to Berlin in 1987 and I thought that it was a fantastic place - very lively and maybe it is that haphazard nature of the city that is so appealing (as I said, I haven't been there for almost twenty years now so I don't know what I make of it nowadays).

I would understand Berliners wanting to reconstruct the city after the trauma of the war and the wall era but it is that turbulent history that has made the city what it is today. I'm sure that, if I lived in Berlin, I would want to see the Humbolt Forum go ahead and I would have some trepidations about that 'fourth wall'.

Last edited by erbse; August 25th, 2011 at 12:21 AM.
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Old August 25th, 2011, 10:53 AM   #79
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What is the point of that modern-looking side of the rebuilt City Palace and what does the facade of that side represent? Should have made that side's facade like the three other sides instead of just simplifying the facade.
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Old August 25th, 2011, 11:06 AM   #80
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What is the point of that modern-looking side of the rebuilt City Palace and what does the facade of that side represent?
It's to satisfy the modernists who oppose the complete reconstruction
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baroque fassade, berlin, construction field, heart of the city, humboldt lab dahlem, lustgarten, museum island, prussia, reconstruction, stadtschloss, stella

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